Japan Travel 2022

[kuro68000]

I just had a phone call from ANA. The flight time has increased by 2 hours due to the invasion of Ukraine. Looking at Flight Radar they now take the southern route over Europe and China.

 

 

It's such a ridiculously round-about route. They have to go south to avoid Ukraine and the Black Sea, then straight over to Bejing, turn south again to avoid North Korea, and then finally to Tokyo. There is no tracking between Kazakhstan and east China, but I have a feeling they turn south to avoid flying over Mongolia, based on the angle that they come into Beijing at.

 

I think I've been on a similar route to that before, when I came back from Japan via South Korea. Had a momentary panic in Korea, put my ticket in the machine and it said "wrong airport". I didn't realize I had to get the train to a different airport in Seoul to make the transfer. The train ticket machine didn't take cards so I had to get some cash. It was easy in the end though, and British people don't need a visa to enter the country for short periods.

 

Coming back is a different route for some reason.

 

 

Again, they have to turn south to avoid Russian airspace. I've never been further west than Spain so this will be new. I wonder if there will be good views of Iceland and Greenland.

 

I wonder why they use a different route coming back? It seems to be slightly slower. Wind maybe?

 

11.5 hours was bad enough before, 13.5 is... And it means that I will arrive 2 hours later into the evening, and have to get to Haneda for 7:30 AM on the way back instead of a more leisurely 9:30 AM. Still, first world problems, it's obviously much worse for the Ukrainians.

[disturbman]

6 minutes ago, mojo said:

There is no tracking between Kazakhstan and east China, but I have a feeling they turn south to avoid flying over Mongolia, based on the angle that they come into Beijing at.

More like to avoid flying over Russia and North Korea as there are no path north of South Korea. In any case, afaik, Chinese airspace is heavily regulated and they are but a few corridors available. Flights have been taking the southern route, and more recently the western Polar route, since Russia close its airspace to Western/Japanese flights in retaliation for the sanctions.

The switch between both routes is probably wind, https://www.airlinerwatch.com/2022/03/the-polar-route-to-japan-is-back-as.html.

[cteno4]

Beats my first trip to japan in ‘84 just starting grad school. I got invited to a scientific meeting in Kyoto 5 days before it started. Luckily a friend from college was working in the student travel agency renowned for getting cheap seats and was able to get me a very cheap ticket. But it came at a price, I got the pacific rim tour…

 

San Francisco to LA

2hr layover in LA

LA to Anchorage

Kicked off the plane for 2 hrs to clean the plane into a hall with about 25 seats total

Anchorage to Seoul

4 hrs in Seoul (no visa or customs so could have gone into town)

Seoul to Osaka

 

just about 24 hrs. This after 4 days with little or no sleep getting my presentation ready for the meeting. I hit japan looking like something the cat threw up.

 

jeff

[chadbag]

back in April I bought (refundable, changeable) tickets for the family to go to Japan in December.  I figured that if Japan opened the prices would go sky high so wanted to lock in the price (which was not particularly great compared to the pre Covide prices I paid the last few times).  Around June or July, I found out that our SLC-LAX leg had been canceled due to airline scheduling changes  (I was never notified, but logged into Chase to check and they had a flag on the itinerary -- I got the tickets through Chase using points).  I talked to Chase back then and they couldn't find a replacement but I said I would just hang tight as there was still about 5 or 6 months to go and airline schedules seem to change all the time this year.  Sure enough, a non-direct flight to LAX popped up that would work -- going over PHX (Arizona).  This past Saturday, since we are a little over a month away from flight time, I decided to look into officially getting our flights updated with the new PHX flight and I logged in and there was another Warning check and the airline website showed the itinerary only having our return flight  back from Japan.  

 

Ruh-roh

 

We had been scheduled to go SLC -- LAX -- KIX (or SLC -- PHX -- LAX -- KIX if I had gotten the new segment in) but in searching the AA.com I did not find ANY flights at all from SLC -- KIX  (our flights were JAL codeshare with AA except the domestic USA segments which were AA flown of course).

