Tram, Trollies and Traction

[Guest ___]

Pick one !!

Edited January 6, 2014 by Shashinka

[Davo Dentetsu]

Because I tended to use the Tyne & Wear Metro and knew that as a light rail system, I consider trams a level lower.  That's just how I classify things.

[bill937ca]

I find the usage tends to be geographically specific except for light rail which  has a specific technical definition. Traction  encompasses all kinds of rolling stock including streetcars, trams, interurbans, steepe cab locomotives and actually refers to the high voltage electrical equipement.  Elevators are also refereed to as traction.

 

Tram tends to be European.  

 

Trolley is used in Pennsylvania.

 

Japanese tend to make less distinction between streetcars, interurbans and  EMUs as many railways ran several different types of  rolling stock like Iyotetsu, or the Fukui Railway.

[Mr Frosty]

Definitely Tram.

Trolley is what you push round the supermarket. :)

[bill937ca]

Most of these words also have now meanings not connected to steel rails.

 

streetcar  = muscle car (versus non-street legal car  i.e. drag strip)

trolley =  gaudy trolley car look alike bus or, as mentioned, a  shopping cart, material cart or luggage cart

tram =  motorized train or aerial cableway

 

Light rail could be taken as a short form of light railway, with a light railway being a narrow gauge railway usually set up for a single purpose: moving materials to/from a mine or passengers on a beach.

 

I find tram is often connected with systems that still use traditional grooved rail, rather than the T rail used in Toronto, Philadelphia and most systems in Japan.

[Guest ___]

Being from Pittsburgh, I sued trolley exclusively until a few years ago, where the Euro-influence had lead to tram being the work of choice.

[Ken Ford]

Depends on the context.

[ToniBabelony]

Depends on the context indeed.

 

E.g., most people tend to call the Enoden a tram line, but it is in fact a railway with special exceptions, such as a long level crossing. In that case I may refer to it as a light-rail or interurban. In another case, in my hometown, we have a tram, but it doesn't have a street-running section... It depends on how the thing is called officially.

[Densha]

Depends on the context indeed.

 

E.g., most people tend to call the Enoden a tram line, but it is in fact a railway with special exceptions, such as a long level crossing. In that case I may refer to it as a light-rail or interurban. In another case, in my hometown, we have a tram, but it doesn't have a street-running section... It depends on how the thing is called officially.

I have seen pictures of an Australian  express train on a street-running section (if I'm right there's even a Japanese prototype example), so anything is possible.

[marknewton]

Denison Street, Rockhampton, Queensland.

 

Cheers,

 

Mark.

[ToniBabelony]

IIRC, in Japan, the longest street running section with the longest full-size trains still running on it, is on the Keihan Keishin line between Hamaootsu sta. and Kamisakaemachi sta. in Kyoto.

 

 

 

---

Other than that, there were sections where full-size express trains ran on streets on these lines:

 

- Kintetsu Nara line in Nara (operations replaced by a tunnel in 1969);

 

- Meitetsu Inuyama line over the Inuyama bridge (closed for road traffic in 2001);

 

- Toukyuu Ooimachi line over the Futagobashi (closed for road traffic in 1966)

[Densha]

@Toni

In my opinion the Keihan counts as light rail, and because we call the light rail "tram" where I live, I see it as a sort of tram rather than a train.

 

The one I originally meant was probably the Meitetsu Inuyama line, as I recognize that one from pictures and videos.

[Guest ___]

Let's not over-complicate this ^_^

[Densha]

True, but I just wanted to say how I looked at it because others also said that different people have different opinions about it. ;)

[ToniBabelony]

@Toni

In my opinion the Keihan counts as light rail, and because we call the light rail "tram" where I live, I see it as a sort of tram rather than a train.

That might be so, but the Keihan has the same ordinance as the former Inuyama bridge and Enoden street-running section, which is a long level crossing. None of the three have the same law that abides for trams in Japan.

 

Another of those in-between cases is the Fukui Electric Railway (Fukuden). Next to a small network, the Fukuden has a street-running section where the trains emerge from heavy-rail to light-rail (or tram) in Fukui city. This lawfully is a tram line as opposed to Enoden (and the Kumamoto Electric Railway Fujisaki line for that matter), which is a「長大踏切」or "long and large level crossing".

 

Enoshima Electric Railway line's long and large level crossing.

 

Keihan Electric Railway, Keishin line's long and large level crossing.

 

Kumamoto Electric Railway, Fujisaki line's long and large level crossing.

 

Nagoya Railway, Inuyama line's former long and large level crossing on the Inuyama bridge.

[Guest Closed Account 1]

Being from Pittsburgh, I sued trolley exclusively until a few years ago, where the Euro-influence had lead to tram being the work of choice.

 

So cable cars such as the Duquesne Incline are now trams?

 

http://www.youtube.com/embed/Lk3DsbE_hgo

[Guest ___]

Webskipped, I'm not referring to the inclines. No One in Pittsburgh ever anywhere wouod refer to the inclines as a cable car. Regardless we have trollies in Pittsburgh. We now refer to the system overall as The T, and have Siemans LRVs but prior to 1982 and up in the 2000's ran PCCs. We still refer tithe LRVs as trollies. 

[brill27mcb]

...and most people don't say "trollies" when they mean "trolleys." Usually they are the folks on Ebay who describe a Pennsylvania Railroad GG1 as a "trollie" and helpfully tell you that its "antenne are intact." 

 

Rich K.

[Guest Closed Account 1]

Webskipped, I'm not referring to the inclines. No One in Pittsburgh ever anywhere wouod refer to the inclines as a cable car. Regardless we have trollies in Pittsburgh. We now refer to the system overall as The T, and have Siemans LRVs but prior to 1982 and up in the 2000's ran PCCs. We still refer tithe LRVs as trollies. 

 

 

 

Just quoting the Incline site. Riding that Incline was always a treat as a kid.

[Densha]

...and most people don't say "trollies" when they mean "trolleys." Usually they are the folks on Ebay who describe a Pennsylvania Railroad GG1 as a "trollie" and helpfully tell you that its "antenne are intact."   

 

Rich K.

Lol. An irregular noun instead of an irregular verb. We didn't learn them in English classes, but it's the first time I came across one.

[Ben]

IIRC, in Japan, the longest street running section with the longest full-size trains still running on it, is on the Keihan Keishin line between Hamaootsu sta. and Kamisakaemachi sta. in Kyoto.

 

This would make a great model... Is there a model of this type of EMU?

 

Most of English is quite irregular, I'm afraid...

[Densha]

nevermind

 

But you can have pic of anime girl with Keihan 800 outfit: http://www.pixiv.net/member_illust.php?mode=medium&illust_id=11000648

[ToniBabelony]

This would make a great model... Is there a model of this type of EMU?

Unfortunately, and surprisingly, not. It would be a model that could have easily been done by GreenMax, since they are always prone to do interesting stuff like this.

[brill27mcb]

Yes, as with Japanese railways (or railways in general), you can never say with certainty that something has "never been done" in the English language. It's a jumbled-up mixture of many other languages, present and past, some of which were jumbled-up themselves. 

 

Rich K. (once paid as a proofreader)

 

...and most people don't say "trollies" when they mean "trolleys." Usually they are the folks on Ebay who describe a Pennsylvania Railroad GG1 as a "trollie" and helpfully tell you that its "antenne are intact."   

 

Rich K.

Lol. An irregular noun instead of an irregular verb. We didn't learn them in English classes, but it's the first time I came across one.

[cteno4]

corollary: theres always a prototype in japan! that's why i love modeling it!

 

but as my mom taught me, always remember to never say never and always...

 

jeff