Low-cost Cardboard T-Trak Modules

[tossedman]

G'day!

As my Aussie friends like to say.

 

I was chatting with Jeff (cten04) about my Party Project 2023 module and I remarked how strong the cardboard module was. After talking for a bit he came up with the idea of making a T-Trak module out of cardboard as it would be much cheaper to build and ship than a wood module. I would also be less intimidating to build as all it would require would be the cardboard parts and a hot glue gun.

 

I've already made baltic birch modules for myself so it didn't take too much effort to modify the file to be cut out of 4mm cardboard. I used 4mm cardboard because I have access to a big pile of it. The module will be 308mm X 230mm in order to facilitate cheaper shipping.

 

I should say now, that though I have access to a laser cutter at the school I teach at, I am unable to make and sell these modules myself. School board rules forbid me from doing so. That being said, I'm more than willing to share the cut files with anyone who can use their own laser cutter or find someone local to them to cut the files to build a module, or two, or ten...

 

I've attached the preliminary PDF file here and well as a .png image so you can easily see what I'm thinking. It still needs testing and should be regarded as a preliminary prototype and not the final product. It should have editable vectors if you have access to a vector drawing program on your computer. If you use any other cardboard that is not 4mm thick the file would require some modification.

 

EDIT - I've removed the PDF file as it is undergoing many refinements. Will post it again later when it's closer to finished.

 

Please let me know your thoughts and suggestions. I'll post more soon with a laser cut prototype.

 

Cheers eh,

 

Todd

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by tossedman

[tossedman]

OK, here's what I've come up with on the laser cutter. I actually cut everything before my first post but the magic of modern technology makes it appear as though it just happened. How exciting!

 

Well, here it is in all its glory. It fits in a standard 25.4cm x 33.02cm / 10 in. x 13 in. envelope. Might have to reinforce it a bit with some tape before shipping though. The parts and envelope weigh in at 154g.

 

Here are all of the cut pieces

 

Here it is tacked together with a hot glue gun. Does anyone have any suggestions to prevent stringing of the glue? It was a mess. With glue, riv nuts and bolts it's 171g.

 

Here's the bottom. Jeff had suggested using 10/24 riv nuts and bolts so I stacked up three layers of cardboard, and glued them into the corners. I put a dab of hot glue on the riv nut to hold it in. It's as sturdy as! I'm going to make some of the wheels to turn the bolts out of 3mm MDF. I had one here but it's a bit small. That's a job for tomorrow.

 

I think it's pretty good so far. Need to get some feedback from others so I'll whip up a couple more and put them in their hands.

 

Again, please feel free to chime in with any thoughts or suggestions.

 

One thing I'm going to add is to engrave the placement of the Unitrak on the top piece and cut holes for the power cables to route through under the track.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

Edited November 15, 2023 by tossedman
Added weights and fixed spelling. Stupid autocorrect!

[Tony Galiani]

Great stuff.  And thanks for doing all this.  I think having the availability of a less expensive option for module would be an inducement to try these.  I have some nice wooden modules I am sort of afraid to work on as I don't want to mess them up.  Having another option to get some experience would be helpful.

Cheers,

Tony

[Yugamu Tsuki]

This is absolutely brilliant for those of us who don't have time/space/are just too darn lazy. I know my local library (was just there 2 weeks ago for a train show) has a "technology room" with 3d printers, engravers, etc. so I need to check next time I'm there for a laser cutter.

[cteno4]

Todd,

 

great, really fantastic work!

 

yes more and more library systems are getting into maker rooms to help get folks into these hobbies where equipment costs too high for many starting out. Use to be like the night adult woodshop classes at jr highs that had wood shops. Alas many of those school shops are gone and the cost and insurance to do stuff outside the main school stuff (if they even have a shop) is just prohibitively high.

 

its nice as libraries are about learning and this is just another form of learning and libraries are about the most common public communal spaces we have. And as more of text goes electronic for borrowing means space may open up for tech stuff.

 

jeff

[tossedman]

Thanks Tony, Yugami Tsuki and Jeff.

 

Question to all. Is there anyone out there who has, or has access to, a laser cutter that would like to give this a try? Please let me know. I'm working on moving parts around to make them easier to cut on a smaller laser cutter like a Glowforge.

 

Todd

[disturbman]

I would love to test this, but I have not access to a laser cutter. But I wonder if there are online services I could try. I also wouldn't be against trying a half-deep module.

