yard trusses

[cteno4]

does anyone have an idea of what they used to make the overhead catenary trusses in this yard? kind of looks like plastic, not etched metal. i know prohobby has a small etched metal truss like this, but its shorter than this (maybe 2 tracks wide).

 

http://cafe.naver.com/ghdudajtma.cafe?iframe_url=/ArticleRead.nhn%3Fclubid=11101373%26articleid=30542%26menuid=5%26boardtype=P%26page=1

 

cheers

 

jeff

[Darklighter]

Looks like a N gauge version of this H0 kit (by Kotobukiya) http://blogs.yahoo.co.jp/tomayukako4375/50105439.html .

 

EDIT:

I just found the blog of the maker of this layout, check out the last image: http://germangray.egloos.com/4851448 . Looks like etched metal.

[Hobby Dreamer]

What an amazing layout!! 

 

The catenaries really make this layout look sharp! 

[cteno4]

Thanks Darklighter,

 

looks like he researched the trusses and may have had some etched for him. they match the prototype pictures in the previous blog entry very closely. looks like he is saying they may make some to sell?? translation is pretty wild

 

Keteonerijangbideulipnida working hard since yesterday.

Take advantage of the older products are too tried to limit the end-it-yourself is not difficult to create a surprisingly yeongukkeut are looking for.

The truss is proud of the nickname as much precision. 0.3mm solid plate without anything I've made a very good well-broken.

Lesbian part, but it was too soon, without volume is expected to augment.

It takes custom orders are going to try sales. The train should just sell 4 .. Yeah ㅋ

Jajakpum the meantime, a mix of older products and nationality make no diohramaman correctly this time, the smell of Korea, I see the basic knowledge to complete a diorama.

 

thin long trusses like that are nice and i have to look around at some of the stuff produced here in the states to see if anyone makes something that could get kitbashed into large yard trusses like this. these look pretty much the same as ones in japanese yards that span 5-6 tracks at a crack. having a bending brake would really help folding these guys up. i guess you could clamp it to a piece of metal stock the width of the inside of the girder and then fold it all the way over. folding the uprights would be fun!

 

cheers

 

jeff

[maxa1]

http://item.rakuten.co.jp/tenshodo/351rmms207/

 

Believe World Kogei is one of the makers.

[cteno4]

thanks maxa1!

 

this looks close, but its a three line, not as long at the one the guy had in his yard at 6 rails across. also his end transitions are different with the buttresses. im thinking he couldnt find what he wanted in length and also wanted to match his prototype you can see in one of his earlier posts

 

http://germangray.egloos.com/4851446

 

actually know someone who can get metal etching done pretty cheaply in a bit of quantity that i may pass this by to see what they would cost for the cross pieces. anyone interested in some long yard trusses like this? the upright truss might be a real problem to try and bend at that size perhaps going to metal poles would be easier!

 

they certainly made this guy's yard really stand out and look realistic!

 

cheers

 

jeff

 

on the rakuten site these were listed under the RM models section, i thought RM was different than world kougei. world kougei site doesnt seem to have any scenery detail parts. i have some other rm models etched metal stuff and its nice!

[maxa1]

http://www7a.biglobe.ne.jp/prohobby/j_page/ep.html

 

Maybe item EP55(scroll down) might be of interest. Yes, item shown on Rakutens site is from RM, World Kogei also made some(not anymore) with lattice mast and beam. For 6 track beams I think you will have to do custom etching.

Has anyone seen etchings for the more modern standard truss,widely used for 2-4 lines? Permil makes some laser cut ones, but they are of paper and a bit over scale.

[cteno4]

Thanks, I actually have that prohobby one on backorder the last week or so to look at.

 

this guys do match prototype double trusses used in japanese yards as well that span 6 tracks.

 

im thinking of seeing what a custom etch might cost. thought of laser cut (a friend has a lasercutter out in calif), but i dont think they would be stiff enough and one bump and they would probably crush.

