Tomix Door layout

[Clayton]

Hello 

I have been designing this layout which initially started out as a 4 x 8 foot layout. I at first wanted a quadruple or a triple continuous loop.  Which as it would be labeled the train could pass three or four time around the track without rolling on the same track. Over the period of a few months I reduced this to a double continuous loop. It has a six track yard,  turntable and refueling pit on one side of the divider and three spur tracks on the other side plus an interchange track. 

[VJM]

I was going to suggest needing a double slip instead of crossing-rail 1322 but your design is actually fine without it.

[Clayton]

3 hours ago, VJM said:

I was going to suggest needing a double slip instead of crossing-rail 1322 but your design is actually fine without it.

At first I was looking into the double slip for one reason only. If I was working the spur tracks and taking up the main. But if I went in this direction I will still be blocking one of the spurs. So if anything, I will need to either run the through train very slowly or stop it until the local is off the main.

[katoftw]

Do you want to run one or two trains at once? Looks like only one.

Edited April 30, 2020 by katoftw

[Clayton]

37 minutes ago, katoftw said:

Do you want to run one or two trains at once? Looks like only one.

 

I will be running one roundy round train in either direction and plan to operate two other trains one switching the yard and the other when needed switching the three spur tracks & interchange.

[roadstar_na6]

I would make it like this to be able to run two trains / one in each direction

 

[Clayton]

6 minutes ago, roadstar_na6 said:

I would make it like this to be able to run two trains / one in each direction

 

From your side getting the second train to the yard will be impossible 

[Clayton]

I forgot to mention that this doors dimension is 36" x 80" it will be on a hallow core door blank with 2" foam board glued on top. I have a folding table that I will be placing it on top of. The remainder of the foam board, I will be using segments to center it onto the door and to prevent it from sliding. plus leaving a gap underneath to allow wiring to cross under. 

[cteno4]

Clayton,

 

you can also use a hot knife to make slits in the foam to run the wires in.

 

jeff

[Clayton]

As soon as I can get started on this I am going to harbor freight to pick up one. This was on my list too!

[cteno4]

Harbor freight is great for stuff like that that are only used scarcely so you don’t need an uber expensive model to do something simple with. I have a trim router I got for like $15 20 years back and it’s done gobs of trim routing and now in a friend's beginning shop! My temporary cheapo air compressor (only issue was very loud and add oil) ended up serving like 15 years and lives on a friends vineyard!

 

Do vent the room well as fumes are pretty toxic when hot cutting. One down side on hot cutting for scenery is it’s a little harder to sand to do the final shaping (if you are not layering on plaster cloth on top of the foam or something like that). The melted styrene Spots are much harder than the Foam is. Using a serrated steak knife solves this (and no fumes in your face) but it’s more work!
 

Doors are terrific for a uber rigid base, but a pain in the ass to poke wires thru! Helps to use a straw to poke thru the holes then feed the wires thru that, but if you are keeping connectors on wires it usually means running a snake wire thru to pull the plug thru. That’s why making some wiring troughs in the foam may be a lot easier.

 

jeff

[Clayton]

15 hours ago, cteno4 said:

Harbor freight is great for stuff like that that are only used scarcely so you don’t need an uber expensive model to do something simple with. I have a trim router I got for like $15 20 years back and it’s done gobs of trim routing and now in a friend's beginning shop! My temporary cheapo air compressor (only issue was very loud and add oil) ended up serving like 15 years and lives on a friends vineyard!

 

Do vent the room well as fumes are pretty toxic when hot cutting. One down side on hot cutting for scenery is it’s a little harder to sand to do the final shaping (if you are not layering on plaster cloth on top of the foam or something like that). The melted styrene Spots are much harder than the Foam is. Using a serrated steak knife solves this (and no fumes in your face) but it’s more work!
 

Doors are terrific for a uber rigid base, but a pain in the ass to poke wires thru! Helps to use a straw to poke thru the holes then feed the wires thru that, but if you are keeping connectors on wires it usually means running a snake wire thru to pull the plug thru. That’s why making some wiring troughs in the foam may be a lot easier.

 

jeff

Thanks Jeff for the insight on using the hot knife.  Thanks again for the tip for using a straw to poke wires through the hollow door I was wondering if this would become a issue. 

[Clayton]

For if anyone was wondering. Here is my 4x8 design. It's almost identical in design. This might still be the route to take if I have the room to use.

 

 

Edited May 9, 2020 by MoPac

[Clayton]

I found out lat night that the spare room is 10'.11" x 11.6" so using the 4x8 is looking more of the route to take. I might place one side of the 4 foot section against the wall to allow plenty of room. If needed the layout will be light enough to move to decorate or tend to a possible derailment.