[cteno4]

I just got a stack of 9x12” thin corrugated cardboard sheets. I want to try again making a 9x12 module with just mat knife, laminating 2 layers of cardboard, and use simple rabit joints (ala sankei building construction) for strenght and ease of assembly. I did one out of foamcore and cardboard like 15 years back when there were heated discussion on what a Ttrak module base could/should be. They were sturdy. I never did scenic them as they were just proof of concept.

 

but I just want to put out a simple set of instructions for how to make a cardboard one without a lasercutter as well.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[tossedman]

8 hours ago, disturbman said:

I would love to test this, but I have not access to a laser cutter. But I wonder if there are online services I could try. I also wouldn't be against trying a half-deep module.

There are lots of online services. Take a look around. I took a quick look and found Snijlab in the Netherlands, there may be others closer to you. They have 3mm cardboard but I could modify the file for that. Don't know what their prices are like though.

 

Also, check and see if there is a makerspace in your area. Facebook market place has some laser cutting services listed in my area. I also looked on Reddit.com under r/lasercutting and found some people local to me that have laser cutters and may be able to cut a file. If you put a query onto Reddit I'm sure you'd get a response or two.

 

Let me know if you find something and I'll share the cut file again when I've got it a little more ready to go.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

[tossedman]

Disturbman, I'll have to adjust the size of the holes for metric rivnuts as these were distend around imperial sizes. That's about a two minute edit though. It's funny how Canada adopted the metric system in 1970s but we're so influenced by the USA that the Imperial system is more easily found in many areas. Let me know what you think. I'd love to see this thing go worldwide.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

[tossedman]

7 hours ago, cteno4 said:

I just got a stack of 9x12” thin corrugated cardboard sheets. I want to try again making a 9x12 module with just mat knife, laminating 2 layers of cardboard, and use simple rabit joints (ala sankei building construction) for strenght and ease of assembly. I did one out of foamcore and cardboard like 15 years back when there were heated discussion on what a Ttrak module base could/should be. They were sturdy. I never did scenic them as they were just proof of concept.

 

but I just want to put out a simple set of instructions for how to make a cardboard one without a lasercutter as well.

 

cheers

 

jeff

Jeff, that's definitely a way to go if one cannot laser cut. Carefully cutting out the pieces with a knife it the cheapest way to go by far. Let us know how that works out.

 

Todd

[Cat]

Gator Board is also pretty durable and cuts with a straight edge and box cutter.  It's a thin layer of foam board sandwiched between thin layers of hard board.  
 
Not sure if it's available outside the US or what it might be called elsewhere...

[disturbman]

@tossedman I will check for online services. Being the artist hub it's, Berlin has a good range of creative companies and/or for creative endeavours. There used to be a FabLab in the center of town, but it was packed to the roof and I wouldn't want to go there.

I'll PM you when I have found a place to have this printed.

[tossedman]

On 11/16/2023 at 9:39 PM, Cat said:

Gator Board is also pretty durable and cuts with a straight edge and box cutter.  It's a thin layer of foam board sandwiched between thin layers of hard board.  
 
Not sure if it's available outside the US or what it might be called elsewhere...

I saw an older thread on nscale.net about just that thing. A T-Trak module from 10mm thick gator board. https://www.nscale.net/forums/showthread.php?45886-A-Gator-Board-T-Trak-Module

[cteno4]

The problem with gatorboard is it’s pretty hard to cut with a mat knife, especially for someone without a lot of knife experience. It can also be harder and more expensive to source locally and in smaller chunks than 4x8 sheets. I would suggest a newbie try hand cutting corrugated cardboard or foam core before gatorboard, especially the 10 or 12mm stuff.

 

jeff

[tossedman]

Good point Jeff. I've never seen the stuff never mind tried to cut it.

[cteno4]

 It’s nice stuff. Basically foam core with a denser urethane foam interior and craft cardboard that is plastic impregnated as the outer layers. The plastic impregnated cardboard is not as hard to cut as styrene sheet, but tougher than chipboard, more like a very dense photo board. Thicker stuff is harder to keep your blade vertical in a 10 or 12mm thick cut.

 

we used it a little a long time back for sinage printing where we needed things very lightweight, but as the ultra boards (styrene faced styrene foamcore) we moved over to it as it could take dings better and much stiffer for bigger spans.

 

like 15 years back I whacked out a simple foamcore Ttrak base and was amazed how stiff and sturdy it was. I’ve seen a number of folks use them in finished modules.

