How to Install Kato EMU Couplers on GM and Microace Models?

[Philphil]

Alright guys, stupid question here, I have a couple of Microace and Greenmax EMU sets coming in (soon, hopefully?) and I know they're still equipped with those big, gross hook couplers that originally came with them, so I'd really like to replace those with the EMU couplers Kato makes.

The Microace models are 50000-series sets, and the Greenmax models will be two sets of 30000-series, 9000-series, and one set of 634-series cars (if I can ever find them!)

Since I'm not very versed in Japanese I haven't been able to find any videos or sites showing the process, or even the coupler parts I would need to do the conversions, so any help in this would be appreciated! 

Thanks!

[Ewan.in.gz]

Hi Phil!

 

From my experience of swapping out the couplers on a MicroAce track and catenary inspection set & reading the current catalogues of both MicroAce and GreenMax (I was spending lots of money on train stuff in Honshu last month), both manufacturers have designed their cars to be directly compatible with body-mounted Tomix TN Couplers.

 

Pop the bodies off the cars, and you'll see pairs of circular pips moulded into the side of the baseplate/floor of the cars at either end. The body mounted replacement couplers that both Tomix and MicroAce produce will simply snap into place over the pips. You'll need to remove the Arnold/Rapido coupler and it's pocket too.

 

On my MicroAce model, the coupler pockets were clipped onto the bogies, so there wasn't even a need to chop up any parts of the train.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Ewan!

[Ewan.in.gz]

On the other hand, I spent about an hour trying to unscrew the bogies on the cab cars of my Tomix Tobu 100 Series "Spacia" in order to work out how to remove the Arnold/Rapido couplers.... They wouldn't budge.... It's like they'd been welded on! Or maybe Donkey Kong works on the Tomix assembly line now? I also had the same problem with my new Tomix Track Cleaning Car.... I gave up trying, as I didn't want to ruin the screw head.

[katoftw]

 

[kvp]

2 hours ago, Ewan.in.gz said:

They wouldn't budge.... It's like they'd been welded on!

If you can see small metal plates covering the coupler sockets, then they can be opened at the side clips without removing the bogies. On the other hand, if a train is meant to be TN equipped, then you are meant to cut off the coupler arms from the bogies and snap on the body mounted couplers without removing the bogies.

 

If you do want to keep the bogie mounts, then taking off the metal plates, replacing the couplers and popping the plates back works fine. The bogies could be easily removed with a standard cross head screwdriver just watch which direction you are turning the screws and try to keep the pickup springs from flying off.

[Ewan.in.gz]

2 hours ago, kvp said:

If you can see small metal plates covering the coupler sockets, then they can be opened at the side clips without removing the bogies. On the other hand, if a train is meant to be TN equipped, then you are meant to cut off the coupler arms from the bogies and snap on the body mounted couplers without removing the bogies.

 

If you do want to keep the bogie mounts, then taking off the metal plates, replacing the couplers and popping the plates back works fine. The bogies could be easily removed with a standard cross head screwdriver just watch which direction you are turning the screws and try to keep the pickup springs from flying off.

Kvp,

 

That's right! The Tomix Tobu Spacia is designed ONLY for bogie mounted couplers, it has those small metal plates covering the sockets so you can pop out the Arnold-Rapio coupler. Unfortunately, the info I found online indicated that they took body mount couplers, which is what I ended up buying. When I pulled the body off a cab car, I saw there is no provision at the end cars to simply snap in body mount TN couplers. I have a several packs of Kato's Shibata style bogie mount couplers with the moulded jumpers, but they are designed for different pockets....

 

For the time being, I also decided to leave the track cleaning car as is, I bought the set number 6433, it includes an ED61 locomotive for traction, so I figure that I'll just leave them with factory couplers, since they wouldn't be a normal train anyway!

 

Anyway, I tried to unscrew the bogie with several different sizes of cross head screwdrivers, from small jewellers sizes right up to an IKEA household tool set, but they just wouldn't move, and I did check both clockwise and anti clockwise..... I gave up because I did;t want to break anything. So next time I'm in either Hong Kong or Tokyo I'll have to remember to pick up the recommended bogie mounted TN couplers from the Tomix catalogue.

 

I personally prefer using body mounted couplers if possible, as that is generally the way couplers are mounted in real life, and I have found that with modern body mounted close coupling systems, it also reduces the gaps and huge swinging of gangways on tight model curves.

 

However, I do have several Kato trains that use bogie mounted couplers (Saikyo Line 205 Series, 253 Series N'EX, Hokutosei, Cassiopeia, M250 Super RailCargo) and they look fine to me, but maybe it's because none of them use Arnold-Rapido couplers!

