makeup of shorter japan trains?

December 31, 2011

I think Spacecadet is right, this happens more often than many of realize but the cause more frequently people being hit by trains (at least once a day in Tokyo), grade crossing accidents rather than equipment failures. There 40,600 service suspensions in 2008 in Metropolitan Tokyo, of which suicides accounted for more than half. Newspapers will report the length of the delay and how many passengers were delayed.

Railway Suicides in Japan

http://factsanddetails.com/japan.php?itemid=639&catid=19&subcatid=120#05

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33622388/ns/health-mental_health/t/tokyo-train-stations-use-lights-stem-suicides/#.Tv-XHPJEpPQ

January 1, 2012

Suicides aside, there are also an immense amount of trains operating in and around Tokyo. Even a very low incidence of failure per-train or per-line is going to happen fairly often, and the number of people impacted will be huge. Several of Tokyo's busiest lines are moving more than 70,000 passengers per hour (per line) at peak, so any disruption will impact tens of thousands, and possibly hundreds of thousands, of people. Something that hits multiple lines through a busy station (power or signaling failures) can easily impact a million riders.

January 1, 2012

OFF TOPIC: My wife just saw the word "makeup" and piped up "What's that about? What's that about? .... sheesh ... women!

Cheers

The_Ghan

If anyone, places foundation on my trains they better run the other way very quickly....... Well the Fujisan Express has a image of a female mountain and looks lilke it has lipstick for lips lol....

Meanwhile getting baack on track, one of the members of the Australian Japanese Model Railway Group has a rule of thumb in regards to locos and their train loads. It it interesting on how he is able to do the calculations of it, especially when it it dealing with freight trains.

Nice photo of the DE10 with the 3-car oil pots.

January 4, 2012

getting back to topic finally...

that DE10 now that when I think about it does look like it might just about throw a piston any moment :-s

mark, thanks for that link. does give me some ideas of what to pick for the N scale C11

do have one little photo question tho

http://yoshiokasyd.web.fc2.com/Annexes/Retro_Photos/Honsyuu/tadami/tadami2.files/p3.jpg

I'm sure thats not actually a coach but just almost looks like it or am I wrong? its the first long wagon yeah

whats Kougei like? I'm finding their smaller rolling stocks interesting (and nick now I know where your avatar came from)

oh and I found that microace makes the 485 emu that I was wondering about so I may see about it on my wishlist

only question re the microace 485 tho is this other thing next to it in the new-releases sheet

http://www.microace-arii.co.jp/poster/img/11_02_2.jpg

whats with that DE10 and the uniform green strip on the whole train?

sure makes me thinking I need to plan which of these DE series locomotives to get since I as hell am not buying ten individual ones!!

I still need to look the real things up yet to see if they'll work for me but I see theres an ED16 and DE11 recently released?

I still have to look through the long list of currently selling freight wagons (especially newhallstation's) but could I ask if A3002 and A3074 from microace would had been within steam or more modern post-steam era?

thanks a lot for this helpful thread either way, I may finally post a rough wishlist later on this week for comments :)

January 4, 2012

I still have to look through the long list of currently selling freight wagons (especially newhallstation's) but could I ask if A3002 and A3074 from microace would had been within steam or more modern post-steam era?

Be cautious of Newhallstation. Their stock is significantly marked up in price. For instance, they want $60 for the Tomix Hoki 800 (2 car set) while HobbySearch, PlazaJapan & BTtrains have the exact same set for $30. Having said that, Newhallstation does have some rare and hard to find things that you cannot find anywhere else.. at which point the mark-up over MSRP may or may not be worth it.

If you're looking for a US dealer, BTtrains.com and modeltrainstuff.com are state-side and have better prices on your more readily available items.

January 4, 2012

getting back to topic finally...

that DE10 now that when I think about it does look like it might just about throw a piston any moment :-s

mark, thanks for that link. does give me some ideas of what to pick for the N scale C11

do have one little photo question tho

http://yoshiokasyd.web.fc2.com/Annexes/Retro_Photos/Honsyuu/tadami/tadami2.files/p3.jpg

I'm sure thats not actually a coach but just almost looks like it or am I wrong? its the first long wagon yeah

thanks a lot for this helpful thread either way, I may finally post a rough wishlist later on this week for comments :)

We do wander OT a bit at times.

