Kato C11 - How to Improve?

[Sir Madog]

In general, I am quite happy with the quality and detail of Kato´s products. The only exemption is my C11, which had a" hitch in its gitalong" right from the beginning. It took me a while to find out, that the drivers were not properly quartered and that the wheels of the lead truck were out of gauge, causing it to derail in turnouts. The front coupler was also mounted too close to the pilot beam, lifting the truck off the rails in curves. After some tinkering, all of these issues have been resolved and my C11 is now a smooth runner.

 

Compared to Kato´s outstanding D51 498 and C62 2, it is a fairly basic model, looking somewhat bland next to those two models. I´d like to add some detail to it.

 

The following web page show, how to install a coupler release lever and grab irons to the front pilot, this will certainly enhance the looks of the loco.

 

http://translate.google.de/translate?sl=ja&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww5a.biglobe.ne.jp%2F~toyoyasu%2Findex.htm

 

 

I would like to go a step further and install a snow plow and steps to the front pilot, and maybe a smoke stack cap, as can be seen on the C11 operating on the Oigawa line.

 

I am not good at fabricating these parts, so can anyone point me to which commercially made parts I could use and where to get them?

[cteno4]

ulrich,

 

i may have a japanese modeling mag that i think has a super detailing project for the c11, but i will be all in japanese. i think they used a few sets of third party detailing kits. lots of these in japan, small garage businesses that make them for all sorts of detailing, but many dont get much distribution at all unfortunately. some are only sold in one or a handful of hobby shops locally. ill go dig, i remember seeing it recently.

 

i must say i love my pompa c11 even though it has to be hauled around by something else! have wanted to get a running c11 for a while now.

 

thats a great detailing site you found!

 

jeff

[westfalen]

The best way to improve a Kato C11 is to get a Micro Ace one, though you can't beat the Kato price. Hopefully Kato will give the C11 the same upgrade they did for the C62 and D51.

[Sir Madog]

The best way to improve a Kato C11 is to get a Micro Ace one, though you can't beat the Kato price. Hopefully Kato will give the C11 the same upgrade they did for the C62 and D51.

 

MicroAce released their C11 only a week after I had ordered my Kato C11 - sigh. Both models do not match prototype dimensions, the MicroAce C11 rides way too high, and Kato´s is too long. Both require major surgery to remedy this - a task I cannot perform, given my level of skill, tools and patience. With a little detail added and a dab of paint here and there, Kato´s C11 will make a nice and plausible looking loco - with a lot less effort than lowering the MicroAce loco.

 

I agree, Kato should renew their C11 to match the quality and detail of their D51. After all, it is one of the Japanese bread and butter locos, which deserves a total revamp.

[Sir Madog]

One more question:

 

I am not really happy with the bulky look of the Arnold type couplers. I´d like to install MicroTrains couplers, but I am not sure which ones will fit my little C11. Any hint?

[keitaro]

One more question:

 

I am not really happy with the bulky look of the Arnold type couplers. I´d like to install MicroTrains couplers, but I am not sure which ones will fit my little C11. Any hint?

 

I can't answer for the Kato model but i have a quick question.

 

Does the coupler pocket come attached to the body or the 4 wheel piece at the back like on the Ma one?

 

Reason i ask is because i placed the kato plastic knuckles on the MA version.

 

While it works ok because those wheels have alot of bounce to them uncoupling can be a problem.

 

What i did was apply some plastic to reduce the movement ability right above the wheels.

 

I originally had the Micro Trains ones but i had to cut the wire thats prototypically on them completely because as it moves they get caught on points and on bad ballasting spots where it's a bit lumpy.

 

I also found the kato plastic ones were better hold in the pocket as the part in the pocket is thicker meaning the did not sag as much as the MT ones.

 

I hope this is some helpful info in making your desision.