 

jeff

[tossedman]

On 11/17/2023 at 2:11 AM, disturbman said:

@tossedman I will check for online services. Being the artist hub it's, Berlin has a good range of creative companies and/or for creative endeavours. There used to be a FabLab in the center of town, but it was packed to the roof and I wouldn't want to go there.

I'll PM you when I have found a place to have this printed.

 

@disturbman Let me know if you find an online service or someone local who can cut the cardboard for you. Please PM me the cost as I'm curious as to whether or not this would be economically viable for people or not. Not much good if they charge €30 or €40 to cut €1 worth of material.

 

I should have the plans finalized by early next week and I'll make one set for metric riv nuts. Looks like M4 bolts and Riv nuts require a 6mm hole. Easy adjustment to make. If you thinks a bolt size should be something other than M4 let me know. Also please find out if they have 4mm cardboard. If not I'd have to adjust the plans for the thickness of the cardboard as well.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

Edited November 19, 2023 by tossedman

[tossedman]

Got the latest iteration of the T-Trak module done. Added holes for the power wires and made the inside corners have small tabs that'll need to be hand cut so the pieces aren't loose after laser cutting. If you're just building the module after cutting it, this doesn't matter, but for shipping, this makes things that much easier. I've also got a modified version for 3mm cardboard and M4 rivnuts. Here's the 4mm version.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

Edited November 20, 2023 by tossedman
Corrected grammar

[tossedman]

Here are two PDF files for anyone to use. One is for 4mm cardboard and 10/24 sized rivnuts while the other is for 3mm cardboard and M4 sized rivnuts. Line colours and stroke width will have to be modified for whatever laser cutting software you or your supplier use. Right now RGB Red is cut and RGB Blue is engrave.

 

T-Trak_Cardboard_4mm_JNS_mk2.pdfT-Trak_Cardboard_3mm_metric_JNS.pdf

 

Below are copies one could print onto standard paper sizes, tabloid (11" X 17") or B3. Both are for 3mm cardboard. Black solid line is cut, dashed line is for track placement. I've just edited these two files to make them easier to cut by hand if that's your choice.

 

Tabloid_Cardboard_Module_3mm.pdfB3_Cardboard_Module_3mm.pdf

 

 

Let me know what you think.

 

Todd

Edited November 21, 2023 by tossedman
Edited files

[tossedman]

Thinking of shipping. I'll try to include all of the material around the sides, ends and inner support pieces to protect everything during mailing. See the top two rectangles below.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

 

 

[Tony Galiani]

Todd was kind enough to send me one of these for evaluation and I am pretty impressed.  I understand he sent some to Jeff for evaluation as well and I am looking forward to his comments - this way we get my newbie input and Jeff's expert opinion.  Todd cannot produce these commercially which I think is a shame as I am enjoying the build and making good progress on my first ever T-Trak module.

 

First off - this came in a flat package which survived Canada Post to arrive in Fredericton where I picked it up over Christmas.  It then survived my Air Canada flights back in my small backpack.  The package seemed very sturdy and I thought Todd must have put something in there to protect the kit so was surprised to find that there was nothing else in there but the cardboard pieces.  Sort of knew that some cardboard could be pretty strong but this really demonstrated that.

 

I started assembly yesterday and it was pretty straightforward.  Fortunately, Todd had sent me a note with some suggestions which really helped out - I was going to start assembly with the sides and ends but - thankfully - I read his note before I started - and learned the internal cross braces needed to be done first.  It went together easily using craft glue and builds into a rigid structure.  (Todd suggested a hot glue gun but I do not have one.)  I let is set all day then put a protective coating of Krylon on it since I will be adding scenery.  And - finally! - I did a decent spraying job - a light coat that did not end up smelling badly for days.  This meant I was able to start placing track on thei module this morning.

 

I had the required Kato track pieces which I glued on and are currently sitting under a lot of weights as they were slightly warped.  Hoping that my glue job works out - I am leaving it alone for now but will check it out later (and do more pics at that time).  The only issue I ran into with the track was that the guidelines on the module top piece disappeared once the glue and track were in place.  If I were to assemble another kit, I would mark a few more guidelines parallel to the original ones to help confirm that the track is properly in place.

 

The other issue I ran into was again my mistake.  I did not quite understand how to attach the feet at the module corners.  If I had bothered to read this thread first, I would have seen how it is supposed to be done .....

I plan to go back and add them later on.

