Need some advise on the station building for this 4 platform station

[JanW]

I need your esteemed expert advice!  

 

I have a 4 platform commuter station as shown in below pics. I have the KATO 23-200 station (with the green roofs) which fits nicely to a 2 platform station with 23-100 series platforms. 

However I need somehow passenger acces to the other two platforms.  I see a few options:

1) pretend that the platforms 3 and 4 are accessible by underground passage. Not a very credible excuse.

2) Replace the KATO 23-200 station by 23-122 and -123 (the ones with the red roofs).  These buildings do not fit with the Kato 23-100 platforms and covers. So I would need to buy all new platforms 23-120. An expensive solution. Not sure if tapered platforms are available for this tiled series platform. 

3) Expand the existing 23-200 station with another one. Quite a bit of handy work is needed.  Did any of you ever tried? 

 

Pls note that I struggling to design the station square as well. No need to comment on that!

 

Many thanks

Jan

[kvp]

The trivial solution looks to be to get another overhead station of this type and kitbash a larger station over the tracks with two island platform access stairs. Essentially you'll need to cut off the street stairway side of the new building and glue it to the existing one. The roofs will need some trimming too, but otherwise the two buildings could be combined. (with some reinforcing styrene) Quick copy to show the idea:

 

(the might be better soultions, but this seemed like the cheapest and easiest to make)

Edited January 8, 2018 by kvp

[Pauljag900]

I had this station on one of my earlier layouts and I had the same issues,at the time I did nt have the confidence to kitbash so I took the easy way out with the underground access.😂😂

kvp’ s suggestion of kitbashing two is probably the best way,certainly the cheapest.

good luck mate,👍👍😀

[JanW]

Thanks a lot KVP!  Indeed I think that is the best way of doing it. I'll keep you posted on developments!

[Yavianice]

Maybe you can kitbash a staircase part instead, using KATO 23-234. I believe this staircase fits in the same "slot" in the roof of the platform (though don't quote me on that. I think I might be mistaken with the TOMIX version of the staircase. I do not own the older station version so I do not know for sure. But maybe you can make the roof hole bigger in case it does not fit).

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10017640

 

It might be a bit more easy and elegant solution, besides being cheaper, than buying another of the 23-200 and trying to make it work.

Edited January 8, 2018 by Yavianice

[JanW]

12 hours ago, Yavianice said:

Maybe you can kitbash a staircase part instead, using KATO 23-234. I believe this staircase fits in the same "slot" in the roof of the platform (though don't quote me on that. I think I might be mistaken with the TOMIX version of the staircase. I do not own the older station version so I do not know for sure. But maybe you can make the roof hole bigger in case it does not fit).

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10017640

 

It might be a bit more easy and elegant solution, besides being cheaper, than buying another of the 23-200 and trying to make it work.

Yeah that's an idea as well, Yavianice. A bit more elegant as it avoids this huge overhead box above the tracks. However surprisingly, the 23-200 (1130-1350 Yen) is cheaper than the 23-234 (2070 yen).  I'll sleep over it!

Jan

[Yavianice]

24 minutes ago, JanW said:

Yeah that's an idea as well, Yavianice. A bit more elegant as it avoids this huge overhead box above the tracks. However surprisingly, the 23-200 (1130-1350 Yen) is cheaper than the 23-234 (2070 yen).  I'll sleep over it!

Jan

KATO produces 2 staircases.

 

The other one is this one. http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003178

 

But it's also about the same price as the station. For some reason.

[JanW]

6 hours ago, Yavianice said:

KATO produces 2 staircases.

 

The other one is this one. http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003178

 

But it's also about the same price as the station. For some reason.

Your idea Yavianice triggered my thoughts. How about something like this?

[Kiha66]

I've had this picture saved for ages in my "inspiration folder", as an example modified for a two platform station.

[Kiha66]

Ah, found the source!  A Taiwanese N gauge club it seems.

 

https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/25659529_2170329342980817_1696138836618531907_n.jpg?oh=5fb0e10505bd0180e59e2dfa2f32d870&oe=5AB90F6C

 

https://www.facebook.com/CTTC鐵道模型運轉工作室粉絲團-261545793859191/

 

Edited January 10, 2018 by cteno4

[Kiha66]

Sorry for the image spam, but they also posted a pic of the station under construction, where you can see how the second station was trimmed to fit.

 

  https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/23755130_1568105539919070_3493122664553217863_n.jpg?oh=38d119cc228ab4ea13e39c10f71450b1&oe=5AEBADF2

Edited January 10, 2018 by cteno4

[cteno4]

There is another version of this double kato station buried somewhere deep in the forum as well, I’ll root around.

 

jeff

[JanW]

6 hours ago, Kiha66 said:

Ah, found the source!  A Taiwanese N gauge club it seems.

 

https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/25659529_2170329342980817_1696138836618531907_n.jpg?oh=5fb0e10505bd0180e59e2dfa2f32d870&oe=5AB90F6C

 

https://www.facebook.com/CTTC鐵道模型運轉工作室粉絲團-261545793859191/

 

Whaoo! An amazing layout made by this club. Very inspiring too! Many thanks for digging this up. More food for thoughts..