Edited May 8, 2020 by MoPac

[chadbag]

Be careful with track right on the edge.   Trains are delicate when spilling onto the floor.  

[Clayton]

1 hour ago, chadbag said:

Be careful with track right on the edge.   Trains are delicate when spilling onto the floor.  

Thanks for the concern Chad. I will meet the minimum requirements from the edge. Plus I will be adding either a 1x6 or 2x6 framing leveled with the double 2" layered foam board. I will have an panel board or plexiglass rising about 3/4" over the layout to help prevent a future CATastrophe or opps from happening.

Edited May 6, 2020 by MoPac

[chadbag]

plexiglass is a good idea.  Not sure 3/4" is enough (it may well be).  Anything with a little momentum may top 3/4"

 

I have removable plexiglass sections rising a couple inches around mine.  Has saved me a few times.

[gavino200]

On 5/2/2020 at 5:12 AM, MoPac said:

For if anyone was wondering. Here is my 4x8 design. It's almost identical in design. This might still be the route to take if I have the room to use.

 

 

 

That looks like a fun layout. I have two suggestions.

 

1. The two "chicanes" at the bottom. Those are the areas where your clockwise turn immediately connect to an anticlockwise turn. These are maybe the most troublesome track features. You'd be saving yourself from a ton on derailment and uncoupling headaches if you got rid of these. I know it would looks slightly less cool and curvy without them but it will be worth it. 

 

2. This one is less function and more taste. I love your giant yard. However many of the branches are very small. If you made it a one-sided yard and had a simple ladder instead of a double ladder, you'd be able to park much longer trains. The ladder wouldn't look as complex, but being able to switch out more, and longer, trains is a lot of fun. 

 

In any case I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun with this layout. 

[Clayton]

2 hours ago, gavino200 said:

 

 

That looks like a fun layout. I have two suggestions.

 

1. The two "chicanes" at the bottom. Those are the areas where your clockwise turn immediately connect to an anticlockwise turn. These are maybe the most troublesome track features. You'd be saving yourself from a ton on derailment and uncoupling headaches if you got rid of these. I know it would looks slightly less cool and curvy without them but it will be worth it. 

 

2. This one is less function and more taste. I love your giant yard. However many of the branches are very small. If you made it a one-sided yard and had a simple ladder instead of a double ladder, you'd be able to park much longer trains. The ladder wouldn't look as complex, but being able to switch out more, and longer, trains is a lot of fun. 

 

In any case I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun with this layout. 

Hello Gavino sorry I am not sure what you are referring to the "chicanes"/baffels sorry my French is not perfect. The 1322 is a simple crossover and the 1209's will be in the thrown position so trains that are ruining in either the clockwise or counterclockwise will continue on the line.There are no sharp turns on the bottom end. Please take the picture and circle the area of concern and repost it. Because the train if running in either direction will not pass over the same track twice. For example if the train is coming out of the yard on the inside loop in the direction of your choice it will crossover to the outside and run to the top of the yard and then return to the inside before returning to the yard. The three spur tracks are for industries. The track running at a right angle is the interchange track. Its two purposes are to provide room to the lower right spur so that the locomotive can back up the wagon/car into the spur and it will also be used for to add new locomotives and wagons or take them off of the track. Also for example of concern the top and bottom yard ladders are 55 cm long. The two inside ladders are 125cm long. the very bottom track will be for my locomotives to transfer from the turntable/refueling & sand track to the yard. The shortest spur track on the bottom left is 38 cm long which would hold three wagons easily. The other two are 60+ cm long and so twice the amount of cars each.

Edited May 6, 2020 by MoPac

[AhmadKane]

23 minutes ago, MoPac said:

Hello Gavino sorry I am not sure what you are referring to the "chicanes"/baffels sorry my French is not perfect. The 1322 is a simple crossover and the 1209's will be in the thrown position so trains that are ruining in either the clockwise or counterclockwise will continue on the line.There are no sharp turns on the bottom end. Please take the picture and circle the area of concern and repost it. Because the train if running in either direction will not pass over the same track twice. For example if the train is coming out of the yard on the inside loop in the direction of your choice it will crossover to the outside and run to the top of the yard and then return to the inside before returning to the yard. The three spur tracks are for industries. The track running at a right angle is the interchange track. Its two purposes are to provide room to the lower right spur so that the locomotive can back up the wagon/car into the spur and it will also be used for to add new locomotives and wagons or take them off of the track.