 

Ewan

[disturbman]

On 3/18/2018 at 7:14 AM, Ewan.in.gz said:

From my experience of swapping out the couplers on a MicroAce track and catenary inspection set & reading the current catalogues of both MicroAce and GreenMax (I was spending lots of money on train stuff in Honshu last month), both manufacturers have designed their cars to be directly compatible with body-mounted Tomix TN Couplers.

 
Indeed they are, except for a few Micro Ace passenger cars. I have had clearance issues installing body-mounted TN couplers on a Micro Ace A1578 Express Hakkoda set. The couplers were getting in the way of bogies rotation. I am planning to try bogie-mounted for this set, but usually the installation is pretty straightforward and easy.

[Welshbloke]

I posted a brief guide to fitting the bogie mounted Kato Shibatas a while ago, the same process works on most vehicles with standard Rapidos.

 

I have used this on Tomix and Tomytec units along with GreenMax, aside from needing to bend the clip on mounts on the Tomytecs it was a straight swap and works fine. It didn't work on my sole MicroAce unit though as the coupler pockets were too tight for the Shibatas. They ended up being forced upwards at about 45 degrees.

[Ewan.in.gz]

On ‎2018‎年‎3‎月‎20‎日 at 5:52 AM, Welshbloke said:

I posted a brief guide to fitting the bogie mounted Kato Shibatas a while ago, the same process works on most vehicles with standard Rapidos.

 

I have used this on Tomix and Tomytec units along with GreenMax, aside from needing to bend the clip on mounts on the Tomytecs it was a straight swap and works fine. It didn't work on my sole MicroAce unit though as the coupler pockets were too tight for the Shibatas. They ended up being forced upwards at about 45 degrees.

hmmm.... Interesting....

 

Did you ever try it on a TOMIX Spacia? The coupler pockets appear to be "low profile", with significantly less vertical height than I've see on other Japanese stock. Though they remind me of my old Bachman Amtrak Amfleet cars' coupler pockets....

 

Ewan

[Welshbloke]

Nope, I don't have a Spacia. Only Tomix I have are a few sleeping cars, where the Kato knuckles were a tight fit but did go into the pockets and sit level. These had a clip on cover rather than pushing the coupler in and twisting to lock.

[Philphil]

Thank you so much guys! This was all very helpful!

[JR 500系]

basically, most MA models or Green Max models can be fitted with Tomix couplers, mianly:

 

0336 Black and 0337 Grey for TN tight couplers. 

0373 Grey and 0374 Black for auto-lock couplers. these lock together when push towards each other and in-couple when pulled away from each other 

 

They can mainly be fixed if there are 4 studs; 2 on each side, to hold the body mounted coupler. Apart from that, it is only the color difference to suit the color of the bogies... 

 

They do cost quite a fair bit to fully change a 10-car train, there is a total of 18 couplers, or 3 packs of 6 which costs a total of 4500yen!

[kvp]

54 minutes ago, JR 500系 said:

0336 Black and 0337 Grey for TN tight couplers. 

0373 Grey and 0374 Black for auto-lock couplers. these lock together when push towards each other and in-couple when pulled away from each other 

The 336 and 337 are the Shibata type and the 373 and 374 are the Janney type (also known as american AAR couplers). The Shibata-s are mainly used for more modern EMU-s (1960-ies and up), while the Janney are for locos, freights, dmu-s and some very old or private railway EMU-s. You can get special Shibata variants with electrical connection imitations for some modern emu-s, but those are mostly used on the cab ends only with cables between cars within the set.

 

Also both types and colors are available in a bogie mounted versions that could replace classic rapido couplers with T ends. These are cheap in build yourself kits, but they are not kinematic, just provide a bit smaller gap between the cars. For those MicroAce and Greenmax cars that have no TN mounting studs, these are a cheap and good option. Sometimes you can also mount TN-s with a bit of glue under the car ends, but the bogies could get fouled if they are too close to the end of the car. (for those, the most simple option is using the bogie mounted variants)

[Philphil]

@Ewan.in.gz @Welshbloke @disturbman @kvp @katoftw @JR 500系

Thank you again! Also, have any of you ever tried to change out the front dummy coupler from any of these models? It seems like it might be a bit more difficult because of the skirts on the front of many of these models, and how it would probably have to be a body mounted coupler?

[Philphil]

Nevermind, I managed to answer my own question! 

[JR 500系]

On ‎23‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 5:06 PM, JR 500系 said:

 

 

0336 Black and 0337 Grey for TN tight couplers. 

0373 Grey and 0374 Black for auto-lock couplers. these lock together when push towards each other and in-couple when pulled away from each other 

 

 

My BAD! 

 

I just checked and the items arrived. it seems 0373 is NOT the usual coupler body mount that most trains can fit on! It is slightly narrower in size, hence I cannot be fitted on most conventional models... 

 

0374 however, can be fitted on most models. 0374 is black, and 0375 is the GREY counter part for this item, NOT 0373! 

