SL engine drivers and white armbands?

[SL-san]

Can any of the forum members tell me what the white armbands (see attached photo) on the left sleeve of SL engine drivers means?  I also note from other old photos that not all engine drivers wear armbands.  I want to paint my model engineers correctly...so any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

Graeme

 

[SwallowAngel]

Might be completely wrong, but it seems like the white armband was part of an older JNR/JGR uniform code. Note how between the first and second picture the overalls become lighter and generally look more utilitarian. Also note the hat, the second one is wearing a much more ornamental brooch (or whatever that is) on his cap (For better angles of the second pic and the whole video see this link at 12:20). 

At first I suspected that this might be a difference between pre- and post-war JNR, but looking at this pre-war footage at 8:05, we can see the driver wearing no armband. However the uniform does seem to (somewhat) match the first picture (except the armband).

 

I also dug up a couple of photos from my visit to the Kyoto Museum, who have a nice collection of uniforms on display (sorted chronologically from left to right):

 

    

 

Note how none display an armband.

So, my best guess right now is that it's used to denote some sort of special status, though I don't know what that status might be...

 

1 hour ago, SL-san said:

see attached photo

When/Where was that picture taken? My strong suspicion right now is that it may relate to the type of service being run...

 

Mandatory disclaimer: I don't have access to a lot of sources as I don't speak/read Japanese. Anything I said should be taken with a grain of salt...

[bill937ca]

I think an arm band in Japan designates a leader, like a group leader for a tour today. Color has meaning. A black arm band can be an anarchist or nationalist.

 

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RedArmbandOfLeadership

Edited September 26, 2023 by bill937ca

[Beaver]

I certainly agree it's likely some sort of status marker. More straightforward to wear armbands than to have to remember who is what grade of driver. The early JGR had three grades of driver who were qualified for progressively more prestigious and duties and greater responsibilities while also receiving more pay. I assume the general idea persisted even if the details of the ranking system changed. In fact it seems safe to assume modern railways do the same thing, it makes sense from a safety and career progression perspective to only let people already experienced in commuter or local line traffic drive limited expresses or Shinkansen.

 

Maybe started out as an adaptation of the British 'link' system where you had to prove yourself as a light goods/shunter driver before being allowed to drive passenger or heavy freight locomotives, and become accomplished at that before you had a chance to join the elite 'Top Link' who were the only ones allowed to drive expresses.

[SL-san]

15 hours ago, SwallowAngel said:

When/Where was that picture taken? My strong suspicion right now is that it may relate to the type of service being run...

Both pictures were from youtube clips...the one with the armband seems to be from a movie from 1958, the one without from the last days of D51s in Hokkaido in 1950

 

8 hours ago, bill937ca said:

I think an arm band in Japan designates a leader, like a group leader for a tour today. Color has meaning. A black arm band can be an anarchist or nationalist.

 

 

6 hours ago, Beaver said:

I certainly agree it's likely some sort of status marker. More straightforward to wear armbands than to have to remember who is what grade of driver.

 

Thank you all for your replies.

When I travelled on SL Yamaguchi in 2008 both the driver and fireman of C57-1 wore armbands, but as that was a JR West tourist operation I was not sure if the armbands had any significance beyond that.

 

So I am still in a bit of a quandary as to how to paint my model engineers...but I will take a bet each way and put armbands on the drivers in 'special' locomotives and no armbands for the rest!

 

Thank you SwallowAngel, Bill and Dafydd,

Graeme

 

[bill937ca]

機関士腕章  (Kikanshi wanshō) brings up numerous pictures of engineer armbands.  Some are even identified as "Engine Man" in addition to the Kanji. It appears to be the equivalent to epaulettes worn by ship captains and airline crew.

 

https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=568697001&rlz=1C1GCEA_enCA749CA749&sxsrf=AM9HkKm2Sk6-TbLV2TE8LothqzrCuwDdSA:1695779497110&q=機関士腕章&tbm=isch&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjNl6v01smBAxWdkokEHTeFCBUQ0pQJegQIDBAB&biw=1360&bih=619&dpr=1

[SL-san]

6 minutes ago, bill937ca said:

機関士腕章  (Kikanshi wanshō) brings up numerous pictures of engineer armbands.

