Tomytec Chikuho Model 2000 - Articulation issue

[Aleks]

I am finally able again to run some trams on a new layout. For now, DC, no automation, and current is all or nothing although it's prewired for many blocks. So I am test running the trams that have arrived over the past few months.

 

One of them is Chikuho model 2000:

 

https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10925367

 

I don't know if my model is defective or if it's generally expected. Both articulations have a mechanical issue. When the second segment is swung left compared to the front segment, when going back straight, the right wall of the TM-LRT05 truck second segment often hits the right end of the articulation. As a result the tram cannot go straight and ends up derailing when exiting a curve. The exact same issue happens with the third segment, except in the opposite direction. The original plastic truck that came with the vehicle had the same issue too. 

 

I suspect I will need to carve off a fraction millimeter on the two walls that hit the articulation to solve this. I suspect this is likely less damaging than trying to shave off some of the articulation.

 

  

Edited July 26, 2023 by disturbman

[disturbman]

@Aleks You have the wrong motor unit. You should be using TM-TR06, not TM-LRT05.

[Aleks]

@disturbman Sorry my slip of mind, as I already started thinking about getting the Hiroshima 5100 tram set up with its TM-LRT05. Of course Chikuho 2004 has TM-TR06 inside, I doubt TM-LRT05 would even have fitted in (it has three bogies instead of four and the tram five pieces instead of three).

 

The original plastic chassis that came with Chikuho 2004 also had the same issue I noted - I was hoping this was just the issue with the plastic chassis, but apparently more likely with articulation. Although it does not look asymmetrical at all. But when trying to turn, there is plenty of clearance on one side and not enough on the other.  

[disturbman]

Damn, and here I was hoping I had solved your issue. 😉 That was obviously too simple.

I think I remember some people had talked about a similar issue on other articulate trams, a long time ago, perhaps on the first Portrams, maybe @cteno4 or @bill937ca will remember.

[bill937ca]

It should tell you on the Tomytec box which tram drive is right.  And the correct answer is TM-TR06. And HS show the correct drive on the listing you posted above.

https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10513496

 

I have issues with Hiroden version of this car on curves. It may need to be shaved down, maybe with fine sandpaper.  

 

 

Edited July 26, 2023 by bill937ca

[cteno4]

Yes I’ve had a few articulated trams with the outer frame being a ad bent in and rubbing on the other frame below as it articulates. It never caused derailments for me just the shells would not go straight on the straight track and just looked kinked all the time. Mine were solved by just gently bending the chassis wall end out a tad to the correct registration. I’ve found thin plastic chassises tend to naturally curve in a bit many times at end corners like this I think just from the plastic cooling gives a bit of pull in.
 

Same issue with a few chassis shell ends with Tomytec articulating diaphragms rubbing on them. May look to see if bending just a tad may work if not then a little fine sanding may do the trick. 
 

jeff

[Aleks]

Thank you guys! Seems like the issue is not unique. You can see the photo, the chassis wall hits right at the articulation and would prevent the tram from straightening up. 
 

Bending either side seems tricky, because of the connecting wall in the trailer and the articulation wrapping around the circular floor. So will likely try sanding. Glad I asked for advice, I thought about shaving some off with a Dremel, but sanding hopefully will be enough. 

[cteno4]

i would just use a fine file or like 200-300 grit finger nail file, you can probably be more gentle how much you take off as well as keep a long edge straight as you file. dollar store sometimes sell a nice pack small disposable finger nail files of like 20 files with 4 different grits. these are perfect for little sanding sticks. 

 

jeff

[Kamome]

As I have 5 of these Chikuho Dentetsu trams, although from earlier runs, I should probably share my experience.

 

As you mentioned, the diaphragm part of the mould should fit inside the articulated part of the chassis and swing without issue.

I would check that each of the 3 body sections are correctly seated and the chassis sections are correctly aligned before getting any sanding or filing implements out. 

 

I have zero issues with my 5 but parts like the interior and glazing on these Tomytec models can get misaligned quite easily.  I do remember having some alignment issue with one although I think it came down to some mould flash on the chassis.  Perhaps just start by removing all body sections and working back from the motor end, just to rule out any "human assembly element" before making permanent adjustments. 

 

The middle section body also doesn’t hold in place as well as the cab end sections and can slide on the chassis, so just check that this is not causing the issue.  See photos

 

As for running characteristics, these things generally don't run as well in reverse (motor at rear) as they do with the motor leading. Even when they stay on the track, they have a tendency to jump points/switches and due to the gauging margins of the wheels, can look a little "Zed" shaped while being pushed.  