 

luckily this would be a relatively simple item to lay out for etching.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[maxa1]

Jeff, have you come across etches for the standard double track lattice truss? Those are used in yards too(can span up to 4 tracks)? If more tracks,the longer type can be used ,fitted offset on the same pole as the neighbor. Those standard ones should be easier to assemble(V-profile). Otherwise I have look for custom etching too :sad:oo

 

Cheers

 

Max

[cteno4]

Max,

 

no the only etches i have seen so far are the ones that have been discussed in this thread. im betting they are out there in japan as there are a lot of interesting etched metal parts in japan that just dont make it to the channels that get outside japan! there are lots of cottage industries doing all sorts of very small run interesting detail parts, sometimes only sold through one local hobby shop or a handful. distribution channels in japan seem to be more layered and complex than other parts of the world so im guessing even if a small item is a hit it might be hard to get it widely distributed. distributors everywhere are prone to want a good product line to pick up a supplier even though their few current products might be the best thing out there (know this from personal experience!) PlazaJapan has gotten a few of the etched metal things that have never popped up on the retailers that would ship overseas before. might be worth an email to Jun.

 

it will be interesting to see if these small cottage businesses start to get wider distribution through the internet. getting outside of japan will require them to get some english skills, but seems to be starting. kai found the guy doing nice little paper models that seems to be doing a nice little business thorough the internet.

 

Ill keep you posted on what i find out from my etching contact. if its not too expensive we could see about what could get ganged up on a sheet. luckily these are pretty simple items to lay out with a drawing program to make the masks. i know the guy i am talking to has done delicate truss work before.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[maxa1]

Hi Jeff,

 

In fact I've been trawling loads of those smaller Japanese local hobby shop sites...haven't found anything yet. Strange because those trusses would look much better and to scale than the plastic ones from Kato or Tomix. A lot of hobby shops(medium or small) have no website or blog if you browse through the advertisement section of Japanese model magazines,however I find regularly rather obscure things on Joshin's,Volks,etc websites.

I guess, more searching is required......

 

Cheers

 

Max

[cteno4]

Yeah i keep seeing odd little websites here and there from ads and such with all sorts of interesting little goodies!

 

im having coffee with the guy who has an metal etching source he has used on some products and will see about the costs involved. the simple fold cross truss is really simple and easy. its the upright trusses that may be more tricky to fold properly. ill see as they did some small towers with truss elements.

 

btw the prohobby truss is on its way sal now. ill see how fine it looks. the pictures make it look a tad pudgie on the etching.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[cteno4]

max,

 

talked with adarsh and turns out probably cheaper if just doing the etching to get it done at a local shop here he has used. only thing is to lay stuff out as tight as possible as if they do it its not done very efficiently.

 

heres an option for the uprights potentially. think with the small strip between the x braces could be a corner, but you could not fold it along the straight section, but along the X and straight. these are 4" long so would do fine for the uprights. get about 5 uprights per sheet.

 

the prohobby (icom) is not here yet, should be soon.

 

cheers

 

jeff

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Gold-Medal-Models-N-Scale-18-inch-wide-X-Bracing-1663-/180152665095?pt=Model_RR_Trains#ht_500wt_849

[maxa1]

Hi Jeff,

 

I guess the etch you mentioned would work for the smaller, but longer trusses you find in large EMU service yards. Also had a look at the double track trusses from RMM, not really like the prototype. If the masts were lattice to, they could be used as bridge masts.I would guess, that sooner or later one of the etch makers will do the proper shape, otherwise one will have to design the truss and get them etched locally. I don't know whether the dimensions on 'Permille's ' laser cut paper trusses can be used for a master.Btw, what is the mast diameter supposed to be?

 

Cheers

 

Max

[cteno4]

Max,

 

i was talking about using the gold metal X bracing for the upright latices, not the cross pieces. those would need the custom etch job as the truss structure and size is way different. most of the vertical x brased truss 'poles' i have seen are pretty generic xbracing or V bracing with L stock at the corners. the gold metal might work for that well. maybe very thin plastic angle styrene stock for the corners?

 

cross girders though i fear will need to be a custom etch in metal. a stiff chipboard might work, but i do fear one accidental hand whack will smash them, folded metal one i think would hold up better and if hit could be bent back to shape easily.

 

it will be fun to experiment with the prohobby kit, should be here this week. sal takes patience!

