Bandai B-Train Shorty

[Keikyu]

More B-trains, looks like 2 209 series trains, and Hankyu 9000 and 8000.

[Blevins18]

ugurusuhobby.web.fc2.com/index_02.html

 

I stumbled upon this guy and his neat B Trains in a box layout. Its pretty inspirational for those of us with limited space. He even adds lights to his models.

[cteno4]

Very nice!

 

Link again the other one seemed to have JNS URL in there as well

 

http://ugurusuhobby.web.fc2.com/index_02.html

 

Jeff

Edited December 20, 2013 by cteno4

[Mr Frosty]

Thats rather neat.

[Blevins18]

I've settled on building a layout just a little bit bigger than that due to space that I have at this time. I'd love to have a trunk like that to make it a little more mobile.

[kvp]

As my first b-train shorty, I just assembled the enoden 305 kit I received a few weeks ago (I've been saving it for the holydays). It was not as easy as a tomytec train collection kit (i had to cut a few things and take apart a few couplers) but once assembled it runs well. There are no serious gaps, but it takes a lot of pushing to get everyting aligned. The black core parts are made of a softer material, so they provide the flexibility needed to align everything, while some pins are painted to be more tight fitting. It's a very nice tram and runs well even on the tightest tomix curves. Compared even to a tomytec portam it's absolutely tiny.

 

I still have the 4 car jnr series 113 in its boxes, so I have to build it too and then I can do a comparision with the full length tomix version.

[cteno4]

Kvp,

 

bandai has sort of 3 stops in each joint piece. first is the part is in there an stops, then there is the push it in and goes 90% in. then with a final push there is usually a little click and the joint lock in tight. ive found the engineering of their connectors to be amazingly good after assembling a dozen or so different trains. when ever i have found a joint that is not tight i have pull it apart (easy todo with some small screw drivers and spugers and some gentle wiggling and prying) and then re-set the joint and its always popped into a tight joint. like you say it takes quite a bit of pressure. ive thought of putting some rubber tubing on a pair of parallel needle nose pliers to set tough joints. but now that i know to really just set them square and push well ive done well fine my huge mits of hands.

 

at first i was sure these would need gluing in the end to last, but ive had one now for a couple of years and its just as tight as it was and its the romance train so all linked up and every time you pick it up all the cars get wracked around and everything looks good and tight. kudos for bandai doing this so well!

 

they have really grown on me!

 

jeff

[tossedman]

they have really grown on me!

 

jeff

 

Yeah, kind of like mould. Hard to get rid of after a while.  :)

[cteno4]

I'm turning into stinky cheese. Mmmmmm Stilton.......

 

Jeff

[dabsan]

I think B-trains are so excellent! I always go to a lot of trouble to try and put the decals on correct, sometimes they have a lot of different options for building (different fronts, roofs, etc..) Reading the diagrams of the trains formations is also very useful.

All in all building them is a good way to learn about Japanese trains. 

I am looking forward to future releases in 2014. I hope they will release the "Seven Star In Kyushu" at some point! Also I wish they would make a model of "The Taiwan High Speed Rail 700T", well I can dream I guess!! :)

[Blevins18]

Does anyone have experience with this Kato power unit for B Train? I'm trying to decide which one to buy but I know most people use Bandai motors and Kato trucks.

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003598

[tossedman]

Yup, we've got a couple. They work great to trams or short trains, just not as much pulling power as the 8 wheels drive Bandais.

[nickhp]

I run up to 10 car trains on level track with a single Kato power chassis.  I add weight to the power car to increase traction.  Anything longer than 10 cars or trying to run up grades I would either go with more than one Kato power chassis or possibly consider using the Bandai chassis. 

 

My concern with the Bandai power chasis is that it seems to deteriorate quickly when operated.  I ran a pair of DD51's with Bandai chassis 3 in both locos and pulling 11 freight cars (Bandai tank cars and a short Kato brake van) and over the course of an hour there was a noticeable drop in speed.  Same thing if I run the power chassis in an EMU. 