 

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Kamome

[Aleks]

Thank you @disturbman and @KamomeThis was very helpful. I relooked at the parts connections today. First I noted the first two parts without the third one attached could run through all curves without issues. I then started looking at how the third part was connecting. Since both the articulation and 3rd part frame looked symmetrical, it occurred to me that perhaps the actual connection was at fault. The connection is a hook on the trailing part that sticks around a shaft on the leading part. The hook attaches to the chassis with a screw but can also move slightly to the left or to the right. And sure enough, that's where the issue was. Loosening the screw, pushing it a fraction millimeter to the left, tightening again, and now the thing works perfect! So effectively the trailer was too much to the right hand side because its hook was skewed to the right hand side. Put the body back on, and everything works and runs the rails! This is 103/140 curve, and until this fix it would have derailed on it. No issue any more.

Edited July 29, 2023 by Aleks

[cteno4]

Yayyyyy!

 

jeff

[Kamome]

Glad you got it sorted. They are nice looking trams although I don’t think there’s any section of their line which is “tram” related these days. The line stretched all the way to Kokura many years ago and shared space with other traffic but now finishes at Kurosaki, a relatively diminishing town in the suburbs of Kitakyushu. I’m sure once it was the hub of business and industry in the city. 

 

It’s actually quite strange to see such small units running on standard gauge (1372mm) track right next to larger trains running on narrower (1067mm) It throws out your depth perception a little. 

 

I really like this livery too, although I don’t own this particular one so obviously need to. 

[Aleks]

The yellow/red livery in particular is nostalgic to me as some trams in my childhood days had those colors, this is why I picked it up. I also like the styling, for the same reasons. I hesitated a lot whether to get the other colors, but for now have passed. My tram collection has gotten way too large too, and more is coming.

 

I drove along the entire Chikuho line in December, from Nogata to Kurosaki. This was one of the things I defintiely wanted to do in my time in Kyushu. Photos are coming in one of the next posts in my other topic. Sadly I did not see any of these trams, I think they had stopped running last year, although it is possible I may have missed one since the road does not really run parallel to the track. I walked around the depot, and there were none inside, too. As I was going by car and had a full day's worth of places to visit, I did not have time to ride them. 

 

I read a bit about the history of the line. Yes I think it used to extend into Kitakyushu more, and there was also a short branch going parallel to the heavy rail line out of Kurosaki, where the existing line veers to the left. 

 

There were not many people riding the trams anywhere that I saw (perhaps relatively more in the Kurosaki terminal). The time was around mid-day so perhaps rush hour is different. This is probably one of the relatively few remaining interurbans of the world, it's really hard for them to survive.

 

I think they run parallel to heavy rail between Kurosaki and the next station. It was hard to find parking for the car there, so I drove by and then ended parking and walking around Kurosaki Station where I think they are separated from the trains by a wall of the station.

Edited July 30, 2023 by disturbman
unnecessary quote :)

[Kamome]

Yes, there is quite a wide road where the track used to run to a now, rather decrepit, shopping area called Cha Cha town which used to be one of the service depots called Sunatsu . There is the main Nishitetsu Kitakyushu bus depot but zero remanence of any tram infrastructure as the line used to stretch to Moji. I believe the shopping area was built over the site. It seems a shame that the majority of the network was removed after its closure in 2000.

 

Somewhat ironically Nishitetsu now run Mercedes bendy buses along the same route which they’ve named BRT, despite the sizeable gap in time of the railway being dismantled and these buses starting service. 

 

As for the 2000 series there used to be one running,  possibly Unit 2003, on special event days but I think that finished sometime last year. There also used to be a rather sorry looking blue one outside of the depot in Kurosaki but again, I haven’t been to the area for some time so it may have gone. 

 

Here are 4 of mine, I also have the last release blue version and a model of Nogata station someone was showing at a Kurosaki depot open day pre covid

 

 

Update 19/08/2023

 

The 2000 series are now no more. I found out the other day that the last remaining running one was moved to the Kyushu Railway shop in Nogata as one of their static displays, including a C12, D51 slug along with their 9600. 

 

It seems the other static one in blue has been removed from Kurosaki depot too. https://maps.app.goo.gl/WvwP4empCtRvC1EA7?g_st=ic

Edited August 19, 2023 by Kamome