Set length

[railsquid]

Here's something I've been wondering for a while... Japan is famously short of space (which I am keenly aware of as I live here) which is why N-gauge is so popular in the first place. But sitting here working out how I can fit 4-car Shinkansens sensibly onto my layout (a hacksaw will be involved), it seems a bit odd that most manufacturers offer mainly 6 car powered consists as basic sets (基本セット) with 3 and 4 car sets mainly restricted to lower-quality (though good value) "beginner" sets. Of which I have a few, but to satisfy my urges I now have a couple of 6/7 car sets as well, which will remain partially unused for the forseeable future. Surely it would make more sense to provide 4 car sets as the standard set size and add-ons (増結セット) in units of 6/4/2 as appropriate?

 

Grumble grumble.

[Sean]

I`ve thought that too.  I have some 6-car sets but I have to shorten them to 4 cars when I put them on the tracks in my layout because building a station platform long enough to hold 6 cars is something Japanese apartments just won`t let you do. 

[kvp]

Maybe it's just my luck, but most high quality Tomix sets are 3 or 4 cars with the option to extend them to 6 or 7 or more. At least this was the case with my 103, 113, e231, etc. bookcase sets. Anyway, the standard layout size should be either 1 table for micros or 1 tatami for normal ones. That would fit a 7-8 car train, meaning with a standard 2 track oval and 4 station tracks, you can fit 32 cars on your floor layout. (or around 24 shinkansen cars) On the other hand, permanent layouts are rare in Japan. The fact that Tomix makes 3-4 car basic sets and 1 or 2 car extension sets let you decide on the train lengths.

[railsquid]

Maybe it's just my luck, but most high quality Tomix sets are 3 or 4 cars with the option to extend them to 6 or 7 or more. At least this was the case with my 103, 113, e231, etc. bookcase sets. Anyway, the standard layout size should be either 1 table for micros or 1 tatami for normal ones. That would fit a 7-8 car train, meaning with a standard 2 track oval and 4 station tracks, you can fit 32 cars on your floor layout. (or around 24 shinkansen cars) On the other hand, permanent layouts are rare in Japan. The fact that Tomix makes 3-4 car basic sets and 1 or 2 car extension sets let you decide on the train lengths.

 

True, flicking through the catalogue Tomix does seem to have a bit more in the way of 3/4 car basic sets, but even then once you get away from the popular items it suddenly goes up to 6. Hmm, and thinking about it, many of the Youtube videos I've seen of Japanese layouts (excluding exhibition layouts etc.) do seem to be temporary floor based ones. But I'd still rather shell out 8 or 9 or 10 thousand yen for a decent 4-car set rather than 30% more for 6 cars, and moreover would be more likely to buy further sets. Surely I can't be the only one.

 

Anyway not that I personally have grounds to complain much, it's more of a mild annoyance (#firstworldproblem), and presumably it's what the market wants...

[Mudkip Orange]

I think there's a consumer psychology element in which the "add on" needs to be cheaper than the "base" set to encourage people being completist.

 

So for instance, if the base Super View Odoriko is 16,200 and the add-on Super View Odoriko is only 7,200, then it sort of makes sense to just buy the whole thing at once. I've already commited to spending 160 bucks so what's another 70.

 

However if the base 4-car set is 12,000 and then the addon is 11,000... well that's double the price! And what am I getting for double the price, a bunch of unpowered cars I probably won't even use half the time.

 

The exception to this rule seems to be Kanto-area JR consists... but even then the manufacturers encourage completist collecting by what cars they include. So for instance the E231 Tokaido/E531 Joban base four-car set includes one double-decker. A four-car consist with a single double-decker lacks the pleasing symmetry of the real thing, it's a bit ungainly looking. To get the second double-decker you need to buy another four cars and at that point you might as well get the 2-car addon set.

 

Same deal with the pre-platform doors Yamanote 231s. First four-car set gets you one six-door SaHa, second four-car set gets you the other six-door SaHa, and at that point why not just get the three-car and be done with it.