[Sir Madog]

The coupler pocket holding the Arnold coupler is mounted to the rear truck, not the body.There is only very little play, so uncoupling has not been a problem. The front coupler was also mounted to the lead truck, which has a lot of play (and hardly any weight). Each attempt to uncouple with a ramp led to lifting the loco off the track. The new coupler will be body-mounted, for better appearance and also to hold the snow plow.

 

I have no experience with Kato´s knuckle couplers - are they worth looking into?

[keitaro]

fair enough.

 

I usually find the truck mounted to the front is fine but yeah the rear in the ma has a fair bit of play....

 

The kato ones are cheap and in most cases really only suitable to the pockets in freight cars.

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003621

 

Again i only used it in the c11 as the rear part in the pocket was fatter and held it from sagging.

 

I use them in all of my freight cars except a few that won't accept them (tomix flatbeds with the logs on top)

[Sir Madog]

I´ll check the manual to see which one of them will fit.

 

Couplers are e never ending story, I wish all manufacturers would adopt the MicroTrains couplers as standard and get id of the 50* year old Arnold coupler - like they did in the US.

[keitaro]

i prefer the tomix TN  to be honest

[Sir Madog]

After researching the coupler issue, I am still somewhat lost about which coupler to use and how to install them. Kato lists their own knuckle coupler (part # 11-702) or a MT medium shank coupler (part # 11-711), but I am not sure whether this is for the front and the rear coupler.

 

Lost in space!

[Guest Closed Account 1]

ulrich,

 

i may have a japanese modeling mag that i think has a super detailing project for the c11

 

Which one?  I don't get anything out of the US ones because they don't usually model modern era I guess.

 

Maybe I need to get some Japanese mags.

[cteno4]

Nine Scale mag. i found the article ill scan it and email it to those who want to look at it.

 

jeff

[Sir Madog]

That´ll be great, Jeff!

 

Looking forward to it!

[Guest Closed Account 1]

I'd be happy to sample that mag. I cannot find it. HS show sold out since 2003.

 

Maybe new publisher or another magazine good for Japanese model railroad in 9mm?

 

Whats RM Models like? I just reserved a copy.

[Sir Madog]

A long and tedious web search unearthed this treasure:

 

 

This is what I am aiming at...

(and will be happy to come anywhere near it)

[keitaro]

that is some what impressive

[keitaro]

this link has a brief article on the c11 being disassembled may be of some use to you

http://iruchan.blog.so-net.ne.jp/archive/201003-1

[Sir Madog]

Thanks, Keitaro - that page is a big help, as the instructions that come with the loco give no real clue.

[keitaro]

thats ok

 

interesting how it was done btw

 

http://www8.plala.or.jp/genzo-ocean/n_gage/c11_207a.html

 

also check out this AAAAAAAMAZING 

 

http://www8.plala.or.jp/genzo-ocean/n_gage/c10_1.html

[Sir Madog]

I saved all these pictures on my hard disc - just for reference. I wish those models were to be sold ...

 

My eyes are too old, my hands too shakey, and my fingers too big and clumsy to do such an excellent job.

 

A BIG SIGH

[Martijn Meerts]

Wonder if he made all the detail bits, or if there are 'detail-up' sets available .. I'd be interested in said sets =)

[keitaro]

they sell them 78000 yen for the c622

 

email for a quote

 

http://www8.plala.or.jp/genzo-ocean/n_gage/seisaku.html

[Sir Madog]

I am with Martijn on this, I´d rather go for a detail set and try my luck (with some help of a friend of mine, who is a gifted model builder). The C 62 2 looks great, but my favorite is the C11. I am just selling my Kato C62 in favor of another EMU for my layout.

[keitaro]

I am with Martijn on this, I´d rather go for a detail set and try my luck (with some help of a friend of mine, who is a gifted model builder). The C 62 2 looks great, but my favorite is the C11. I am just selling my Kato C62 in favor of another EMU for my layout.

 

fair enough!

 

I can't sell models call me a collector but once i own it broken or not it sits in my cupboard.

 

I recently ordered an e10 i recon that baby would look great on your desktop set