The Kato 10-809 set is a good selection of freight cars from the late steam/early diesel era that would go well with a C11 or DE10. http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10100325

As in other parts of the world branch line trains often were mixed trains carrying freight and passengers so the car in the photo could be a coach or a baggage car for small freight shipments.

January 4, 2012

mark, thanks for that link. does give me some ideas of what to pick for the N scale C11 do have one little photo question tho
http://yoshiokasyd.web.fc2.com/Annexes/Retro_Photos/Honsyuu/tadami/tadami2.files/p3.jpg

I'm sure thats not actually a coach but just almost looks like it or am I wrong? its the first long wagon yeah

It appears to be a Waki1000 express boxcar.

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10045315

Cheers,

Mark.

January 5, 2012

...

Be cautious of Newhallstation. Their stock is significantly marked up in price. For instance, they want $60 for the Tomix Hoki 800 (2 car set) while HobbySearch, PlazaJapan & BTtrains have the exact same set for $30. Having said that, Newhallstation does have some rare and hard to find things that you cannot find anywhere else.. at which point the mark-up over MSRP may or may not be worth it.

...

Agreed. I would never purchase anything from Newhall Station. Grossly overpriced.

Cheers

The_Ghan

January 5, 2012

your right on being a waki 1000 but it's not express car you can tell it's not no stripe probably

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10014059

or

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10045317

from what it seems the c11 came into use on this line from 1946 replacing the c12. the lines most notable feature was it's high use for freight for production of the dam the picture you linked earlier worldrailboy was either shot from the dam itself or during it's construction judging on the angle it is pointing.

http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~aj4s-ski/aizu10-4/newpage4.htm

i checked a few sites and none mention any use of express freight on this line but that doesn't mean it never occured but i'm sure that has no express stripe on it. really intersting line to model for that era. thanks for bringing it up.

January 5, 2012

whats Kougei like? I'm finding their smaller rolling stocks interesting (and nick now I know where your avatar came from)

oh and I found that microace makes the 485 emu that I was wondering about so I may see about it on my wishlist

only question re the microace 485 tho is this other thing next to it in the new-releases sheet

http://www.microace-arii.co.jp/poster/img/11_02_2.jpg

whats with that DE10 and the uniform green strip on the whole train?

sure makes me thinking I need to plan which of these DE series locomotives to get since I as hell am not buying ten individual ones!!

I still need to look the real things up yet to see if they'll work for me but I see theres an ED16 and DE11 recently released?

I still have to look through the long list of currently selling freight wagons (especially newhallstation's) but could I ask if A3002 and A3074 from microace would had been within steam or more modern post-steam era?

thanks a lot for this helpful thread either way, I may finally post a rough wishlist later on this week for comments :)

My avatar is a model of one of Akita Chuo Kotsu's (Akita Central Transportation, delightful little line in northern Japan now long closed) freight motors. Akita Chuo was an oddball as far as passenger equipment was concerned because AFAIK they did not have a single passenger motor in their fleet - the freight motors hauled ex-JGR coaches, plus whatever freight came along, on their runs. The perfect prototype for your short train!

I haven't got a clue about N scale World Kougei. A friend of mine has a WK HO electric loco, somewhat noisy, no flywheel but runs OK.

Yes, Kato is coming out with the ED16. Dunno about the DE11 (incidentally a souped-up version of the DE10 for snowplow service).

The green DE seems to be hauling a "Joyful Train" of one sort or another. I'll leave the ID to the experts...

Avoid Newhall Station if possible. Prices...OUCH...seem to have been designed to fleece Hollywood stars.

Cheers NB

January 5, 2012

I guess the other photos given sure makes me thinking thats a perfect prototype for me to use since its never the same consist type all the times unlike modern block trains

perhaps something like this if using a bit of interception of a few different such lines together on a single layout;

two different microace C11 steam locomotives

some short and long WAMU ? cars

tomix TORA 70000 cars

kawai Waki 1000 cars

a brake car or two

kato Oha31/Oro30/Ohani30

I was only using newhallstation as a quick # reference alone for a moment and yeah I did noticed their high prices early on especially with the KIHA sets :-|

as for DE11 being souped up I guess that would had made sense with the similar numbering as well

and re that green DE10 I eventually found that its the normal 485 emu but in another paint job with the DE10 done up the same. seem its another of these 'emu under diesel power' set again. think just the standard 485 set itself might be enough for me tho

btw funny that you would mention 'joyful train' because I found another one then I remembered that someone talked about it on this forum at some long point ago. does microace A5934 ring any bell? as far as I even remember it was the two KIHA40 repainted to this dark brown colour and the middle car being unpowered bbq table car or close to it?