 

I think he meant the S curves on the bottom of the plan. I suppose that unless you're having an incredibly speedy long loco like a Shinkansen passing through the S bend, it's fine. But I kinda agree with you @MoPac, it does give more dynamic to the layout and some space for the industrial spot. I also love that what would be perceived as two loops is instead one loop going through two times. It is cool!

 

But I have to agree with Gavino for the second point, and may go further. Some rail yard branches are rather small, and I don't recommend having too much. For the design and size, I don't think it's worth spending so much on turnovers for the yard. Especially with the addition of a turntable, this railyard would be an immense amount spent. I'd instead invest the money from having so much points to have the loop go through an additional time. How? Elevating the rails, similar to a KATO V2 or the tomix equivalent. That way maybe you could model an elevated passenger station as well in addition to the factory, so you can have a large city-like layout and it would look more massive than what a giant rail yard would give you

[gavino200]

5 minutes ago, AhmadKane said:

 

I think he meant the S curves on the bottom of the plan. I suppose that unless you're having an incredibly speedy long loco like a Shinkansen passing through the S bend, it's fine. But I kinda agree with you @MoPac, it does give more dynamic to the layout and some space for the industrial spot. I also love that what would be perceived as two loops is instead one loop going through two times. It is cool!

 

 

 

That's exactly right @AhmadKane. I'm talking about the S-curves - a much better term. They don't seem like they'd be much trouble, and they look great. But trains really don't like them. If @MoPac feels strongly about keeping them, he might want to consider breaking them up by putting a short straight segment between the two opposing curves. That can often solve the problem. I've learned the hard way to avoid S-curves. 

[Clayton]

9 minutes ago, AhmadKane said:

 

I think he meant the S curves on the bottom of the plan. I suppose that unless you're having an incredibly speedy long loco like a Shinkansen passing through the S bend, it's fine. But I kinda agree with you @MoPac, it does give more dynamic to the layout and some space for the industrial spot. I also love that what would be perceived as two loops is instead one loop going through two times. It is cool!

 

But I have to agree with Gavino for the second point, and may go further. Some rail yard branches are rather small, and I don't recommend having too much. For the design and size, I don't think it's worth spending so much on turnovers for the yard. Especially with the addition of a turntable, this railyard would be an immense amount spent. I'd instead invest the money from having so much points to have the loop go through an additional time. How? Elevating the rails, similar to a KATO V2 or the tomix equivalent. That way maybe you could model an elevated passenger station as well in addition to the factory, so you can have a large city-like layout and it would look more massive than what a giant rail yard would give you

Hello Ahmad

The only trains I will be running will be freight trains from the late 60's to the mid 80's no high speed Shinkansen here. I did go back and edit my post on the lengths of the questionable yard ladders. To me an 1.25 meter or 2.5 meter train will be plenty long on this layout. I see your concern on the cost. I am only planing to electrify tow of the three ways and the two 1209's on the mainline. the rest of the switches will be done manually.  This will save on the cost factor. No, I am not planning to elevate the tracks. Although I will have a bridge crossing a creek in the upper right hand side just out of the curve into the straight that parallels the yard. Yes, I will be using Tomix and I will order the tracks online from Japan to save money. No passenger trains allowed.

[Clayton]

42 minutes ago, gavino200 said:

 

That's exactly right @AhmadKane. I'm talking about the S-curves - a much better term. They don't seem like they'd be much trouble, and they look great. But trains really don't like them. If @MoPac feels strongly about keeping them, he might want to consider breaking them up by putting a short straight segment between the two opposing curves. That can often solve the problem. I've learned the hard way to avoid S-curves. 

 With my freight trains I will be running normal speeds up to 70 scale mph on the straights and 40 scale mph in this area. Yes, I do agree running a bullet train at 200+ scale mph would send any train flying off the tracks on those curves.😬

[gavino200]

Just now, MoPac said:

 With my freight trains I will be running normal speeds up to 70 scale mph on the straights and 40 scale mph in this area. Yes, I do agree running a bullet train at 200+ scale mph would send any train flying off the tracks on those curves.😬

 

It also can be a problem for couplers even at low speeds. It something about the wiggle one way followed by a wiggle in the opposite direction. Sometimes slightly troublesome cars, that don't uncouple anywhere else with uncouple on an S-curve. A very short straight segment is enough to solve the problem. Regardless, I you choose not to do that, I hope you have better luck than me and that your cars run with zero problems. 

 

I think it's an awesome layout concept.  I look forward to watching your progress.

[Clayton]

Thanks for the praise! I hope that I won't have any issues either ! Hopefully in June I can start on my build. I will update the status when doing so.🙏