 

I made a terrible mistake thinking that 0373 is the grey counterpart and ordered 6 packs... only to find out I am so wrong. Doubled checked with the Tomix parts catalogue and realize my deadly mistake and now I have 6 packs of 0373 black which I cannot install... 

 

Bad mistake. 

 

 

[JR 500系]

18 hours ago, Philphil said:

@Ewan.in.gz @Welshbloke @disturbman @kvp @katoftw @JR 500系

Thank you again! Also, have any of you ever tried to change out the front dummy coupler from any of these models? It seems like it might be a bit more difficult because of the skirts on the front of many of these models, and how it would probably have to be a body mounted coupler?

 

I am interested to find out about this too! It seems my Kiha 200 needs to swapped out the front dummy couplers in order to couple them together to other consist...

[katoftw]

@JR500

 

Pretty sure the dummy couplers attach the same as the TN couplers do to the chassis, then with the skirts attach to the coupler mech.

Edited April 29, 2018 by katoftw

[katoftw]

Found this blogs about the Kiha 200s/220s...

 

http://akagamo01.blog52.fc2.com/blog-entry-57.html

http://to-industry.at.webry.info/201308/article_18.html

Edited April 29, 2018 by katoftw

[Philphil]

Ah yes, it looks like that uses the Tomix JC-25 coupler, along with most pieces of rolling stock. I just ordered a bunch of those myself for various Greenmax EMU's so I can form them into 10-car sets. So you could probably use them for most applications with your rolling stock.

3 hours ago, JR 500系 said:

 

I am interested to find out about this too! It seems my Kiha 200 needs to swapped out the front dummy couplers in order to couple them together to other consist...

 

[JR 500系]

9 minutes ago, Philphil said:

Ah yes, it looks like that uses the Tomix JC-25 coupler, along with most pieces of rolling stock. I just ordered a bunch of those myself for various Greenmax EMU's so I can form them into 10-car sets. So you could probably use them for most applications with your rolling stock.

 

 

Yes I have been using the JC25s for quite sometime now, but it was written that in the description that the JC25 is for electrical type; i.e. EMUs, so I was wondering if there is another type for the DMUs like the Kiha 200 for example... 

 

seems like JC25 is the only choice for now for the Kiha 200, even the blog that katoftw mentioned above  shows that the user also used JC25 for his/ her Kiha 220...

[JR 500系]

On ‎29‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 4:13 PM, JR 500系 said:

 

My BAD! 

 

I just checked and the items arrived. it seems 0373 is NOT the usual coupler body mount that most trains can fit on! It is slightly narrower in size, hence I cannot be fitted on most conventional models... 

 

0374 however, can be fitted on most models. 0374 is black, and 0375 is the GREY counter part for this item, NOT 0373! 

 

I made a terrible mistake thinking that 0373 is the grey counterpart and ordered 6 packs... only to find out I am so wrong. Doubled checked with the Tomix parts catalogue and realize my deadly mistake and now I have 6 packs of 0373 black which I cannot install... 

 

Bad mistake. 

 

 

 

Here's adding some pictures of the 0373 and 0374 which I mentioned earlier, since with photos it's easier to see....

 

The 0373 is the one on the top, the 0374 the one at the bottom of the photos... We can clearly see the difference in the size of the coupler set.... 

 

 

[Philphil]

1 hour ago, JR 500系 said:

 

Here's adding some pictures of the 0373 and 0374 which I mentioned earlier, since with photos it's easier to see....

 

The 0373 is the one on the top, the 0374 the one at the bottom of the photos... We can clearly see the difference in the size of the coupler set.... 

 

 

Ah, oh no!

But if you have good enough glue, couldn't you clip off the side pieces and just glue the new coupler boxes onto the bottom of the frame?

I have a couple of those type of Tomix coupler boxes myself, which are too thin from a scrapped train off of Yahoo Auctions. So it may be the only way to use them.

I'll try it later and tell you how it goes!

[chadbag]

When putting the TN couplers on the Greenmax units (Kiha 200 in this case -- probably also my JR 103) I guess you either buy new bogies or just clip off the arnold rapid coupler extension box...

 

Edited July 3, 2018 by chadbag
dumb misspelling made worse by autocorrect

[JR 500系]

7 hours ago, chadbag said:

When putting the TN couplers on the Greenmax units (Kiha 200 in this case -- probably also my JR 103) I guess you either buy new boxes or just clip off the arnold rapid coupler extension box...

 

 

For the Kiha 200/ 220s, you need to remove the coupler portion from it's original mounting (JC25) and install it on the mounting of the Kiha-200/ 220. This is because the Kiha 200/220 has the skirt on its coupler mounting hence one cannot simply change out the coupler to the JC25.... (unless you don't want the skirt though...)