 

I have included some pictures and will report further once I start adding scenery.  I have a simple scenic plan so hopefully I can bring this to completion relatively quickly.

 

Cheers,

Tony

 

 

 

[tossedman]

Looks good Tony! Hopefully, when Jeff gets a chance, he can post his thoughts as well. For the feet, just glue two more of the corner pieces into each corner. I glued one above and one below the corner braces you've already installed and then glued the rivnuts into the holes. Again, I used a hot glue gun, but you'll figure something out. Glue a turning wheel to each bolt and then just thread the bolt into the hole. You should be able to raise and lower each corner by turning each wheel.

 

I'm going to try to modify the module so it only uses three bolts, two in the front and a centred one in the back. I did this with our school modules a while back as per Jeff's suggestion and it works a treat. Levelling each module is super easy with the three bolts. Makes each module a little cheaper too! I'm not sure why I didn't do this from the start as it's an ingenious idea.

 

Please let us know any pros and cons as you go. Any and all feedback is valuable.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

[cteno4]

@Tony Galiani nice job! I would think about hitting the module (inside and out) with a couple of coats of clear lacquer or acrylic spray from a rattle can before doing scenery. Glue and moisture from scenery may warp the module top some. But no biggie if you don’t as it’s a good experiment to see what they do plain! I’m guessing they will so fine with just regular PVA glue applied, of course I wouldn’t do ballast glue flooding or extensive water wetting
 

I got mine together and was hoping to get a coat of lacquer on them today if warm enough. I’ll snap some picts here. They are quite the works of art! Todd is da man! Really is amazing how flat and rigid they are and feather light! It’s kind of spooky to pick them up as brain says Ttrak module pound or two and it’s just a few ounces but super stiff.

 

Todd shipped the first one down in an envelope with heavy tape around the edges and they made it from Canada to the US (two regular postal systems!) with only a little compression on the corners and actually no corner digs. Talked to Todd and he moved the two side/end cut sheets to the outside to let their waste space corners be the exposed corners and the two top pieces in the center to protect their corners. He also added a strip of thin chipboard all around the outside edge of the 4 stacked sheets which was great to keep the boards stacked perfectly and added protection for both corners ding protection and edge compression protection. Worked wonderfully! I should have taken a picture of Todd’s packaging job as was like one of Joe’s etched metal packages, packaging works of art in themselves!

 

Mine went together in like 10 minutes with the hot glue gun. Would have been faster if I had not grabbed the big industrial glue gun with the slower drying sticks for use on larger stuff, so I had to hold each piece for a minute to let the glue set up! It’s also a hulking big gun that required contortions to get into corners and not the best tip on it for fillets (I have a tip set somewhere just couldn’t locate them easily), so my fillets were not super pretty or even, but all hidden so no worries unless you are one to have to have all things perfect. If that’s the case use a point tip that delivers a better fillet.

 

Glued the tops on with PVA glue. The fit was just perfect. Corners get very strong once glued up. They have stayed super flat and no signs of warping so far.and I’m think a couple coats of clear lacquer will help beep any humidity warping away and protect from scenery or other external moisture.
 

Todd sent me an early version and then an updated one later and got came out very tight and right! I may experiment on the old ones with some PVA glue in some strategic places on the corrugated cardboard edges to strengthen them in places that will get dinged like the top and bottom corners. we had done this on some of the larger mockups that stuck around the office some and was getting dinged. We also use to wrap the edges in folded pieces of moisture activated Kraft tape and it made very clean and strong corners (on bigger pieces the corrugated cardboard edge was bad visually in the mockups tape hid that and was the same color as the cardboard). I think a couple coats lacquer will also help harden the edges.

 

Front face just screams for a piece of nice wood veneer to just oil and make look really pretty. While the tabs are cool looking with the singed tab ends contrasting with the cardboard, it is visually a bit much and I think distracting from the module scene in the end. I was talking to Todd about the veneer and he sent a piece along in the second module with a treat on it for our club!