 

Monday I did search using OSA as the destination, which will use any Osaka area airport, and found a bunch to Itami, Okayama, Takamatsu, Nagoya, etc.  So I called Chase, and told them the problem and they were able to rebook us at not cost, since it was due to airline schedule changes, on the same day SLC -- DFW -- HND -- ITM.  (Our return had already been ITM -- HND -- DFW -- SLC so we're just doing the reverse now instead of landing at KIX).  We have to get up an hour or two earlier and the flight to Haneda from DFW is like 13.5 hours or something :(.   Flyig backward to go forward kind of sucks.  My big fear is that every time I am in an airplane or trying to get on an airplane in DFW there are delays due to thunderstorms or other issues.  Crossing my fingers that doesn't happen this time.

 

Since my sister in law lives in Kobe (near the baseball stadium where they play the HS baseball championships in the summer), ITM is actually more convenient in that regard as she may be able to just pick us up instead of taking the Kansai airport express and then transferring to a Kobe bound train etc.  So now I am trying to set up everything, get rail passes, etc.  I still need to officially ask for time off from work but the boss knows about this trip...

 

We've never flown to or from ITM before.  It is near where my MIL used to live before she passed on, so e would see and hear the planes coming in to ITM...

 

[kuro68000]

1 hour ago, chadbag said:

back in April I bought (refundable, changeable) tickets for the family to go to Japan in December.  I figured that if Japan opened the prices would go sky high so wanted to lock in the price (which was not particularly great compared to the pre Covide prices I paid the last few times).

 

That was my plan too. Seems to have paid off too.

 

1 hour ago, chadbag said:

So I called Chase, and told them the problem and they were able to rebook us at not cost, since it was due to airline schedule changes, on the same day SLC -- DFW -- HND -- ITM.

 

I guess you couldn't use your Chase points for the shinkansen.

 

1 hour ago, chadbag said:

Flyig backward to go forward kind of sucks.

 

Yeah. Unfortunately with the way they do hub and spoke it's often the cheapest, or the only option. My wife recently did Southampton to Manchester. Coach was £15 but took 6 hours (it's about 230 miles). Direct flight was £100, cheapest flight was £60 but via Amsterdam or Paris. The train was either about 5 hours and some silly money, or you could do it for more than the cost of the flight and changing twice in London, total time about 5 hours if I recall.

 

For Japan, I prefer direct flights. ANA and JAL cost a bit more than the only other direct carrier, BA, but it's worth every penny. British Airways is terrible. I've been with Finnair via Helsinki a few times, it was okay but does increase travel time and the service isn't as good as ANA or JAL. I can't remember who I went with via Korea... I remember LOT (Polish) was an option but it wasn't them.

 

The food on ANA and JAL is better, the staff are better, the kit they give you is better, and you get more leg room. The only potential issue is that the in flight entertainment has less English stuff on it, which is great for me as I get to discover some more Japanese movies and shows, but might not be so good if you have kids.

[Guest]

I too prefer ANA over other carriers, they’re still one the few with first class.  But I wasn’t willing to pay the $27K, so just flew business this time.  I don’t remember paying that much for the previous first class trips with them.  Probably more in the $12K range.   But I guess they’re making up for the past 2.5 years as fast as they can.

 

Anyways, couldn’t resist this bento, as I always regretted not buying one on previous trips...

 

 

 

Edited November 9, 2022 by Bob Martin

[chadbag]

20 hours ago, mojo said:

For Japan, I prefer direct flights. ANA and JAL cost a bit more than the only other direct carrier,

Yes we prefer direct flights as well. For us that means direct from the major gateway out of the US as I don’t think there are any direct Japan flights from Salt Lake City.  (There used to be a Delta flight to Tokyo a few times a week and we took that once — best trip I ever had to Japan in terms of getting there). 
 

We used to get free tickets through Delta skymiles back when I used Amex for everything and also ran my own business and used the business skymiles Amex.  But at the time Delta didn’t fly to Japan so we had to go Korean Air as the Skyteam member who flew there from the US.  So many of our early trips to Japan were via Seoul with usually a longer layover there.  Really sucked.  I’ve since moved my credit card spending to mainly Chase and so use their program for our cheap or free flights through points.  
 

So now we can take whatever airline has the route or price or whatever criteria we use to decide.   I try to avoid US airlines native flights. They’re always the suckiest.  Delta seems to be ok and the wife took them when her mother was diagnosed with cancer.  Most airlines are part of larger “teams” or alliances (Skyteam, one world, star alliance etc)  and have partner airlines that fly to Japan. So I always try and get the US airlines  codeshare flights on their foreign partners flights. Or book directly with the foreign airline, whether they have a US partner it are standalone like Singapore.  As mentioned these flights usually have more room, better food, better service and amenities, etc.  

