Triple Tracking Dilemma

[VentureForth]

Hi all.  I'm using Tomix track and I'm having trouble getting a double-platform, triple track laid out.  I'd like three curves - 354, 317, and 280mm which all make for nice 37mm spacing.  But for a station, I need 55mm spacing.  How can I spread a 37mm spacing to 55mm using Tomix track?  It's easy to get one with switches using the 541-15/72.5 combo, but not using switches, would like to get another island in with 55mm spacing.  IDK if I'm making any sense.  I can try to throw an image together on railmodeller...

 

Edited December 2, 2023 by VentureForth

[katoftw]

Use C605-10 track pieces 

 

Example https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/image/10205547

 

Come as wooden tie, concrete and wide track versions.

[MeTheSwede]

I'm not quite sure what you're trying to do, but you might find this webpage helpfull:

 

http://www.trainweb.org/tomix/track/snippets.htm

[bill937ca]

At a station you use a 541-15 turnout plus either another 541-15 turnout or a 541-15 curve with a 72.5 straight in the middle to increase the track center to 55.5mm.  

 

I steal a link to one of Rich Kerr's track diagrams.     http://trainweb.org/tomix/track/spacing.jpg

 

Or if you want to run a track around a platform without an turnouts you can use a 541-15 curve then a 72.5 straight and then a 541-15 curve to wind around the edge of the platform.

 

Rich's whole work Tomix Track Design Snippets         http://www.trainweb.org/tomix/track/snippets.htm                                               

Edited December 2, 2023 by bill937ca

[Rod.H]

I messed around with the Tomix layout app to produce this

Is this close to what you're wanting to do? I used a mix of Tomix Wide and normal track, the curves are the elevated type the 22.5 are the transition curve, 45 is the banked and 10 are flat. C541-15 is also flat curves.  The S99 is just there for an alignment check. I also didn't think there would be a mass of spaghetti text. 

One box of this https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10205556 gives you the needed parts for one end, two packs are needed for a full through station. 

I have the track pieces on hand to demo this if needed. 

 

[VentureForth]

Ack. Just spent $45 on Railmodeller. Where can I get the Tomix app?

 

Thanks, Rod!  I totally missed the 605 mm Radius curves!  This did the trick.  Thank you!  And a combo 140 + 70 evens out the straights!

Edited December 5, 2023 by VentureForth

[Rod.H]

9 hours ago, VentureForth said:

Ack. Just spent $45 on Railmodeller. Where can I get the Tomix app?

 

Thanks, Rod!  I totally missed the 605 mm Radius curves!  This did the trick.  Thank you!  And a combo 140 + 70 evens out the straights!

You can buy the Tomix app from the usual Japanese online stores. The app is mostly in Japanese and it works very differently to the standard track planning software. Yes it may have every piece of Tomix track and accessories in its library. Finding them is a chore. I'm fairly certain some of their designed track packs are in there, meaning the Island platform sets, the EMU yard, and Engine maintenance yard should be in there.

 

Looking at your idea, the straight points in the platform don't feel right, replacing two of the curve sections with https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10073994 and https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10073995 a CPR317/280-45 & CPL317/280-45, swapping out a C317 and a C280 might...

 

hmm anyrail says no

 

 

 

[katem]

Let's have a look at this track layout in AnyRail. Input: Triple line with standard 37mm spacing, 90° curve into station with a platform spacing of 55.5mm. Let's use X37 and S18.5 pieces to model the input:

 

Let's add the curves. 280/317/354mm radii were mentioned in the original post so let's use these:

 

C317 does miss the upper right connection point. However, since I used the guide rails, it's clear that it's just about moving the C317 curve 18.5mm upwards, using S18.5 track piece:

 

Looks much better now. Let's do the same to the C354 curve, which needs to be moved 2× 18.5mm upwards:

 

Great, we have now created the layout without any extra S curves 🎉 But what if we wanted to incorporate some curved turnouts as well? Well, the topmost track can remain as it is as the curved turnouts can be used only for the combination of perfectly aligned C280 and C317 curves, as depicted in the manual:

 

However, the outer track is not a perfect C317 curve - it needs to act as two different curves, depending on whether one or two turnouts are used, and AnyRail models it to be somewhere in between. AnyRail has a note about that here in Libraries/Tomix Fine Track section - rotate some curved pieces 2° to fit. In reality, it fits just fine, there's always some room to wiggle in the track connection.

