non over head power emu's

[keitaro]

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/blog/1106092 There are plenty of these about in japan a few in oaska i have been on.

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10150095

 

which will of course not support the third rail for power.

 

However i do find it really intersting in that it can swap the sides at any time with out loosing power.

 

Whats would be also interesting is if tomix and kato could on their track, make track pieces to support power pickup like this.

 

It would be awesome to see and easilly possible as the track would be fixed anyway.

 

Would be easy too to have this pick up as an installable option ! I feel it would work better than having track for power as it would not have to be cleaned as much etc as pickup would be easier

 

Let the discussion begin!

[bill937ca]

Its actually fairly rare in Japan.  Tokyo only has one or two third rail subways.  I've heard of third rail model trains, but I think it was usually in larger gauges with non-prototype third rails.

[bill937ca]

Its actually fairly rare in Japan.  Tokyo only has one or two third rail subways. It limits interchange possibilities with surface rail liines.  I've heard of third rail model trains, but I think it was usually in larger gauges with non-prototype third rails.

[keitaro]

theres a few as below. Theres more though i'm sure of it

 

Osaka Municipal Subway Chūō Line

Osaka Municipal Subway Midosuji Line

Osaka Municipal Subway Sennichimae Line

Osaka Municipal Subway Tanimachi Line

Osaka Municipal Subway Yotsubashi Line

Tokyo Metro Ginza Line

Tokyo Metro Marunouchi Line

[David]

Also to keep in mind is that the two trains of Tokyo Metro that do run on third rail are also standard gauge instead of cape gauge. All the newer Tokyo Metro lines are cape gauge with overhead wiring.

[Mudkip Orange]

However i do find it really intersting in that it can swap the sides at any time with out loosing power.

This has been standard on every third-rail subway since the first systems were built (London Hammersmith and City Line, Budapest M1, New York 9th Avenue IRT).

 

It is quite uncommon in Japan, though.

[westfalen]

However i do find it really intersting in that it can swap the sides at any time with out loosing power.

This has been standard on every third-rail subway since the first systems were built (London Hammersmith and City Line, Budapest M1, New York 9th Avenue IRT).

 

It is quite uncommon in Japan, though.

It's quite easy actually, each car and sometimes each bogie has collector shoes on both sides, so there is always one or more shoes in contact with the third rail over gaps.

[IST]

This has been standard on every third-rail subway since the first systems were built (London Hammersmith and City Line, Budapest M1, New York 9th Avenue IRT).

 

Budapest M1 had and has overhead system, not third-rail if I know well.

[bill937ca]

Boston has a line that is half third rail and half overhead.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Line_%28MBTA%29

 

http://world.nycsubway.org/us/boston/blue.html

[Mudkip Orange]

Budapest M1 had and has overhead system, not third-rail if I know well.

 

Oh em gee, you are correct. I just figured the whole system used a similar power supply. In fact on further reading the M1 uses 550V overhead and a different loading gauge from the Soviet-era lines which use 875V third rail and a standard Moscow/Petro profile.

[IST]

In fact on further reading the M1 uses 550V overhead and a different loading gauge from the Soviet-era lines which use 875V third rail and a standard Moscow/Petro profile.

 

Completely different systems the M1 and the M2/M3. Just to say, while M2 and M3 lines called 'Metro', M1 is known as 'Kisföldalatti' which can be translated as 'little underground'. 

[Claude_Dreyfus]

Almost everything in south east England runs of 750v DC third-rail electricity. The units have collector shoes either side of the bogies to enable to third rail to either side of the track, as well as having several shoes along the units to combat 'gapping'. Gapping is where the third rail is interrupted by level crossings or points, resulting in a loss of power to the train.

 

Which side of the track the third rail is located also depends on the platforms at stations. Obviously here it is located on the side of the track away from the plaform, as in this picture taken about 15 years ago at Eastleigh in Hampshire.

 

Despite first third rail electrification on the London suburban network (not including underground services) being in 1913. It is seen as being rather old-fashioned now, perhaps demonstrated by the fact the fastest record third-rail speed only being 108 mph; a record set twenty years ago by the class 442 EMU.

 

Although an extensive system, only a small number of third-rail locomotives have been built in the UK. The most numerous being the class 73, which numbered 49 examples. These useful locos were introduced just under 50 years ago, and there are still a handful of examples working today, as well as a fair few preserved.

 

In terms of modelling; I have yet to see a model of any gauge operated via third rail as per the prototype. You do see some early hronby and some more modern German models using a third rail running down the centre of the track, but this is not widespread.

 

Models of third rail trains were, with the exception of the class 73, almost non-existent for many years. Now we have two ready to runs EMUs out in 00, with a couple in development..and a couple due very soon in N gauge.

[brill27mcb]

In the U.S. there have been operating third-rail powered layouts in varied scales. This isn't counting the early "Bronze Age" in the 1930's when people, trying to be more scale than Lionel, converted engines (including steam) to run on a non-scale outside third rail. The typical pickup was a long coil spring, like the ones used in spring-belt drives.

 

In terms of scale third rail, I once had a portable layout in HO using outside third rail, based on the prototype Philadelphia and Western Railway, with Code 70 running rails and Code 40 third rail. The New York City Model Train Association (NYC MTA  - get it?) has a modular third-rail El layout in O scale, and an East Penn member has had a large 3/4" scale "el" layout with operating third rail for about forty years now. In the Philadelphia suburbs, there was also a modeler who had an outside "live steam" size layout in his yard with P&W models operating from third rail. He finessed his driveway so it was flush with the running rails crossing it, then stepped up slightly to be flush with the raised third rail as well.

 

The classic way to build a third rail has been to use brown glass beads to represent the insulator chairs supporting the third rail, with a brass brad nailed through the bead's hole to fasten it to the layout surface. The third rail was soldered to the tops of these brads. Working third rail shoe models are usually sprung arms. The NYC MTA guys also use eyeglass hinges to make working third rail shoes on their rolling stock. There is a regular contributor to the "O Scale Trains" magazine who puts operating third rail shoes on all of his equipment.

 

It can be done, and has been, but it has had to be home-built.

 

Rich K.