[Pauljag900]

As I said before,I ve had this station a couple of years ago,I think the advantage of trying a kit bash on this is that it’s fairly cheap and simple in design,which should make it fairly easy to kitbash,as shown on Khia’s  post,plus it won’t have cost a fortune if you mess it up,that said,judging by what you ve done so far,I doubt that will happen👍👍

[nah00]

My sneaky/elegant/lazy solution was just to put the overhead stairway on one of the tapered ends where the station signs would go. I'm sure my miniature passengers are less than thrilled but I'm not sure how I want my station set up yet. 

[HantuBlauLOL]

btw, why did you place a double crossover in the middle of platform?

[JanW]

2 hours ago, HantuBlauLOL said:

btw, why did you place a double crossover in the middle of platform?

Well, I placed it where it is shown on the photo, indeed in between the platforms. Here in the Netherlands it is quite common. E.g. Amsterdam  Central Station has quite a few. Also my hometown Zwolle has one right between the platforms. I suppose that in Japan it is quite rare (I haven't seen any) because the lines have their own tracks and any crossovers are avoided. 
I need it in my lay-out for practical reasons and I thought to put it where trains have least speed. 

[JanW]

In the mean time I put felt below the tracks to further dampen train running noise. It is quite effective!

[HantuBlauLOL]

10 hours ago, JanW said:

Well, I placed it where it is shown on the photo, indeed in between the platforms. Here in the Netherlands it is quite common. E.g. Amsterdam  Central Station has quite a few. Also my hometown Zwolle has one right between the platforms. I suppose that in Japan it is quite rare (I haven't seen any) because the lines have their own tracks and any crossovers are avoided. 
I need it in my lay-out for practical reasons and I thought to put it where trains have least speed. 

 

afaik it's only common in stations with low platforms.. the train could smash the platform itself when switching lane on a high platform station.

[Das Steinkopf]

8 hours ago, JanW said:

Well, I placed it where it is shown on the photo, indeed in between the platforms. Here in the Netherlands it is quite common. E.g. Amsterdam  Central Station has quite a few. Also my hometown Zwolle has one right between the platforms. I suppose that in Japan it is quite rare (I haven't seen any) because the lines have their own tracks and any crossovers are avoided. 
I need it in my lay-out for practical reasons and I thought to put it where trains have least speed. 

 

I do have some concerns as well with where it’s placed, there is a chance that either the front or rear of the coaches will clip the platform due to the body swing as they transition from one track to the other. If you had the throat of the station tracks extended where the crossover was clear of the platforms it would be better, in real life the crossovers would be of a lesser angle as well as longer and the body swing would be a lot less compared to the N scale version.

[JanW]

5 hours ago, Das Steinkopf said:

 

I do have some concerns as well with where it’s placed, there is a chance that either the front or rear of the coaches will clip the platform due to the body swing as they transition from one track to the other. If you had the throat of the station tracks extended where the crossover was clear of the platforms it would be better, in real life the crossovers would be of a lesser angle as well as longer and the body swing would be a lot less compared to the N scale version.

Of course I tested this to see if there are any issues with the body swing. No issues at all. Must admit that I did not try it with the long Shinkansen train. 

[kvp]

So far the only trains that i've seen clipping the platforms in this case were the MAX shinkansens and the Tomix rail cleaning car. On the other hand, from the european ones quite a lot of modern 26m and longer cars would get stuck there (these have long overhanging door sections beyond the bogies and then buffers on the ends).

[JanW]

Just now, kvp said:

So far the only trains that i've seen clipping the platforms in this case were the MAX shinkansens and the Tomix rail cleaning car. On the other hand, from the european ones quite a lot of modern 26m and longer cars would get stuck there (these have long overhanging door sections beyond the bogies and then buffers on the ends).

I suppose you are correct. By the way, even my Tomix rail cleaning car had no issues. 

[cteno4]

We found over the years on the JRM layout that the kato platform ends if put to the full extension as designed with #6 turnouts can bump shinkansens when running at speed thru the divergent route around the platforms. Although they clear when run thru slowly at speed on the divergent route what appears to happen is a little rocking in the cars hitting frogs, blades and train bending thru the S in the siding that can then bump the platform ends and this then seems to sporadically cause a derailment. Pulling the platform ends back about 1 cm got rid of most all of this (there will always be a tiny risk of derailment running thru a point against the blades at high speed). It took a lot of close watching over a long time to suss this out. 

 

Cheers

 

jeff

[Pauljag900]

2 minutes ago, cteno4 said:

We found over the years on the JRM layout that the kato platform ends if put to the full extension as designed with #6 turnouts can bump shinkansens when running at speed thru the divergent route around the platforms. Although they clear when run thru slowly at speed on the divergent route what appears to happen is a little rocking in the cars hitting frogs, blades and train bending thru the S in the siding that can then bump the platform ends and this then seems to sporadically cause a derailment. Pulling the platform ends back about 1 cm got rid of most all of this (there will always be a tiny risk of derailment running thru a point against the blades at high speed). It took a lot of close watching over a long time to suss this out. 

 

Cheers

 

jeff

I ve had that on my viaduct station ,but it was only the nozomi 500.i d got the platforms at max length and it was clipping the platform as it went past,like you said I just moved the platform back about 3/4 inch and it was fine.