 

Cheers

 

Nick

[cteno4]

hmm i wonder if they need a little lubing? ive been meaning to pull one of the bandais apart to see their inner workings and how well lubed they are.

 

one thing ive found with both the bandai trucks and motor chassises are that many of the pop-on side frame tops will rub a bit on the bottom of the chassis and make their turning tight. little shaving off the tops of them and everything swivels much better!

 

fiddling with a little constant lighting circuit and setup for the btrains. hopefully can come up with something simple and cheap. need to find a source of cheap springs for pickup springs, will need a lot of them! either that or i may fiddle with soldering wire directly to the pickups.

 

jeff

[nickhp]

I think the bandai chassis gears are made from self-lubricating engineering plastic.  I might try a tiny dot of oil but most newer mechanisms don't need it because of being made from that slippery plastic material.  It's definitely not the sideframes, the slow down happens even if no sideframes are used (like on my Series 0 shinknsen where you can't see the sideframes anyway).

 

The only issue in using the bandai motor chassis and kato trucks is that the kato trucks pivot is slightly offset between the wheels while the bandai trucks are centered between the wheels.  Also, the bandai sideframes are a bit bigger than the kato version of the same trucks.  Ultimately it comes down to whether this bothers you or not...

 

Cheers

 

Nick

[Keikyu]

 

 

[tossedman]

Hey, tanks for sharing. We've go that upper picture on the way to Canada as we speak.

[Keikyu]

Was that a typo or was the tank pun intended? And the takis are quite nice. Well they are all nice, though I was a little disappointed with the last one, the tank set.

 

It didn't come with the regular chassis, instead you had 2 halves of a chassis that is already built. And it doesn't quite sit tightly in the train, I'm assuming it's a fault with the train because I can't tighten the sides anymore without breaking them and it still sits loosely inside and rattles around.

[cteno4]

yeah the side frames seemed to mainly cause detrainments from not turning well.

 

i was just looking at the nano oil again. keeps sounding very good for stuff like this.

 

i was also just playing with the bandai trucks to see about bringing power into the cars. the pickups are unfortunately not lined up in the center of the chassis arc slots to use the normal springs over the metal tabs. the slots are also very narrow and a 1.5mm spring (thats the width of the metal tabs) would not fit in the slots as they are about 1.5mm wide! 

 

i did try putting some copper tape on the inside edges of the slots for the metal tabs to wipe on but i dont think this is going to work well as getting just the right tension to get them to make decent contact but still turn well will be ultra tricky and probably easily change with time. looking like soldering magnet wire to the tab will be the solution. but this will mean soldering the wires thru the chassis to a little board.

 

im going to try a watch band pin spring and see if i can flatten it around the tab and still make it w/in the slot but i doubt that will fit. very little room in there and any rubbing will really foul up the truck movement.

 

very funny that they seem to have engineered the trucks and the bottom of the chassis to accept the contacts up, but nothing past that! I keep wondering if they were thinking of releasing a lighting kit and it just never materialized.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[tossedman]

Was that a typo or was the tank pun intended? 

Pun intended. Sorry.  :)

[kvp]

I've checked one of mine and it seems to me that the trucks and frames are meant to be used with contact plates, like some modemo cars. This means if you cut small brass strips (in a gull wing shape) and mount them in the channels with small tabs in the center holes locking them into place, then you will have all wheel pickups without soldering. This shape can be cut with a stamp press, so it's more geared towards mass production. Then you can mount any lightboards on top.

 

A more home made version would be 4 brass strips, soldered to a central proto board (pcb board), glued to the center of the frame. On top of this, you can mount any lighting electronics. It's important to only fix the middle end of the strips and not the outer ends, so they can be used as spring contacts. I think i might try this myself, but not on the 113 set, but maybe the joshin type 500 if they ever arrive.