[railsquid]

That does indeed make sense from a marketing point of view. Not from railsquid's rational stock acquistion point of view, but OTOH it might mean there are a bunch of suckers who buy these long basic sets, realise they can't use them and sell them on in near mint-condition so railsquid can acquire them for a reasonable price ;)

[kvp]

 

So for instance the E231 Tokaido/E531 Joban base four-car set includes one double-decker. A four-car consist with a single double-decker lacks the pleasing symmetry of the real thing, it's a bit ungainly looking. To get the second double-decker you need to buy another four cars and at that point you might as well get the 2-car addon set.

I think you only checked Kato sets, since the Tomix Tokaido sets have both bilivel cars are in a single 2 car expansion set. Currently i have the basic set without the bilevel cars. So my guess is that you have different strategies from each manufacturer. Microace seems to release full and half sets only, while Tomix has these small 1 car expansion sets and the basic set guide always mentions a few viable consists. The 103 series keihin tohoku high grade set has 4 possible variations from the basic 3 car set to 5, 7 to the full 10 car sets. Each length requires different 1-2 car expansion packs and they also mention which length run on which route and/or schedule (with a map), so actually all of them are prototypical. (illuminated plug in destination boards are included for all of them) The 113 series basic set comes with 4 cars, can be expanded to 5, 6 or 7 cars in 2 different configurations (suburban or express with green class). The not really well known 169 series has routes for the basic 3 car sets and expansion and route tables for the 4, 5 and 6 car sets.

[katoftw]

I see more 4 car starter sets than 6 car starter sets in general.  Sure the 6 car set might be annoying because you dont have the space for them.  But that is more of a layout space issue.  Not a manufacturer issue.  But I understand your grumbles.  We all make compromises on what is available for us to use.

 

I decided to build T-Trak modules and aimed for a platform length of 1.342M, so I could run 8 car shinkansen consists.

 

Allowed me to plan ahead so you could maximize my buying of basic and starter sets.  Kato E231 and E233 sets for example come in 4 car basic and 4 car add on A sets.  So 8 cars etc etc.  Some other cummuters I have range from 2 to 7 car consists.

Edited September 19, 2014 by katoftw

[Guest keio6000]

Taking the opposite view, i've been quite annoyed at the recent trend of Kato in particular to basically issue 4-car sets where years ago the basic set used to be a 6-7 car set typically.  While I appeciate the space issues that those in small flats have, to me 4 cars just looks too short, while 6 cars is about the minimum 'simulated sufficiency' to represent, say, an 11-car yamanote train.and 8 about enough to represent a shnkansen.

 

All that said, however, as one who has far too much invested in dozesns and dozens of n gauge sets, i am haunted by the sneaking susupicion that actually, save for their one big obvious concession to reality, it's actually the b-train-shorty stuff that best simulates reality.  you can get much closer to prototype length and it looks right on pre-packaged n-scale curves. if i had to start over again and if they made them pre-built with lighting, i'd seriously consider going b-train-shorty.

[railsquid]

Much as I'd like to model something approaching full-length trains, it just ain't gonna happen. Even with my planned extension (careful railsquid, get the original bit in place first...). Which is one reason why the "scenario" I came up with involves a fictive location somewhere west of Kobe on the urban/inaka transition zone where 4-car (or fewer) trains (including 4-car Kodamas) are quite plausible. Though I'm happy enough to stretch reality to run whatever I feel like, and let's be honest, no-one's watching anyway ;)

Edited September 20, 2014 by railsquid

[katoftw]

I think that is a pitfall any model railroader can easily fall into.  We all want realism.  But if you dont compromise (due to say cost, space and/or time) a little on our realism, then you'll never fit all that you want in on your layout.

 

Personally I dont mind running a 800 series Shinkansen next to the Cassiopeia, but other hardcore rail modellers would die in shock horror at the thought of it.  I like running beautiful trains, I dont have the 4-6 lines in my layout to run them prototypically.

Edited September 20, 2014 by katoftw