What unlikely releases do you want?

[ED75-775]

More steam would, I admit be awesome. With the return of the Kato Hokkaido D51's and the C12, I'm hoping this means they may indicate a willingness to return to their back-catalog of models and rerun certain models on an occasional basis, potentially as upgraded versions too

 

I myself do have a bit of a wishlist, so here's an updated one:

• 8620: I have a soft spot for 8620s, and it would be nice to see some 'new' variants of this locomotive tooling. By this I refer to things like smoke deflectors (or lack thereof as might be the case), or in the specific guise of locomotives from specific regions (Kyushu, Shikoku, etc.) The fact that the model of 58654 has separable smoke deflectors rather than having them as an integral part of the front deck, suggests that something along these lines might be in the works.
• 9600: No one currently does a modern, up-to-date-detail version of this type and it would be nice to have one.
• C50: Kato has done these in the past as their anniversary model, but it would be nice to have again some 'new' variants.
• C56: Kato has obviously done the Koumi Line versions (2020-1) and recently C56 160 (2028-2) but it would be nice to have again 'new' variants. Kato Store Kyoto has done at least one or two in the past but these are highly expensive.
• C57: Kato has done models of the first (2024) and fourth (2023) production series models, and the fourth only had a short production run of just one year if my hazy memory of my Kato catalogs at home is anything to go by. Again, it'd be nice to have some new regional variants, and a rerun of the fourth-series locomotive wouldn't go amiss, particularly as it goes for silly prices second hand.
• C58: Tomix has obviously just done C58 239 (2009), but it'd be nice to see some JNR-era examples and of course Chichibu Railway's C58 363. I can't see Kato doing this as it would be a whole new tooling to replace the old one.
• C59: Kato has done these in the past (2026-1) but they were again only available for a limited time in 2015 and 2016. Again, regional variants and of course a rerun of the 2026-1 would be welcome, especially as my own C59 needs a new bodyshell and this type is again known for commanding silly prices second hand.
• C60: I don't know why this one hasn't been done, as Kato holds I would say 99% of the tooling to make this from doing the C59. Potentially it's up to 100% if the trailing bogie is the same as that used on the C62, but I'm not expert enough to make that call.
• D61: This is another model that Kato holds most of the tooling for, this time from the D51, with the biggest new parts needed being retooled smokebox doors and cabs for the shorter number plates, and of course that trailing bogie. Admittedly though this type only ran to six engines though so this one might be a hard sell unless you could offer other models utilizing some of the specific parts, i.e. Hokkaido-based 'slug' D51's.
• E10: As @disturbman has mentioned previously here, these command hefty prices second hand because only two manufacturers have attempted them. A true-to-scale model at a reasonable price would be very welcome.

Yes, new RTR C51 and C53 locomotives would be nice, and I'd not say no to a RTR C54 either, but I can't see any mainstream manufacturers looking at them in a hurry. As @Kamome has indicated somewhere, Kato are not keen to tool a new steam locomotive in a hurry, hence the stream of familiar types thus far which are far easier to produce. Perhaps this is also why Tomix aren't in any hurry either. Still, never say never, someone might turn around and surprise us all. Or someone could decide to start up their own model train manufacturer and make these models, though that's an expensive thing to do.

 

Still also wouldn't mind more Kokutetsu-steam-era rolling stock, particularly flat cars! JNR definitely had them, but nobody's attempted them with the exception of Kato's late-steam era KoKi 5500 container flats which are too modern for my tastes.

 

Alastair

[disturbman]

19 hours ago, ED75-775 said:

E10: As @disturbman has mentioned previously here, these command hefty prices second hand because only two manufacturers have attempted them. A true-to-scale model at a reasonable price would be very welcome.

 
Wasn't the E10 one of the rare MA steam loco to scale?

[ED75-775]

@disturbman they are, thanks for reminding me, but reasonably priced they are not! Some of the details are also a little coarse, though perhaps I’ve been spoilt with the detail on Kato and Tomix models.

[Kamome]

As there was only 5 E10s built, I would doubt Kato or Tomix would decide to produce something so niche, definitely MAs territory. Same with something like the DD50. Great looking loco/s but as only 6 were made, it has limited mass market appeal. It does seem that Kato and Tomix play it safe these days with either SL joyful trains or D51s that were used nationally and can produce a few different detail options for various areas of interest. MA still like to throw out a few curve balls and they seem to have a modellers mind set to some extent. 