[cteno4]

Yeah , problem will be making the c shaped bits 1.5mm wide that could fit down into the slots. I could easily make a few with some time, but doing any amount would be ALOT of time. They need to be relatively thick as well as the slot so so skinny and ther tip of the tab needs as much surface to contact with as possible and you don't want it to have any room to slip past the edge of the pickup strip and wedge next to it -- there is a bit of play in the trucks. Would have been easy to do if the tabs were about 1-1.5mm taller as a pad going all the way across the top of slot would do it and not needing to fit down into the curved slot! Other idea is making a longer tab, but getting them in there and aligned with the slot well. Not much room in there.

 

It really looks like they has something planned as there are tap holes just to the center of each of the grooves.

 

Thinking for the first 4 car train ill do a test with ill try soldering magnet wire to the tabs. I'f for some reason I do need to pull the trucks off I can just unsolder the wire from the pc board.

 

I did have luck with making the bandai plastics wheel trucks that come with the shorties functional. I snipped off all the attachment tabs that hold them in place non turning. Then put a small bolt thru the chassis and tapped it into the hole in the the of the truck seems to pivot well. Going to do a few up to see how well they run compared to metal wheels. Of course no lighting, but shaves off $3 off per car.

 

Fun to fiddle with, not all done for you like regular train sets!

 

Cheers,

 

Jeff

Edited January 1, 2014 by cteno4

[kvp]

When the cars are on the tracks, the contacts are above the slot by about 0.5-1 mm. So you just have to make strips that cover the rectangular channels and have some free spring movement, so they don't lift up the cars, but firmly press down on the top of the pickup wipers.

 

The idea is to make a drop in lighting unit that has a H shape with the 4 contact strips forming the 4 ends and the middle part the mounting plate and the circuit. This way the ends can lift up under the weight of the car and provide a firm contact to the 4 wipers. Some modemo units use exactly this pickup system.

[nickhp]

2 DD51's powered with Bandai Power Chassis 3's, 10 tank cars and a Kato YO8000 brake van on my T Trak corner module.

 

Edited January 1, 2014 by nickhp

[cteno4]

When the cars are on the tracks, the contacts are above the slot by about 0.5-1 mm. So you just have to make strips that cover the rectangular channels and have some free spring movement, so they don't lift up the cars, but firmly press down on the top of the pickup wipers.

 

The idea is to make a drop in lighting unit that has a H shape with the 4 contact strips forming the 4 ends and the middle part the mounting plate and the circuit. This way the ends can lift up under the weight of the car and provide a firm contact to the 4 wipers. Some modemo units use exactly this pickup system.

 

This is what I had hoped and planned to begin with, but I went looking thru the pile of btrains here at the chassis floors and turns out there are two kinds basically. The small trains like the tama train and trams, and oddly the 485 do have an indented strip over the pickup slots and there is about 1 mm of the pickup tab that could do the simple contact strip across the top of the pickup slot to make contact. But the other kind does not have the indents and the pickup tap is about 1-1.5mm BELOW the top of the pickup slot. Unfortunately these seem to be used on most of the btrains I have, like the 0, 500, 700, n700, and e5 Shinkansens, e231, 381, and the 3000 romance.

 

The more I've looked at these and with the light weight of the shorties I'm really thing it will be a lot simpler, faster and easier to just solder magnet wire to the pickup tab then to contacts on the pc board. If the trucks were later needed to be separated from the chassis would be easy to just unsolder from the board.

 

It's funny as looking at these it does look like they were designed to have some sort of simpler wiper pickup, but the fact that most of the trains appear to have the slot taller from the tab is really odd. Plus bandai makes trucks with pickups built in! But I wonder if it just did not work out well and was abandoned and the chassis bottom beefed up some. These were designed originally as kids toys and it took bandai by surprise adult collectors went crazy for them!

 

It's also going to be tricky to get the light around the internal chassis to light the cars and get to the headlights. But a challenge!

 

Cheers,

 

Jeff