 

our last trip and this one were through American Airlines but on JAL flights. 

Edited November 9, 2022 by chadbag

[matt_d10]

On 11/8/2022 at 12:10 PM, mojo said:

Again, they have to turn south to avoid Russian airspace. I've never been further west than Spain so this will be new. I wonder if there will be good views of Iceland and Greenland.

On that return flight if the sun is up by the time you’re there you should get amazing views of Greenland! Otherwise a chance to spot the northern lights…

 

The reason for the different route back is the overland route costs considerably more in airways fees (every country you transit will need to be paid!) and the flight times are probably fairly similar. Further issues are to fly those “polar” routes, aircraft need certain equipment fitted (long range data connection and polar survival kit) so it’s a balancing act of costs vs revenue. 

I’ve booked a trip to Japan for March next year for 8 days and taking my girlfriend with me for her first ever visit. She’s somewhat apprehensive as she’s vegetarian but I’ve assured her all will be ok! We’re planning on staying in the Tokyo area with the odd day trip, probably just using a Tokyo wide pass or similar JR East pass as we wouldn’t get the full usage from the rail pass. For some reason she’s not as keen to sit on trains all day…go figure!

[kuro68000]

3 hours ago, matt_d10 said:

On that return flight if the sun is up by the time you’re there you should get amazing views of Greenland! Otherwise a chance to spot the northern lights…

 

I'll remember to try to get a seat on the port side by a window, so I can see anything interesting on the way back.

[kuro68000]

I'm trying to do the Visit Japan Web registration stuff. Never used it before, it's handy to have all the forms filled out instead of having to do it on the plane.

 

I can't get the quarantine page to load though. It just spins forever. Hopefully it's a temporary problem! Anyone used it recently?

[Madsing]

Yes. I am flying to Tokyo on Monday. Visit Japan Web worked well for me a few days ago. It’s well designed and much easier to use than the mySOS application that was available until the beginning of November. 

[kuro68000]

Thanks. I've been trying it all morning and it's not working for me. I'm not going for another week so hopefully it will be fixed soon.

 

Enjoy your trip!

[Tony Galiani]

I am wondering how the airport experience has been in Japan recently?

We just got back from Germany and while our flights went well the airport experience at both Frankfurt and at JFK was pretty poor.  JFK was a particular mess - we changed our flights to get home earlier and were directed to a different terminal on the Air Train - which wasn't running.  Shuttle buses required a call from Customer Service - which wasn't open.  Had an interesting discussion with the Delta rep who did not know about either of these issues!  We worked it out - convoluted process of going through security then via an internal airport shuttle but I feel bad for anyone who is not experienced as help was not forthcoming.

Thinking Japan would be a bit more organized and customer service focused but is that really the case?

Ciao,

Tony

 

 

[kuro68000]

I've heard that Heathrow is a mess too, and there may be disruption from Just Stop Oil protests.

 

I also saw this interesting look at risk when flying: https://www.isi.edu/~hardaker/news/20221106-ietf-c02-analysis/

 

CO2 is a useful proxy for measuring COVID exposure risk, although I think the numbers on the aircraft are exaggerated because in the passenger cabin usually about 50% of air is recycled through a HEPA filter, which should prevent the spread of the virus. This guy turned on the air jet over his seat too, probably a decent idea as it will create an area of slightly lower pressure around him.

 

The airports were actually not too bad. Crowded but plenty of fresh air, it seems. I think the main danger will be getting droplets from other people on you, rather than airborne transmission.

 

I've been testing out various masks in preparation for travelling. Settled on Moldex FFP3 masks with good seals. The only issue is that ANA do not allow masks with valves to be used on the aircraft, for obvious reasons. So my plan is to place an extra large size cloth mask over the valve. Should provide at least as much protection as simply wearing the cloth mask. I couldn't find a non-valved mask that fit well.

 

At Heathrow there is no requirement to be masked at all (although I will).

[Madsing]

I flew to Tokyo Narita on Nov 6th, my flight landed on time at 5pm and I was on the Narita Express 44 at 6:15pm. That was the beginning of the reopening and there was almost no queue at quarantine check and immigration. Upload all documents on Visit Japan Web (https://vjw-lp.digital.go.jp/en/) the week before flying. Have all three QR codes ready to show at any time. I am going again on Monday next week, I hope the airport will not be too crowded.