 

When I spoke with the head of Kato products, he didn’t really respond well to suggestion of an SL, so they either don’t produce/sell enough to warrant the CAD work and mould set up needed or there’s limited market ROI. Could also be playing it safe currently so that their revenue stream enables them to continue construction of their new factory and visitors centre. We are still waiting for a 9600 and considering there were over 700 made, seems worthwhile. My 2013 JNR 10 series Taisetsu is still without a Hokkaido C58.

 

I honestly sometimes wonder what the domestic market want compared to the common ideas shared on this forum. I’m sure there are many wanting the newest modern stock and perhaps most of the steam connoisseurs moved to HO brass.  

 

MA and GM are thankfully making stuff that no one else is so hats off to them for giving us more choice.

[SwallowAngel]

It certainly would be nice knowing the sales stats for SL models, I certainly would be interested 😅

 

As much as I enjoy the detail on KATO's and TOMIX's SL models, it definetly is quite apparent that they dislike taking risks in that department. A shame really IMO, since the most interesting locos are the more obscure ones (I still badly want JGR Streamliners). While the SL models are very nice, I always feel like the "popular" locos are heavily over represented. A couple more "odd" variants of locos (C57 4th type; D51 slugs, etc) alongside more "medium"-sized classes would go a long way in spicing a collection up while still having decent mass market appeal. I always found it quite jarring that there is a chronic lack of medium- and smaller-sized passenger locos. Unless you're willing to pay scalper prices, the only medium-sized passenger SLs available are Tomix's C55 and C58 alongside Katos C57. A bit more variety in terms of classes is much needed...

 

I wish there were more (viable) RTR SL manufacturers. The variety MA offered with their SL models was quite impressive though their details are quite lacking compared to Kato and Tomix ofc...

[SL58654号]

44 minutes ago, SwallowAngel said:

It certainly would be nice knowing the sales stats for SL models, I certainly would be interested 😅

 

As much as I enjoy the detail on KATO's and TOMIX's SL models, it definetly is quite apparent that they dislike taking risks in that department. A shame really IMO, since the most interesting locos are the more obscure ones (I still badly want JGR Streamliners). While the SL models are very nice, I always feel like the "popular" locos are heavily over represented. A couple more "odd" variants of locos (C57 4th type; D51 slugs, etc) alongside more "medium"-sized classes would go a long way in spicing a collection up while still having decent mass market appeal. I always found it quite jarring that there is a chronic lack of medium- and smaller-sized passenger locos. Unless you're willing to pay scalper prices, the only medium-sized passenger SLs available are Tomix's C55 and C58 alongside Katos C57. A bit more variety in terms of classes is much needed...

 

I wish there were more (viable) RTR SL manufacturers. The variety MA offered with their SL models was quite impressive though their details are quite lacking compared to Kato and Tomix ofc...

I think only about ten to twenty or so years ago we could have only dreamed of such detailed ready-to-run SLs by KATO and the like mass marketed. I also don't really see why their risks in that regard of new tooling (especially in the SL Hitoyoshi's case) didn't pay off. 
And as @ED75-775 said a RTR C53 would be nice, and one still exists. If KATO will make relatively obscure new-tooled locomotives like the EF55 (only three were ever built, one survives) then why not a C53 which has such a fascinating Kokutetsu steam-era appeal? 

 

A REAL pipe dream in my thoughts would be more RTR Meiji-era steam locos and rolling stock. But as others said here that's more up the street of connoisseur brass collectors, I suppose.    

Edited Monday at 11:22 AM by SL58654号

[disturbman]

1 hour ago, SL58654号 said:

If KATO will make relatively obscure new-tooled locomotives like the EF55 (only three were ever built, one survives) then why not a C53 which has such a fascinating Kokutetsu steam-era appeal? 

I don't think you can call the EF55 "obscure", it's a unique locomotive with a very appealing and unique design. The MA model always sold for good money on the second hand market until the Kato one was announced. I don't know why MA never decide to make it again.

If I were @ED75-775, I would definitely bite the bullet on one of the more recent E10 models if he ever wants one. I'm not sure anyone will make it again.

[SL58654号]

True, it was used on excursions services with the Banetsu Monogatari carriages to my knowledge. It is a good-looking EL, hence why I like it too. And it even has the nickname "moomin" after the characters from Finland.

 

But why would the C53 be obscure? Too old and too long since it last ran? 

[ED75-775]

A little applied Google-Fu confirms that the C53 class only ran in service from 1928 to 1950, so they would be just out of living memory for most Japanese enthusiasts today. Admittedly C53 45 was restored to such a state at Takatori Works in 1950 that it was able to run special trips for two days between Suita and Takatori in September 1960, but that was strictly a one-off occasion and it wouldn’t run again under its own steam after that, not even when it was transferred to Umekoji museum in 1972.