the more I looked at it the more I decided that even although eg the EH200 with so few wagons would had been interesting I didn't want to end up with a compressed layout so I'm going to do without urban populations for most part so I might still buy an electric or few as to not get too rural...but for most part I'll stick to the like of C11, DE10, or KIHA on quiet lines. was interesting re the thought of an EH200 with so few wagons but I think I'll try keep the variety a bit small (except I might still end up with a few too many different KIHA's )

nick, I'm not too surprised that a japan line would be putting that and that together.

a few skinny light farmers' railroads in the usa a long time ago would had used old gas-electric passenger units that otherwise should had been normally scrapped more than ten years ago...hauling one or few loads of grain etc down the old rails.

http://www.alleganycountynylocalhistory.com/RailroadsAlleg/Penna%20RR/prrbrill.jpg

thats a good example of one [that is still in passenger service] with the radiators streamlined into the roof line (otherwise it would had been a wieldy boxy radiator that was bolted on top of the cab roof)

January 5, 2012

I wonder what the actual rules are. On my recent visit to Japan I noticed trains with only one disc or none at all. I'm thinking in might depend on the type of train, a shunt train (local pickup freight), for example might not be required to have discs and a single disc might identify a specific type of train.

Westfalen, I think you're right, there seems to be a number of ways the discs are displayed. I'd love to get hold of their local appendix/TOM/OSP or equivalent.

At home it might just mean the discs fell off.

LOL! You're not wrong!

Cheers,

Mark.

January 5, 2012

your right on being a waki 1000 but it's not express car you can tell it's not no stripe...

You're right Keitaro, I didn't notice the lack of stripe. Again, I plead lack of sleep due to too many night shifts.

checked a few sites and none mention any use of express freight on this line but that doesn't mean it never occured but i'm sure that has no express stripe on it. really intersting line to model for that era. thanks for bringing it up.

My pleasure. I gather that the waki cars were not only used for express freight but also LCL and parcels on secondary lines, which would explain its presence here. I like the link you posted, too.

Cheers,

Mark.

January 5, 2012

I can just imagine a waki 1000 turning up on the Tadami line one day and the local staff thinking, "This is better than that old wooden four wheeler we use, we'll just hang onto it until Tokyo asks where it is".

January 5, 2012

westfalen I'm going non-japan here but for usa there were actually a few known stories of 'stolen' locomotives on neighboring small railroads from years ago. only way to explain why theres suddenly a mostly clean EMD GP40 leading an old local owned+repaired GP9 till the mainline railroad's motive board finally got wise enough to find out why the locomotive wasn't at the interchange track for its supposed job anymore

January 5, 2012

westfalen I'm going non-japan here but for usa there were actually a few known stories of 'stolen' locomotives on neighboring small railroads from years ago. only way to explain why theres suddenly a mostly clean EMD GP40 leading an old local owned+repaired GP9 till the mainline railroad's motive board finally got wise enough to find out why the locomotive wasn't at the interchange track for its supposed job anymore

Come on folks, it was in Area 51 honest. :P lol

January 5, 2012

linkey this forum never gets bored at all does it?!

anyway could someone perhaps point me to some explanation for the various freight wagon namings? might make it easier for me to search for specific wagons from the catalogs

and even then the first question I could have is that so far I've found low-side wagons with 'humped' sides but can't figure how to find the ones with flat sides because I don't understand the wagon naming system?

http://www.eonet.ne.jp/~sl59634/sl93.jpg

that photo shows what I mean with the first car behind the brake car compared to the other two after it in that train

at least I've been able to figure out that WAMU seem to always be medium length 2 axle roofed vans with sliding doors? :-)

January 6, 2012

westfalen I'm going non-japan here but for usa there were actually a few known stories of 'stolen' locomotives on neighboring small railroads from years ago. only way to explain why theres suddenly a mostly clean EMD GP40 leading an old local owned+repaired GP9 till the mainline railroad's motive board finally got wise enough to find out why the locomotive wasn't at the interchange track for its supposed job anymore

My main modeling interest when I'm not lurking about here is the Santa Fe. When run through service started with NYC and later Penn Central ATSF cabooses started going missing with some being found in local service as far away as Pennsylvania. It turned out NYC crews were finding ways of keeping them because they were so luxurious compared to NYC cabooses, some of which didn't even have electric lights.