[railsquid]

Once the PCR-on-arrival requirement was dropped, and you have whatever QR codes etc. are required this month, I think things are pretty much back to normal as far as airport entry goes. I have fond memories of arriving back in August and seeing a horrendously long line of no-longer-required folding chairs lined up along the corridor at Narita for international arrivals.

 

 

UK and back was a mixture of N95 (painful) and normal masks.

 

It is gratifying to note that so far, most of the obvious tourists in Tokyo are doing the whole when-in-Rome-Edo thing mask-wise.

Edited November 30, 2022 by railsquid

[railsquid]

Though I should point out that it is perfectly reasonable not to wear a mask when outside and not actively conversing with nearby persons, as per Official Government Advice (in hot weather I was one of the rebellious ca. 20% who actually followed that), but now that it's a bit chillier, it's actually quite nice to have some warming cover between your respiratory bits and the actual air.

[kuro68000]

2 hours ago, railsquid said:

Though I should point out that it is perfectly reasonable not to wear a mask when outside and not actively conversing with nearby persons, as per Official Government Advice (in hot weather I was one of the rebellious ca. 20% who actually followed that), but now that it's a bit chillier, it's actually quite nice to have some warming cover between your respiratory bits and the actual air.

 

My plan is to wear an FFP3 mask in all high risk situations, such as on trains at busy times. At other times I'll wear a more comfortable cloth mask. Maybe one of the Uniqlo ones that are supposed to be good.

 

The main issue I have with most masks is fogging up my glasses. A properly fitting FFP3 mask should not do that. All the others I tried, with various thicker parts around the nose, stuffing tissue in there, none of it works. I'm one of those people whose face is incompatible with most masks. I'm actually going to get some contact lenses tomorrow, but the last lot they gave me were useless as the prescription was wrong.

 

A tip I'd give anyone visiting Japan is that Japanese masks are on the small side and even the XL sized ones tend to be a bit tight for me. The same is true of most clothing, although ASICSs extra wide shoes fit my feet far better than any other and for some reason they don't sell them in the UK.

[Guest]

I just got back from 3 weeks in Japan.  I pretty much wore a mask anytime I was out of my hotel room. Which definitely is tiring, but can’t be avoided.  I rode the subway many many times packed in shoulder to shoulder rush hour without incident.  Most hotels I stayed at offered room service in lieu of the breakfast buffet, which was nice.  I did eat at the buffet more than room service, where gloves and mask required.  But you get the odd person... “DO I HAVE TO WEAR THEM?”  The Palace and Peninsula Hotels were exceptional (even providing small hand sanitizing bottles to use and take), mask holders and even eyeglass cloths.  Tokyo Station Hotel not quite as generous, but hand sanitizers and temperature checks everywhere.

 

When I arrived in Tokyo 11/1 I’d guesstimate mask usage at 99.9% and 98% (locals vs tourists respectively), then dropping to 98% and 50% towards the end.

 

All the app work required for arrival in Japan was a bit of a hurdle, but once you figure it out makes entry much easier.  Multiple QR codes and you can breeze through health control and customs.  Took less than 30 minutes from deplaning to in the car.

 

As for the aircraft, the air filters must work. It was a complete cough-a-thon on the return flight. Guy 2 seats away coughed NONSTOP for 9 hours, no mask (ignorant f***).  I just hunkered down in my seat pod and hoped for the best. Been back a week, no I’ll effects, so can attest masking and vaccine must work.

 

 

Edited November 30, 2022 by Bob Martin

[Kamome]

2 hours ago, Bob Martin said:

But you get the odd person... “DO I HAVE TO WEAR THEM?”

Thanks for explaining your experiences, Bob.

 

As an Expat in Japan, I’d urge everyone to be polite as we don’t want to be tarred with the same brush as those over-opinionated tourists.

 

I feel sorry for the hospitality staff who have to deal with these people. Japanese guests would be appreciative that the hotel had taken suitable steps to protect their customers as much as possible.

 

I’m sure the forum members, with an avid interest in the country,  would be happy to comply with the guidelines.  