 

By contrast, Kato and Tomix offer locomotive types that ran until the end of steam in the 1970s, or relatively close to. I’d say that would be a deliberate choice, as these would be the locomotives people remember, and therefore would be more likely to sell in the manufacturer’s opinion. Micro Ace seems to be the only one willing to take any risks and do oddball locomotives (case in point: E10 tanks and 9550 Mallets) although they’re not always true to scale, and as both I and @SwallowAngel have noted, some of the details aren’t up to the Kato/Tomix standard either. But if one wants certain models, then you’ve really got to suck it up and accept them for what they are.

 

Of course, the other alternative is to try and produce your own models through a new company, though I’d imagine that would be prohibitive on cost grounds, and it would be a huge risk potentially offering types that may not sell very well in any market. Never say never though, I’d be open to being proven wrong.

[SwallowAngel]

Like @disturbman pointed out, I would like to add that SL Hitoyoshi isn‘t exactly an „obscure“ locomotive. So it being a success was somewhat guaranteed. Kato also only had to make relatively light changes to the tooling AFAIK, since they already had an 8620 in their catalogue.

 

The problem with the C53‘s is that (in essence) they were short lived experimental locomotives. Their „prime“ operating period was in the late 20‘s and 30‘s pulling express trains.

If we went by „KATO-release-convention“ they would release a loco + a fitting set of cars (+ maybe an add-on set). All in all, for a C53 release, they would at the very least need:

• A new Loco tooling including a chassis
• A new set of early Showa-era cars, which could possibly need some new toolings

Quite a bit of work for a train and a set that last ran 80-70 years ago…

 

One also needs to remember that Japan (and the rest of the world for that matter) is in a bit of a economic slump, so „investing“ resources in a project that might only cater to „die-hard“ SL fans is a risky choice. A more popular loco and set (that requires less tooling, if any at all) is much safer in that regard. 

 

Additionally, as @ED75-775 just pointed out, anything in living memory will inevitably be more popular and „desired“ in the market (see all the Joyful SL trains). 

 

As much as I want more obscure stuff (STREAMLINERS!!!!), I doubt we‘ll see that anytime soon 🫠

[Kamome]

4 hours ago, SL58654号 said:

A REAL pipe dream in my thoughts would be more RTR Meiji-era steam locos and rolling stock.

Is it only the JGR Class 150 from Microace? (A0273) These seem to command a high price especially if they include the additional coaches (A0274)

 

Era 1 locos and stock in 00 gauge have sold pretty well with Robert Stephenson’s Locomotion also on the cards. The Hornby Stephenson’s Rocket was a nice model as well as their Todd, Kitson and Laird, Lion.  Just a shame they cut corners with some semi fictional livestock wagons and coal hoppers, but nothing in N. 

 

The Dapol N scale terrier was an awesome achievement in terms of size, sadly plagued by Dapol’s usual QC challenges. My first one was a dud and replaced, now have 2, one of which stopped running out of warranty.

 

As regards SL Hitoyoshi, let’s not forget that Kato held 3 consecutive diorama exhibitions in Kyushu as well as Tokyo so having something with local appeal.  As @SwallowAngel pointed out, they already produced a Tohoku 8620 so most people assumed the Hitoyoshi would get a run. These sets are easy to come by in most local Kyushu based stores who probably over ordered so they certainly didn’t sell out. 

 

Definitely Japans economy is taking a bit of a hit, despite @ED75-775best efforts to revive it and there seems to be a lot of product still sat on shelves compared to a few years ago. As example Tomix HO used to sell out within a few days/weeks but currently there seems to be a lot of product hanging around from 6 months ago with a few minor exceptions.  

Edited Monday at 03:46 PM by Kamome

[SL58654号]

1 hour ago, ED75-775 said:

By contrast, Kato and Tomix offer locomotive types that ran until the end of steam in the 1970s, or relatively close to. I’d say that would be a deliberate choice, as these would be the locomotives people remember, and therefore would be more likely to sell in the manufacturer’s opinion.

IF that's the case, then I wonder if more early imported Electric locos that lasted well up until the end of the steam period would make the cut for ready to run production?
I would desire a few more Kokutetsu EL to complement the ED19 that KATO have made thus far.

[SL58654号]

Finally, back to the subject of steam, what would the odds be of a green 58654 and SL Aso Boy being made? They have the tooling for that, at least for the period that it wore its cast iron chimney, and not the ugly mock-diamond stack.