Rolling stock choosing questions

[Wooster]

Hello!

This is my first post on the forum (except in itroduction tread ), and in Japanese railway modeling I'm also beginner, so please be lenient, maybe my questions seem simple.

I have a plan to build a layout, and I started to buy some things for it. To avoid implausible mixture of rolling stock I chose prototype - the Tokaido line, a part of it somewhere in a mountainous area, although I do not plan to make an exact copy of a plot, just a common theme, with the double track section of the main line and a secondary line (not electrified), joining to main path on the station. The traffic on the layout seems to be the next - passenger express trains (don't stop on station), and a local EMU, passing freight traffic and freight from main line to secondary, passenger KiHa on the secondary line.

The period on layout is around 1980's

So, basing on Tokaido line rolling stock, I had already bought KATO 113 series EMU (4-cars set) in Shonan livery for local passenger on main line.

With the next I have a questions:

For freight on secondary line I think to buy a DE-10 diesel. Actually, I should say I didn't find DE10 in JR East rolling stock roster here http://trainspo.com/operator/932/ , only DE11, but I don't know, probably this is modern data, not for 80's. But for me DE11 is OK too. Both DE10/11 produced by Tomix, Kato and MicroAce. For Tomix I found it is poor runner, due to it worm spring gear. So, which DE10 (DE11) - KATO or MA have smooth ride and steady, slow speed?

Diesels DE10 (DE11) for places like Kanagawa prefecture was in warm or cold specification?

Thank you for your answer

[miyakoji]

Good questions Wooster, I often think the same things when looking at various models. The Japanese Wikipedia page describes the warm weather DE10 as the "general type" and says that it was used throughout Kanto, Chukyo (Chubu, the Nagoya area), Kinki, and Kyushu. There were A and B cold weather types, type A being used in Hokkaido, Tohoku, and on the Takayama Main Line, and type B being used in the San'in Region, on the Chuo Main Line, and on the Ban'etsu East Line.

 

As for a Tokaido Line setting in the '80s, I think a warm-weather DE10 is a good choice. JR East has or had DE10s, certainly in the '80s, and keep in mind that up to April 1987, JR East was still Japanese National Railways. Also, JR Freight operates the locomotive in the area.

 

As for which DE10 model is best, others will have to answer, I don't have one.

[Densha]

Maybe this thread I started about the comparison of DE10 and DD51 models may help you:

http://www.jnsforum.com/community/topic/6626-de10-dd51/

Eventually I didn't buy a DE10 yet, but I think I will buy the Kato DE10 warm region (I'm modelling Shikoku so it's warm region, I assume). I read somewhere that you could say everything north of Tokyo is 'cold region' and south of Tokyo 'warm region' and that in Tokyo itself both types are used. Only Kato has produced a warm region JNR DE10 model so far I know.

But even though there are some warm region DE10's that don't have a snow shovel (or whatever it is used for), most still do so far as I know. Kato's model didn't attach such a shovel to its warm region model, but I think that you are able to get it as a spare part.

 

Tomix only has recently (a few years back already) revised their DE10 models but for the '80s there's only a JNR cold region model available (Tomix 2222). There's a warm region old-JRF-color DE10 available in the Tomix 92404 set, but I don't know when they started using that livery. The new JRF livery version is surely not correct for the '80s (Tomix 2223).

 

I only got all this information from the abovementioned thread and other websites, so please correct me if I'm wrong.

[bill937ca]

If you are modeling the 1980s April 1, 1987 is an important date to consider.  That is the date when Japanese National Railways was privatized and then split into seven companies including JR East, JR Tokai and JR Freight. Less than carload freight also ended in the 1980s although I can't find the exact date.

[Wooster]

Thank you for an answers! After reading all links above, seems like the Kato warm region 7011-2 will be better choice. Also learned that Tomix new producted DE10 became better runner, but Kato much more compartible for DCC. I'm not sure if I will need DCC on my layout at all, but this can be interesting to try one day

Edited March 18, 2013 by Wooster

[bill937ca]

There is more info on freight operations in this old post.

 

http://www.jnsforum.com/community/topic/367-freight-operations/?p=2784

[Wooster]

There is more info on freight operations in this old post.

 

http://www.jnsforum.com/community/topic/367-freight-operations/?p=2784

Tnank you for this link, becouse after DE10 definition logically follows the question which type of freight cars will it haul on layout :)

[keitaro]

wooster the new tomix de 10 runs perfectly with a flywheel motor.

 

The one you reffer to is the older model.

 

I can`t say for the kato model but if it`s anything like there dd51 both are really great.

 

I guess it`s different plates and slight variations between the series`s they models

[Wooster]

wooster the new tomix de 10 runs perfectly with a flywheel motor.

 

The one you reffer to is the older model.

Yes, I learned this about new Tomix, so the last point was "DCC friendly" options in Kato's loco

[keitaro]

well that really comes down to if you are going to do dcc. (It can be expensive)

 

I don`t think the forum can tell you to do so or not.

 

In my opinion tomix has much better couplers than Kato,

 

I plan to do dcc in the future but i am fine to work my way through it the manual way.

[Wooster]

well that really comes down to if you are going to do dcc. (It can be expensive)

 

I don`t think the forum can tell you to do so or not.

 

In my opinion tomix has much better couplers than Kato,

 

I plan to do dcc in the future but i am fine to work my way through it the manual way.

 Yes, certainly, in the end you have to make the choice by yourself - so I ordered Kato :) But from this short tread I also recieved many info I'll need for future steps, so I spent 2 hours reading and saving sites, links and fotos, many thanks for all!

Couplers type is open question for me, I didn't like arnold type, and taking into account presumed actions on layout with permanent train composition (except the rarely freight cars exchange between main and secondary lines), i will try to find couplers more close to real ones. I had already ordered few variations of couplers, different tracks (tomix, peco flex code 80 and 55 concrete and wooden ties), different layout materials for scenery, some structures (catenary poles and so on). I want to try, to feel, to see how look and work in reality different materials of different manufacturers for the layout and rolling stock and then do my choice. All this materials in little quantityes not so expencive as locos, can buy this and that :)

[Densha]

Kato has their own knuckle coupler as does Tomix with the TN coupler. Tomix also has a scharfenberg coupler TN version mainly for passenger multiple units, and Kato also has some sort of scharfenberg.

I think most Tomix, Tomytec, MicroAce and Greenmax (and maybe Kawai/Popondetta freight car) models accept TN couplers, but only Kato supports its own coupler.

Personally I like the looks of the TN coupler better and it can be used with much more models than Kato ones. I think converting the DE10 or other loco to TN coupler may be the best option for the best looks and compatibility but I don't know how difficult that is. You could also consider having one type of each coupler on either side of the loco or have one freight car that has a Kato knuckle coupler on one side and a TN coupler on the other. I'm sure it's all possible somehow but it may take a lot of time and stress.

[Wooster]

Avoid to post the new topic - what can be done with KATO 10-808 113 series, I mean the light improvement, such as shortened the gap between the wagons, some decales, repainted conditioner box on the roof...? I'm tried to use search here on forum, and google also, but have no results in past 2 days :( Meanwhile I know, it is a common points - lightly modernize rolling stock. I found different articles - but not about 113 series.

[Densha]

I think Kato's own page already covers a few of your questions: http://www.katomodels.com/product/nmi/113kei_e.shtml (lightning kits and couplers)