KiHa 40/47/48 still common today?

[Sacto1985]

One thing I've noticed on many videos of passenger railroads in Japan on non-electrified lines is the fact that the KiHa 40/47/48 series DMU's built for JNR from 1978 to 1982 are still widely operated today in Japan.

 

I wonder why, especially given all the many newer KiHa DMU models introduced since the KiHa 40/47/48 came into service. Is it because they're still very reliable in service and well-liked by train crews and passengers? Did many of them get life-extension rebuilds with upgraded interiors, traction motors and diesel prime movers? Or was it the sheer number built (888 units) made it cheaper to just upgrade them instead of buying newer replacement models?

[miyakoji]

Good question.  None of the JR-era DMUs have been really large scale production, have they?  I guess the KIHA40s still fit the bill.  I'm not aware of any of them getting really significant refurbishment, although some have been converted to special trains like JRE's (older) resort trains, KIHA48 700 and 1700 subseries, or JRW's KIHA47 700 subseries which they use down in Hiroshima and Yamaguchi.  Also keep in mind that most of Japan's diesels, including to my knowledge all DMUs, are referred to as hydraulic drive, with torque converters.  The only diesel-electric I can think of is the DF200 locomotive.

 

I've often wondered if the JRs would like to electrify even their least busy lines, and didn't update their DMUs because of that, but I suppose not, it seems like there's very little electrification going on, and I've never read about any large scale plan to do so.

[bikkuri bahn]

Yes, there were so many kiha 40 and variants built, they look to soldier on for a few more years, if not decades. The whole kiha 40 story is interesting (alot of politics involved), but that's a story for another day.  They are a solid (if originally woefully underpowered and not the best comfortwise for passengers) design, like all JNR types.  The problem with diesel types is that the quantities required don't justify the expense of building new designs ( I think unit cost is higher than EMUs), unless the market is a specific money maker (like lines with heavy tourist traffic).  JR East seems to have the most proactive replacement program, but that's them- they have the money to do it.  If a line has the passenger volume, it's likely better to electrify, with higher performance (by far) electric units.

 

The Kiha 40's have been modified, mainly with more powerful engines (JR Tokai uses Cummins engines) as well as auxiliary generators for aircon.  The Sassho line saw Kiha 40's converted for commuter use, with all longitudinal seating.

[keitaro]

I agree with Bikkuri I have also been traveling in a few variants of late.

 

Originally there was the will to electrify many lines but this never happened due to many financial issues in jpn.

 

Fact also is a lot of the lines are not turning a positive revenue and therefore are unlikely going to be electrified or give Jr a reason to renew them.

 

Dmu definately do cost more to produce.

[Davo Dentetsu]

I also wonder if the few locals who do rely on them tend to be quite content in what they have and are not as vocal in criticism of the stock (compared to somewhere like the larger more commercially viable lines).

[Sacto1985]

If I remember, correctly, the KiHa 40 series were built because the older KiHa 10 were probably inadequate to deal with the growth in rail traffic in post-war Japan--not to mention (probably) the KiHa 10 didn't work well on any rail lines that had substantial snowfalls in winter. I've read among the earliest KiHa 40 models built were those designed for operating in snowy conditions of Hokkaido.

 

I still personally think because so many KiHa 40/47/48's were built (888 units is a lot), it was just cheaper to do rebuild upgrades, often using salvaged parts from retired units. I believe most KiHa 40/47/48's still in service now feature rebuilt interiors, upgraded engines, and definitely air conditioning. By the way, it's correct that JR East had a more aggressive DMU replacement program--JR East has a fleet of 247 KiHa 100/110 series to operate on non-electrified JR East lines.

 

In the end, the still-common usage of the KiHa 40/47/48 series is akin to the still-common usage of the 113/115 Series EMU's--you still see rebuilt 113/115 Series EMU's in commuter service all over Japan (rebuilt 113/115 Series trainsets are still commonly used on commuter service on the Sanyō Main Line west of Okayama from the YouTube videos I've seen).

[miyakoji]

Bikkuri, that's interesting I did not know that the Cummins engines were not original, nor that JRH had converted some of theirs to all longitudinal seating.

[angusmclean]

Bikkuri, that's interesting I did not know that the Cummins engines were not original, nor that JRH had converted some of theirs to all longitudinal seating.

 

Regarding the original engines for the dmus and those for the diesel hydraulics, does anyone have a link to a site which gives details or history of these?

 

Angus

[miyakoji]

Angus, sorry I don't see any English info anywhere, but the original engines were DMF15HSA types according to Wikipedia.  Here's the Japanese wiki page on the engine: http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/DMF15%E7%B3%BB%E3%82%A8%E3%83%B3%E3%82%B8%E3%83%B3　.  It has a chart at the bottom, you can feed the row labels to google translate to get an idea of what it says.  Basically it looks like the KIHA40 engines were 14.7L and made 220hp at 2000 rpm.  Compression ratio of 14:1, doesn't seem terribly high for a diesel, probably has contributed to their longevity although they are turbocharged.

 

The transmissions are a bit more difficult.  The KIHA40s have the DW10, googling hasn't turned up anything other than the wikipedia page on the KIHA40 itself.  Here's the wiki page on diesel train drive systems, it shows a DW22 transmission, not sure what DMU or loco that's in: http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%B0%97%E5%8B%95%E8%BB%8A%E3%83%BB%E3%83%87%E3%82%A3%E3%83%BC%E3%82%BC%E3%83%AB%E6%A9%9F%E9%96%A2%E8%BB%8A%E3%81%AE%E5%8B%95%E5%8A%9B%E4%BC%9D%E9%81%94%E6%96%B9%E5%BC%8F#.E6.B6.B2.E4.BD.93.E5.BC.8F.EF.BC.88.E6.B5.81.E4.BD.93.E5.BC.8F.EF.BC.89

[keitaro]

Sac to some kiha units still don't have a/c

 

I went on the dmu to tuswano from shin-yamaguchi all I got was fans blowing in a loop.

 

Was damn hot in there .

 

There are so many interior changes to these units.

 

I have been in all longitudinal some with the regular 2 seat vertical and half half's.

 

The one to tsuwano the other day had the cab side seats in both cars ripped out for a ticket and change machine. That was the drivers door and he pushed all the way down to the first set of doors when at the station.

Was poorly done too you could still see the seat mounts.

[Sacto1985]

Sac to some kiha units still don't have a/c

 

I went on the dmu to tuswano from shin-yamaguchi all I got was fans blowing in a loop.

 

Was damn hot in there .

 

I remember vividly riding a KiHa 40 (?) on the JNR Nara Line (this was before the privatization of JNR and full implementation of line electrification) from Kyoto Station to Nara Station in June 1985--it was HOT in the train even with the open windows and roof fans. Small wonder why I rode the Kintetsu train from Nara back to Kyoto--the Kintetsu train had air conditioning, nice seats and even an attendant handing out wet towels!  

[Densha]

I remember vividly riding a KiHa 40 (?) on the JNR Nara Line (this was before the privatization of JNR and full implementation of line electrification) from Kyoto Station to Nara Station in June 1985--it was HOT in the train even with the open windows and roof fans. Small wonder why I rode the Kintetsu train from Nara back to Kyoto--the Kintetsu train had air conditioning, nice seats and even an attendant handing out wet towels!  

Fantastic story!