January 6, 2012

linkey this forum never gets bored at all does it?!

anyway could someone perhaps point me to some explanation for the various freight wagon namings? might make it easier for me to search for specific wagons from the catalogs

and even then the first question I could have is that so far I've found low-side wagons with 'humped' sides but can't figure how to find the ones with flat sides because I don't understand the wagon naming system?

http://www.eonet.ne.jp/~sl59634/sl93.jpg

that photo shows what I mean with the first car behind the brake car compared to the other two after it in that train

at least I've been able to figure out that WAMU seem to always be medium length 2 axle roofed vans with sliding doors? :-)

Here's a site I found, there may be others. http://sunny-life.net/train_symbol/trainsymbol.htm

The first character designates the type of car and the second the weight, the number is the individual classes of that type. wa = freight car w/roof, mu = 14-16 tons

January 6, 2012

That's Plaza Japan's (ebay seller) website. I've found him very reliable and sometimes willing to negotiate on things that he's listed at a fixed price.

Cheers

The_Ghan

January 6, 2012

thanks for that the_ghan I had looked at a few of his items in interest too

now as for the wagons, I had a bit fun playing around with different grouping of #1 and #2 together and I think I'm getting the hang of it already.

I had to ask whats the exact operational difference between HO- and SE- wagons tho?

edit: nick I found the real "you" if you aren't too humored by that fact

http://www5.kcn.ne.jp/~namachan/g01%20akityu%20deki3003%20%20hitoiti6305.jpg

January 7, 2012

anyway could someone perhaps point me to some explanation for the various freight wagon namings? might make it easier for me to search for specific wagons from the catalogs

and even then the first question I could have is that so far I've found low-side wagons with 'humped' sides but can't figure how to find the ones with flat sides because I don't understand the wagon naming system?

http://www.eonet.ne.jp/~sl59634/sl93.jpg

that photo shows what I mean with the first car behind the brake car compared to the other two after it in that train

at least I've been able to figure out that WAMU seem to always be medium length 2 axle roofed vans with sliding doors? :-)

There's a sticky on the Prototype board listing abbreviations. While it's mainly the passenger ones (which are a different system), there are also references to the freight naming (first symbol is type, second is weight range). I also have a page on my site where I've summarized a bunch of info from wikipedia on freight cars for my own reference, along with the Japanese form of the name.

WAMU means a boxcar (WA) with a loading weight between 14 and 16 tons (MU). It's the typical boxcar, and while some larger ones (WAKI) were made for express use, they were also scrapped earlier, while a few WAMU live on well beyond the days of freight yards, mainly in newsprint paper transport service or utility functions (tools for wreck cleanup, etc).

The low-side gondola cars were TORA (or TOKI, but those were larger), as seen on this Japanese wikipedia page (run it through Excite to read it; you need to paste in the link, click the blue box to the lower position, then click the yellow button). However, I don't believe I've ever seen a photo of one with lower-profile ends such as your photo shows. It's a two-axle gondola, so it's almost certainly a TORA (トラ), unless it was some specialized function that had a different name (which happens, high-sided hopper cars used for coal were "SERA" or "SEKI" rather than the more general hopper designation of "HOSA" or "HOKI", except later large-capacity ones which were "HOKI" rather than "SEKI").

January 16, 2012

I was stuck once in a tunnel behind a broken subway train. They must understand about claustrophobes, we were there for about 15 minutes with announcements about every three telling us what was going on and then then had backed up enough trains for us to go back to the last station and unload.

I ride subways with NO problems then or since, but being stuck was VERY SCARY.

In 20 years of riding there was that breakdown, one that caught on fire in a snowstorm in the mountains, I assume it overworked the motors, a couple of stuck doors and some suicides. If I hit ten total I think I would be about right. This is for a regular rider going to school every day, then work, and evenings out as a teen and early twenty year old. If I did not get on and off a train 4 to 6 times a day it was a very odd day indeed.

As far as short trains go the Seibu Tama line is pretty short, only 4-6 cars in my day.

January 18, 2012

I can just imagine a waki 1000 turning up on the Tadami line one day and the local staff thinking, "This is better than that old wooden four wheeler we use, we'll just hang onto it until Tokyo asks where it is".

So can I - been there, done that, got the flash brakevan!

Cheers,

Mark.

makeup of shorter japan trains?

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