 

Since perfectly aligned C280 and C317 curves are now needed, it is not possible to move one of them a little bit upwards so an S curve will be needed. Two options come up here:

    

 

The first one is straightforward, however the second one seems to have some space for straightening the triple curve. Let's try it. By trial-and-error, I came up with this:

 

C391 curve is rotated 0.6° and S70 were swapped for S72.5, however I would decide if swap or not only during actual building of the layout. S18.5 + S140 can be replaced with S158.5 to make the connection a little stronger, or S140 pieces can be removed.

The outermost curve is now pretty far away from the others, let's try to fix that as well by using rule "37mm + 90° curve of radius Xmm + 37mm is equal to 90° curve of radius (X+37)mm":

 

It's a little complicated but fulfils the input as best as it can without resorting to S curves.

[brill27mcb]

Nice planning exercise, katem! I think it also allows the platforms to start sooner and be longer.

 

Rich K.

 

[VentureForth]

10 hours ago, katem said:

 

Great, we have now created the layout without any extra S curves 🎉

Brilliant!  Thanks!  This is great for eliminating s-curves!  I like all your plans, but I do like not having to resort to pricey curve switches. Perhaps it's just me, but I am not familiar with real life curved switches.  Not saying they don't exist, but they are perhaps quite rare compared to straight/high speed turnouts.

 

Do American companies (Bachmann, Atlas, etc) offer curved switches? 

 

3 hours ago, brill27mcb said:

Nice planning exercise, katem! I think it also allows the platforms to start sooner and be longer.

 

Rich K.

 

 

That's a great point and something I was trying to figure out how to deal with.  The switches really take up a lot of platform space, so this could give me two good 6x280mm platforms.  Yeah, that's overkill, but to know I can...

Edited December 6, 2023 by VentureForth

[Rod.H]

The only ready to run curved turnouts in N, I know about are from Tomix, Peco (code 80 & 55),  & Atlas (code 55) and they're of different radius and lengths to the Tomix offering. Plus you then need to add a motor for remote operation for Peco and Atlas, probably even some local frog-powering electronics as they're of the electro & insulfrog types.

As for real-world usage of curved points/switches/turnouts I can't point to one, though I'd expect to find them in a similar space-constrained location.   

[MeTheSwede]

Sharp 90 degree curved double (or triple) track is something you don't really find in real life, so not having seen any crossovers on that track configuration in real life is just as expected.

 

But then again, the world is big and most things seems to have been constructed somewhere. Want build a realistic station with all kinds of wonderful curved swiches and 22 level juntions including a gently cruved track running across your curved switches? No problem, just model Newcastle Station at the beginning of the last century:

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newcastle_railway_station#/media/File:Newcastle-on-Tyne_Station_from_the_Castle_geograph-3950092-by-Ben-Brooksbank.jpg

[Rod.H]

1 hour ago, MeTheSwede said:

No problem, just model Newcastle Station at the beginning of the last century:

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newcastle_railway_station#/media/File:Newcastle-on-Tyne_Station_from_the_Castle_geograph-3950092-by-Ben-Brooksbank.jpg

Well, that's someone's hand-crafted dream. Wonder if someone's even thought of doing it in OO or even O

[Kamome]

On 12/6/2023 at 12:00 AM, katem said:

Let's have a look at this track layout in AnyRail. Input: Triple line with standard 37mm spacing, 90° curve into station with a platform spacing of 55.5mm. Let's use X37 and S18.5 pieces to model the input:

Do you have a Padawan, Master @katem ?