 

Some observations:

• I think using hot glue gun is the best solution as you can glue each piece at a time and have it set up with joints perfect and everything flat and square in a minute, then move onto the next piece. Slower drying glues could end up with things flexing and not being super flat and square. Corrugated cardboard does not lend itself to using even drafting tape to hold parts together during glueing as removing the tape can easily rip up some of the cardboard surface and any stray glue can glue the tape to the joint as well. An inexpensive hot glue gun is under $10, even under $5 and any would work on this task well as you just put parts together and then put a big fillet of glue along the inside corners of the parts. A small hot glue gun really should be in every hobbist’s tool box as it’s a super handy tool and very inexpensive. No need to try to glue up all the tabs as it would just get messy fast (all the nooks and crannies in the edges of corrugated cardboard means glue will go in them more than where you want the glue) and any water based glue could make the cardboard tabs warp a little. I use to make 1:1 scale full sized mockups of exhibit elements out of corrugated cardboard with only hot glue fillets and they held up super well and joints never came apart unless I wanted them to with force. It’s a different process than most woodworking where you but the glue in the joints, but with hot glue the fillet is pretty damn good.
   
• Best to glue it up on a stone countertop (if you have one) or the flattest, surface you have. By doing this any little warps in any of the cardboard pieces is taken out with Todd’s finger/tab joints squaring everything up.its amazing how stiff and flat the resulting module is.
   
• On tab to slot joints, at times, you need to gently squeeze the tab end a tiny bit before inserting so it slides into the slots. Todd cut these with perfect fit but due to the corrugated cardboard not being perfectly uniform the tap can sometimes hang up in the slot and you don’t want to force it. Todd’s dimensions are perfect as all the joints are just right, tight enough to be super square and flat, just just loose enough for them to fit together well.
   
• Try not to force the finger/tab corner joints together. Todd designed and cut these very precisely and if something is not going together just wiggle it a little bit and then bam it will just pop into place. Force is your enemy on these.
   
• Pre build/fit the whole module if you want to, doesn’t hurt it and may make sure you have things going together correctly. It’s a nifty design as simple to put down the inter cross piece on the top first, then long sides then ends.
   
• Make sure to put in the tabbed corner leg holders in before you glue the ends in! Easy to forget them!
   
• When gluing the ends in only put the fillet of hot glue halfway up the vertical as you don’t want the fillet to get in the way in the corner for the two non tabbed corner braces that go behind the tabbed corner braces. Not a biggie if you do as you could just cut off the back corner of the non tabbed corner braces to make room for the fillet. Might just be something to build into the cut and then no issues if there is a fillet back there as cutting off a little corner is hard in corrugated cardboard as it wants to crush easily and you have to be gentle cutting.
   
• One big issue for folks cutting their own out with Todd’s cut files will be them sourcing the exact same thickness corrugated cardboard. This may be difficult as when I looked around for some sheets recently there were a ton of sources and I expect many may be the same but also many slight variations. Folks say 3mm but you may get 2.8mm. I have a few different piles of corrugated cardboard here from different sources over the years and a new one recently so I’m going to measure them all to see how much variation I can see.

todd again kudos on these! Really nice work and a nifty idea that may be a great solution to getting folks into Ttrak easier and cheaper. Cost of modules and fear of woodworking (newbie see even gluing up the wooden kits as woodworking when I talk with them) are two of the main hurtles to get them over usually and this solution does that.

 

cheers,

 

jeff

[tossedman]

Thanks for the feedback Jeff. I've added a small cutout on the inside of the corner tabs hopefully it's big enough for the hot glue fillets. If not I can make it a little larger.

 

We get our cardboard from Uline. They have both Canadian and American outlets. The ones we bought are 48 x 96" 200 lb corrugated pads used to provide layers to separate and protect items when shipping. They are recommended for separating layers on skids or inside packaging but they work great for our purposes. We use them for prototyping everything. Ours are 5/32" or 4mm thick. If there's an outlet close to you then they are easy to get. They come in multiple sizes and thicknesses. 

 

Like Jeff says, a hot glue gun is the way to go with assembling these. I'm interested to see how they react to a more humid climate than Calgary. Here it's so dry, especially in winter, that your lips are always chapped, your skin dries out and your curly hair goes straight. The nice thing about that is if you leave your crackers or cereal box open in the pantry, the contents don't get all soggy. 😉 Folks who come here from a humid climate tend to shrivel up and blow away in the wind. Or that's what it feels like anyways.

 

My thoughts about these are that they are ideal for clubs who want to introduce T-Trak to the masses. If they have access to a laser cutter, they could put on a workshop at a model train show or at their club, and for minimal cost, folks could walk out the door with a T-Trak module. When I've completed any more edits I'll post the final drawings for anyone to use or cut or modify to their heart's content. Anyone with a laser could pump these out easily.

 

Please let me know your thoughts.

 

Cheers,

 

Todd