 

cheers

 

jeff

[maxa1]

Jeff, making uprights from those etches.....how you are going to fit a base? Also they appear to be a bit wide? The pro hobby ones look better(more to scale), albeit the picture is a bit fuzzy. Would like to hear more about those once you receive them. As to the standard trusses, where to find dimensions? Could be taken from photos, however since it needs to be a custom job, exact dimensions might be better. As to material, stainless steel or Nickel silver will be stronger than brass. RMM also makes some very tall full lattice trusses/uprights (as found with some private railways),maybe those can be converted to uprights by cutting up the frets to desired length?

The old style 'trusses', a piece of angle bar between to poles which were used on the Tokaido line, might be the easiest solution 

 

Cheers

 

Max

[inobu]

.........As to the standard trusses, where to find dimensions? Could be taken from photos, however since it needs to be a custom job, exact dimensions might be better. ...........  

 

Cheers

 

Max

 

 

GMat takes the most comprehensive photos for detailed information.

 

http://www.jnsforum.com/index.php/topic,3149.msg31393.html#msg31393

 

 

 

INobu

[maxa1]

Yes,GMat makes excellent detail pictures,however one needs a known reference measurement(for example from a window,etc).

 

Cheers

 

Max

[cteno4]

the gold medal W and X bracing comes in 18" and 24" scale width. im think the 18" is about right for the uprights. trick will be the angle piece going up each corner small enough. the smallest styrene angle stock is plastrct 3/64" which works out to about 7" scale. bit bit i think. its thickness is 0.015" or 2.25" thick so pretty thick as well. so this method of using X or W bracing and angles on the corners probably will look pretty bad. probably down to finding one etched that folds up well -- its going to be fun seeing how these fold on the icom ones, i expect they have a thin etched gap down each bend point and just a few hinge pieces connecting them or its going to be micro folding.

 

alternative is to just cheat and go to big metal poles an use round stock which many 2 and 3 track spans do, but the 4-6 track spans i have seen picts of in yards seem to always use a W or X braced vertical tower structures like the one in gmats picture below. that one actually looks like what i think the prohobby one is going for.

 

i should have it this week to play with

 

cheers

 

jeff

[maxa1]

Jeff, a combination of RMM trusses and prohobby uprights might just be ideal for your yard. You could cut the 3 track trusses on one end and solder 2 sections together? The RMM trusses have corner plates already.

 

Cheers

 

Max

[gmat]

Echi asked me if I could take detailed shots of these types of trusses. I might be able to do it Friday. Until then, here are some shots taken at the Oi Shinkansen/freight depot.

 

One difference is the use of a concrete pole rather than lattice truss. The horizontal component also seems to be narrower than on the model trusses. Sorry that it is hard to make out the detail.

 

 

 

Detail shot of one next to the overpass.

 

 

 

 

Best wishes,

Grant

[gmat]

Shinkansen yard, but shows a relative side shot to gauge the width of the horizontal truss. It seems to be have a triangular rather than box cross section.

 

 

 

 

More to come.

Best wishes,

Grant

[gmat]

On the east side of the JR Oi depot, Keihin Tohoku maintenance area.

 

 

 

 

Cyclone fence with barbed wire top for comparison with trusses.

 

Near Omori Station. Older style trusses.

 

Next to Oimachi Station. Old and new style trusses for comparison.

 

 

Will try to shoot in a way that you might be able to calculate the height and thickness of the trusses.

 

Best wishes,

Grant

[cteno4]

Grant,

 

thanks mucho that would be great! i have a few shots collected from the web of some shinkansen yards and it looks like when it gets to the larger track spans of like 5-6 tracks they go from metal or cement pole to metal x or v braced column. horizontal truss looks to get a bit taller on these longer spans. what i love from some of your shots is showing the V cross section of some of these horizontal trusses.

 

again love your wonderful detail shots! thanks for taking them and posting them.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[gmat]

Glad to help, Jeff.

 

Some more incidental shots. The narrow width trusses are about the same width as the pole.

 

 

There were two Dr. Yellows that day, one in the shed and the other parked outside on the other side of the overpass.

 

Best wishes,

Grant