Hi guys just a quick intro Ant from New Zealand

[cteno4]

Tony,

 

sorry i thought i had caught all of those! Somehow when i was using the stylus to make the dots at some point a dozen or so dots got shifted slightly. I thought i had redone them all. Yes those 4 red dots should be slid to the left a bit to where your blue dots are isolating both ends of the those two points. 

 

What I did in this pass was sort of the minimal block wiring with isolated sidings. There are a few places in the yards there and where they connect onto the main line where you could potentially add a few more blocks into doing more operations, but i figured since you are just a 2 throttle operation you will only be running one of the mainlines when you are moving stuff in and out of the yard. It would take a third trotted and 3 way rotary switches [as opposed to dpdt switches] to try to run both mainlines at once while fiddling in the yard. But your yards kind of dump onto the mainline there directly so they dont lend themselves well to having a train running on the mainline while you move stuff around on the yard attached to that mainline. 

 

There is one small issue with the yard ladder in the lower right. Since there is no track piece in the ladder to use as a feeder so you have to power that ladder from the mainline block thru the power routing from the point to the yard off the mainline. Should work ok. You could see if you slipped a small track section between the mainline point and the first point on the yard ladder and then isolate the whole yard ladder at the mainline point and feed the yard ladder points thru that new small track piece at the base of the ladder.

 

Start looking at how you need to set the power blocks to do different operations you were thinking of doing to see if this needs to be modified some to fit your knoodling on how you wanted to run things. I kept it simple at the mainlines just being 4 blocks each with side loops and the center passing siding on each side. You could break the side loops in half so you can pause a train there so you can use the mainline in the yard to move something in.out fast then resume the mainline train, but then more switches on your panel and 6 switches to set for a mainline run instead of 4. This stuff is alway about tradeoffs in flexibility vs ease of use. If you think you want to pause trains in places on the mainline while you fiddle in the yard you can just add some blocks to the mainlines. If the mainlines are on its own control panel then it’s pretty easy to figure out and flip a few more switches. I expect you will usually be keeping throttle A on the outside look and throttle B on the inside loop so you wont be changing throttle much just turning tracks on and off. To help with this you might color code the block witches [you can get little colored vinyl fingers to put on the switches] so that the outer blocks all have one color and inner a different color to remind you like blue is usually flipped up to cab A and green is usually flipped down for cab B

 

When wiring all of this the big thing will be being careful you are keeping the polarity correct to all the blocks so they are consistent polarity to both cabs everywhere. This makes your head hurt at first but it will come clear and just have to keep thinking on your wire colors to each block so they work out working in harmony. 

 

For the control panel you might try just doing a temporary heavy cardboard or thin scrap ply control board at first and then test out the spacing and location of the switches before you make your final board. Just put the unwired switches into holes in your board to see what is comfortable and also how big/thick your graphics need to be for you to easily see what is going on. Control boards get crazy fast. You have to exaggerate the track plan unless the board is huge as the real track plan is just too tight to fit in switches and see the track plan well. Take a look on youtube and you will see some ideas to see what speaks to you visually as i find some dont work for me visually that others find optimal.

 

The panel is going to get dense in the yards will all the point and block switches. This is why I think maybe breaking the two yards off into thier own panels may help. Only issue here is in the yards the block for the main places they dump onto the mainline would be on a different mainline board. But i dont think this is an issue as that block will usually be on all the time to the cab you usually use on each mainline. Think about moving the one yard panel over in front of the other yard so you are not having to look over your shoulder at a distance and mentally be rotating things from looking over your shoulder and then down at the panel. Its much easier if you are just looking up and down from the panel to the layout.

 

cheers,

 

jeff

 

 

[Antnz]

Jeff

 

Thank you again for that, at least you can see that i am paying attention and studying your diagrams carefully. Again i will print this out and read it through carefully, but i can see breaking the yards into there own control panel is the way to go, and on there own side of the layout but close to the controllers.

I think i can get a peace of track between the ladder and the main line i will look at that today, and look at every thing else as well, i feel as if im moving forward i knew this part was going to be the hardest for me its a good job your here Jeff

I will read through this again and then have a good tidy up out there, it gets so cluttered so fast, perhaps im just a messy modeler 

 

Cheers

 

Tony 

[cteno4]

Tony,

 

you are most welcome again. Glad it’s been helpful and getting your brain wrapped around it. It’s mostly that, getting you seeing the main idea then you will take off on the details then. Ive been around this tree quite a few times in the last 5 decades and walked into my number of corners! You are catching on well as you caught my boo boo right away. Bad on me experimenting on doing something like this on the ipad with my new Apple pencil and not just jumping on the laptop with the mouse!

 

No worries we all go at these projects in different ways! Important thing is to keep your momentum up well, but dont rush your self into corners and mistakes. It’s a balance and needs input from your personality. Some are very risk adverse and just a few mistakes can really sour them so they need to be slower and more methodical. Others love rushing in and dont care if they make some mistakes and keeping their speed up is more important to them. Thing is to find your pace and keep to that balance as much as you can to keep things goign and you enjoying it all! Getting things like the trains running is a big big hump and this is a good sized layout and a bit of wiring using the block control. Nothing complex just a fair bit of it to get thru.

 

With your little pwm boards you have you can think about turning them into wired walkaround throttles. You would just need a 4 conductor cable that is like 16g or 18g wire. You run the 12v out on two wires and the other two are the return power wire to the layout. Simple just need some heavier wire for it. Like a 4m piece for each throttle will let you easily walk around or sit in one area with throttle in your lap. Can make little holders for the handhelds at each side of the layout at the yard control panels.