Thank you Bill...as always you are a mine of good information!

Graeme

[SwallowAngel]

I think the "top link" theory is the most likely one. I just dug around in my copy of "Steam in Colour - Japan" (ISBN 91-7266-050-3) (thanks to the Book thread for this lovely book recommendation btw). Looking on page 7 you can see SL Aki being towed by C62 23. And if you look close enough at the driver side cab, we see the drivers arm sticking out with something white attached to it. Considering that this probably isn't the drivers hand, it's reasonable to assume it's a white armband... 

 

I also found another picture of SL Aki being headed C62 15 (here), with what looks like to be a white armband

 

Additionally, on page 32 of "Steam in Colour: Japan" we can see C57 114 heading the last Steam service from Narita Airport, with the driver seemingly wearing a white armband. So definitely a special occasion...

 

9 hours ago, SL-san said:

on the drivers in 'special' locomotives and no armbands for the rest!

 

Should be appropriate, have fun painting!

 

(Note: I did contemplate posting pics of the pages, but I think that's a teensy weensy bit in a legal grey area)

[SL58654号]

31 minutes ago, SwallowAngel said:

I think the "top link" theory is the most likely one. I just dug around in my copy of "Steam in Colour - Japan" (ISBN 91-7266-050-3) (thanks to the Book thread for this lovely book recommendation btw). Looking on page 7 you can see SL Aki being towed by C62 23. And if you look close enough at the driver side cab, we see the drivers arm sticking out with something white attached to it. Considering that this probably isn't the drivers hand, it's reasonable to assume it's a white armband... 

 

I also found another picture of SL Aki being headed C62 15 (here), with what looks like to be a white armband

 

Additionally, on page 32 of "Steam in Colour: Japan" we can see C57 114 heading the last Steam service from Narita Airport, with the driver seemingly wearing a white armband. So definitely a special occasion...

 

I really must obtain a copy of this. Ironically used copies seem to only ship from far away from Japan. 

[SwallowAngel]

1 hour ago, SL58654号 said:

I really must obtain a copy of this. Ironically used copies seem to only ship from far away from Japan. 

 

I mean the copy referenced here was for the european market, but the rear cover does mention an "original title" implying that there was a japanese version.

Aaand after a bit of googling I did get a couple of results with "蒸氮機閱車 山と溪谷社". Here's a link to an yahoo auction site which sold the japanese version

Edited September 27, 2023 by SwallowAngel

[SL-san]

13 hours ago, SwallowAngel said:

Should be appropriate, have fun painting!

The white armbands are hard enough in N scale but the Kanji is a little too difficult for me 🤣

 

Graeme

[SL-san]

Well here is a closeup of one model driver with arm band.😀

 

[Kamome]

I think some of the JNR era armbands denoted the locomotive types they were allocated to drive. I have seen replica bands on sale but all were white

 

気動車運転士 - Diesel Train driver

機関士 - Steam Engineer

電車運転士 - Electric Train Driver.

 

Stewards on long distance trains wore red I believe and the head stewards wore either a red or blue one but this may have depended on the service.

 

車掌 - Conductor was also red in many cases.

 

作業責任者  保線　Track maintenance supervisor had yellow.

[SL-san]

28 minutes ago, Kamome said:

機関士 - Steam Engineer

A still from a video seems to confirm it!

 

[bill937ca]

It looks' like Kato offers SL Trainman figures with an armband painted on. Items 24-267 and 24-268. Its hard to tell, but hey appear to have white gloves and some  have white bands on one side above the place where the hands would be.

 

https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10079853

 

https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10079854

[SL-san]

22 hours ago, bill937ca said:

It looks' like Kato offers SL Trainman figures with an armband painted on.

It's just such a shame that they have been out of stock for years...Tomytec have a set of Railroad Workers (104) that have a couple of figures that can be painted to substitute.