Kato N 20866-1 Unitrack Double Crossover Track Set Variation 7 Set questions

[Spaceman Spiff]

I am in the process of finalizing my track plan and hoping to start construction soon. There may be two spots where I will probably be adding a crossover such as the Kato version. Is the crossover piece difficult to get working properly. I seem to remember reading about confusion about the power being AC or DC. Will this operate ok on DCC system? Is it an easy electrical install? Is the switch included in the Variation kit a good switch or is there a better way to go?

 

 

Thanks

 

Spiff

[David]

No, it is not a difficult piece to get working. In terms of trackwork it is generally agreed to be the best double crossover available for reliability (Everything in the variation set is the same as what you can buy individually).

 

In terms of how it is operated electrically the crossover has the same 2 wire plug as all the other Kato switches. You can either connect this plug to one of Kato's blue box switches, a momentary switch or use a DCC stationary decoder.

 

The one difference between the double crossover and the #4/#6 switch that can cause problems, especially if you use a DCC decoder, is the amount of amps drawn. A #6 switch has one solenoid, but the crossover has 4 of them triggered at the same time. Some people have reported that this momentarily draws over 3 amps.

 

This means you cannot use the tiny little accessory decoders rated for only 1 or 1.5amps. You need one of the big stationary decoders like the DS64 that can handle the amp draw. Preferably one with its own power supply so that you don't overload your system with the extra 3 amps (the DS64 can be powered either by the rails or with a seperate power pack).

 

Another difference is that there is no power routing - all 4 track ends need feeders. While the outer rails are connected (be careful if you wire a reversing loop to add an insulated section to protect the crossover from shortcircuit) the inner rails are only connected when a locomotive bridges the gap.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Thanks for the quick reply. The only pieces of unitrak that I am planning to use are the cross overs and possibly some straight pieces of track for the Kato overhead stations. Everywhere else I will be using Atlas flex track with Peco switches. One of the cross overs will be towards the back of the layout so I am hoping to have the actual switch a few feet away from the crossover. I imagine if needed adding additional wire for legnth wont affect things. I probably won't control the switch via DCC. How bulky is the OEM switch?

 

Spiff

[David]

The Kato blue switch boxes are very small (less then half the volume of the Tomix ones). However if this is the only piece of Kato hardware you will have it may be out of place - it is mostly made of plastic, it's too thin to stand up on it's own (it's meant to be clipped in a line with other blue switches) and you'll need to manually hook up power anyway (12V DC).

 

To better fit in with your other switches what you probably want is a momentary switch (this is all the Kato switch does inside). These should be available where you buy hobby electrics or your LHS may stock them. Just make sure it's momentary, as continous power will burn out the solenoids fast.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Thanks again for the super quick reply. To get the crossover to switch the points you would just push the momentary switch "X" amount of times to get the configuration you need?

 

Spiff

[David]

There are no processors or controllers. All the solenoids are connected to the same two wires. Applying power +/- for a split second will set the switch to straight through, applying power -/+ for a split second will set the switch to crossover. There are only two valid configurations to choose from (while you can make other configurations by manually pushing the hidden tab beside each point but these mismatches will result in short circuits and derailments).

[Spaceman Spiff]

Thanks for the crossover for dummies lesson David :)

 

Spiff

[myoung5655]

First off, Hello :).  First post!

 

I recently bought a Kato starter set, and to make the initial layout a little more interesting, I also bought the v5 inner loop and the v7 crossover.

 

I was amazed at how smoothly everything went together, but there is one item that has me a little stumped.  The dc controller that comes with the starter set has one output, which is wired to a feeder on the outer track.  I guess I naively assumed that the same controller could feed both the inner and outer tracks.

 

What do people usually do with this layout in terms of providing power to the inner and outer loop?

 

My apologies if my terminology is off.  I'll redeem myself by pointing out that I'd long since forgotten how nice a model train sounds rolling around the loop :D.

 

Thanks for any insights you might be able to offer.

[sedril]

I've got a setup like this.

 

The double crossover is electrically isolated.  This means that any power going to one end of the double crossover won't come out any of the other ends.

 

You'll have to wire up a second output for the inner loop.

 

The way I've got it setup is to use another feeder track, and a power splitter.

( http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003115 and http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003036 )

[myoung5655]

Thanks.  I was hoping it would be that easy.

 

Followup question:  In cases where you're powering two segments (blocks?) with different controllers, as the engine crosses from one to another, is there just enough of a capacitive charge stored to allow it to bridge caps with affecting the train's motor?  And do you just set the two controllers to the same setting to avoid a surge as it makes the crossing?

[Densha]

I'm not 100% sure sedril intends to say this and if you mean this in your last post, but if I'm right you only need 1 controller, not two.

If it's only 1 controller I think it will go to the other side of the crossing perfectly, but I'm not sure about this at all.

[myoung5655]

I'm pretty sure you're right about that.  with the starter+v5+v7 from kato, I have an inner and an outer loop.  with a feeder on each of the two loops, connected to the same controller, it will just move right across the switch. 

 

I was more asking about the idea that you wanted to run two trains on the setup but with DC controllers.  Do people actually do that sort of thing?

[Densha]

Ah like that.

I know some sets are intended to be used with two controllers, like the outer and inner loop set for M1 without crossing and the large variation sets with concrete sleepers. Optionally you can use the splitter if you don't have a 2nd controller, but both trains will have the same speed.

If the crossing switch isn't power routing then you could use two controllers, but when you switch to switch tracks I think you will get a short circuit.

[brill27mcb]

Yes, I do that with a double-track loop and a double crossover. I simply match the speed and direction settings of the two power supplies while crossing over from one track to the other. I generally only have a need to do this when crossing over to enter or leave a storage yard. It helps to have a means to stop the "other train" in a controlled block, or by using the partial power-routing of the turnouts. Also be aware that the double crossover does not conduct power from its one end to its other end, so on a longer loop your train may slow down as it goes around the loop (from the cumulative effect of small voltage drops at every Unijoiner), then speed up when it gets on the double crossover.

 

Rich K.

[nik_n_dad]

we use the nce switch-kat for the kato double crossover.  It works fine, no need to even adjust and of the CVs.

 

http://www.ncedcc.com/component/virtuemart/?page=shop.product_details&flypage=garden_flypage.tpl&product_id=60&category_id=7