 

You might look at wiring up your mainline first and getting those two loops working and fastened down first. This way you can wire it up to two throttle and at least run trains around the mainline as you then work on the yards. Running trains now and then to take a break is very good to keep you playing and seeing where you are going. Then it lets you keep testing every bit as you add it on by just temporarily wiring up segments as you add them. Helps you see the process and it gets faster and lest prone to errors as well and find ways to speed the process or do it better. The mainlines are pretty simple, it’s the rest that will be more the wiring headache! I would even say wire the points of the mainline first into some, test bcd circuits to get that process and structure all laid out as well.

I would not fasten your track down until your wiring is all done. If for some reason you get fed up with a control panel for all the block wiring you can always just pull the insulating joiners and use the mainline feeds to turn the layout back into a point power wiring layout. Should work ok that way as well. Always good to not paint yourself into a corner and have a backup. Once you are happy with the wiring then glue down your track as pulling it up once glued is a real PITA. With sectional track like this you could even not glue [except on your bridge module junctions] and just drill holes in the roadbed and push in like 1” pins at angles. Would be plenty of stability and easy to pull up if you need to. Will hold it well enough in place and even more in place once you add scenery up to the roadbed.

 

Keep breathing, it’s a marathon more than a sprint!

 

cheers,

 

jeff

[Antnz]

Jeff

 

Wow all good advice yet again, i will concentrate on my bridge today while i take in all your wiring advice, i have already looked at the lower ladder section and yes i will insert a section of track there between the mainline and the ladder, i will loose some length but as you say its a trade off. I am trying to slow down but it is fun so that's hard, but yes i don't want a big mistake at this stage i wont be in to much of a hurry to glue everything down, Evan thinking about your idea of perhaps just tacking it down in a temporary sort of way.

I want to place Neo magnets under the track for uncoupling that will slow me down some i think, but i will do some experimenting first.

I did a test section with gluing a couple of peaces of track with silicon sealer, its stuck and would take some lifting so i think i have a way ahead for my bridge section, i don't think i will need to use the brass screws or the PCB copper board. I should be able to just glue and the cut through the track and road bed with my cut off wheel nice and clean and tidy.

Well Jeff see you in a few weeks LOL

Thank you again

Cheers

 

Tony

[cteno4]

Tony,

 

might experiment with pins in the track. Just drill some small holes at an angle into the edge of the road bed from each side and sink some pins in. Im thinking it could hold your track quite well and leave you open to easily pulling it up if needed. Ive used pins to hold track in place into wood while lining everything up before screwing things down and it’s worked well. But there i was just using the vertical screw/nail holes. Going in at a 45 from each side might be quite sturdy. Just drop of paint then on the pin head to cover it up like ballast. Could put a drop of pva just under the pin head to lock it in place, but you could still easily pop it loose later with needle nose pliers as pva doesn’t really bond chemically to plastic or metal more of just a space filling bond. Experiment!

 

Yeah magnetic uncouplers are a whole nother ballgame to have to experiment with. I never used the magnamatic kadees and such. I did have decent success in the old days with the old rapido electromagnet rapido coupler uncouplers. Noisy suckers and took some practice but got good at it. I even converted one of my yards to a hump yard as i could run it over the uncoupler and stop right at the uncoupler and the cars would roll down the yard some.

 

dont worry if it takes you a few tries getting track cut well. It’s a bit of a practiced art using a cut off wheel, but you get the hang of it after a while. Again a scraficial piece of track is your friend! Luckily the little cut off discs are cheap!

 

jeff

[Antnz]

Jeff

 

One last question then i will leave you alone before you pull your hair out LOL, for my main power lines to connect them to my controllers i could only think of cutting the plugs of some Tomix track feeders and soldering the plugs with attached cable to my main power cable so i can plug them into my controllers, is this what most would do ?? i cant see another way to wire into my Tomix controllers

I can see that my main power cables will be wired into my plug sockets at the bridge section, i think this will be correct and of course the power drops wired to the main power cables , and continue the main power cable across under the bridge section.

I have also added a photo of my practice track glued down a bit messy but it does hold firmly i think id only put dobs of sealant next time in a few spots only and weigh down till set.

[cteno4]

Tony,

 

no worries!

 

Easiest way is to just snip off the plug end a few inches and solder on your main power cable to your terminal strip that it will distribute from to your block control panel wiring. Best to use your 18g wire here. Unfortunately the tomix wire is pretty wimpy, but why you want it for a shorter section rather than long [the longer the skinny wire the more the voltage drop potential]. Just strip each wire end and retwisting clean. Then pretin both ends and you can put them next to each other and just hit with the soldering iron to fuse them. Remember to have a pice of heat shrink on the wire up the insulation to then pull over exposed wire and hit with a heat gun to shrink up and reinstate the joint.

 

Silicone seal or caulking works well to hold down track. You can get it up, but it takes some prying and such and picking of caulking off the track for reuse. Yep you dont need a lot with silicone sealant as it sticks pretty well to plastic and EPS. Personally I’ve never liked gluing track down, im a screw guy, hence why my brain went to using the pins! But like a lot of things in the hobby there are a lot of personal preferences or things that have just worked better for others or just work better in different hands.

 

Now get back to work!

 

cheers

 

jeff

[Antnz]

Jeff

 

Thank you and yes i will leave you alone now and get back to cleaning up my messy layout, but thank you for confirming me me i can proceed with an easy mind

 

Cheers

 

Tony