 

For the non members

 

If you’re coming to Japan, remember it’s the country of manners and consideration to others. This kind of policy is everywhere across the country and is for everyone’s benefit. Some may question it but remember you’re a visitor, this is not your country so please accept it and kindly keep your opinions on the subject to yourself.

 

If you’re an obnoxious, ignorant sh**, who will kick off if you’re politely asked to wear a mask or use hand sanitizer , then perhaps Japan is not the place to visit.  

[maihama eki]

We returned Saturday from 10 days in Japan.

 

We had no issues with the Visit Japan web site, and getting through the health check, immigration, and customs at Narita was fast and easy with the QR codes available on the phone. We were through in around 30-40 minutes with much of that just walking time. Immigration was a bit of a line. We arrived around 3:30 PM on a Wednesday. It seemed like maybe one other plane arrived around the same time as us in Terminal One.

 

On departure from Narita, you can exit through immigration by just scanning your passport now. Very fast and easy. We departed on a Saturday at about 6:00 PM.

 

Narita is a shell of it's former self currently. A lot of the shops and restaurants are closed - especially land side in Terminal One. It's sad. Some of the stores seem to have left behind fixtures and signs as if they may reopen again, but otherwise they are closed and empty.

 

The United Club is still closed. We went to the ANA Club near gate 25. It's a fine club, but unfortunately windowless. It was moderately busy. There is another ANA club in Terminal One as well that may be larger. I barely remember being in it many years ago. There is a rumor that the United Club will reopen in spring, but I'm sure it will be dependent on travel levels. 

 

We were originally scheduled to fly into Haneda, but that flight was canceled a couple of months out and we were switched to Narita. I assume the flight was undersold.

 

We had a one week Japan Rail Pass. You still exchange a voucher for the pass once you arrive in Japan. We did that at Narita with a short wait in line. The pass is now in the format of a typical Shinkansen ticket - about the size of a business card. You run it through the reader like a regular ticket. No need to show it to an JR staff member at the ticket gates anymore. The pass has your passport number on it, and you may be asked to present your passport to prove that the right person is using the pass. That never happened to us. We were never asked to present the ticket on Shinkansens or local / express trains. You can also use the ticket to make seat reservations at one of the automated ticket machines. That was pretty easy too.

 

We saw a fair number of people that appeared to be tourists in Tokyo, but definitely less than 3 years ago.

 

We were early adopters on wearing a masks in 2020, but wearing one for 12 hours a day or more is a little tiring. At least it was cooler in the areas where we were. We wore them almost all the time in public, inside and outside only removing them when we were in spacious outside areas away from people - parks, outdoor hiking spots, etc. In restaurants, it is common among everyone - Japanese and others - to remove your mask after you order and only wear it when leaving the table for some reason. That seems acceptable to everyone. I don't know what will eventually break Japanese folks away from masking toward the way it was pre-pandemic. I think it is going to take a long time.

 

We had a great time in Japan - as usual. Autumn is so beautiful there.

 

[kuro68000]

Thanks everyone for sharing your experiences. I feel a bit safer and more confident visiting now.

 

Once I started wearing a mask some years ago I soon got used it and started feeling self conscious without it. With the mask on it's not instantly apparent that you are not Japanese, which is actually really nice because sometimes staff can be a bit too helpful with the English menu etc. I remember one guy in a coffee shop, one of the chains but I forget which. I asked for a latte in Japanese, and he asked what size and then proceeded to mime out the letters S, M, and L with his arms. It was... A bit of a shock, and apparently I felt more embarrassed about it than he did.

[Tony Galiani]

 Thanks for all the information.  We have gotten a bit out of the habit of wearing masks so good to know.  At my university, we still need masks on the buses and in clinics but not elsewhere.  We took masks with us to Germany but did not use public transit where they are supposed to be required.  The vast majority of our time was with family, outdoors or driving someplace so not much interaction where we felt we needed them.

 

My wife has made us custom masks with a washable filter fabric and we have cloth masks she made (from her Nippori Fabric Town stash).  So we will be sure to bring extras when we finally sort out a trip to Japan.

 

Sounds like the Japanese airports are better organized than some of the airports we have recently traveled through.  I could not help but think that it is a shame that so much of travel can be negatively impacted by the experience in airports and with transportation issues in general.

 

Ciao,

Tony

[chadbag]

We're leaving next week on the 9th.  to Itami through DFW and Haneda.  We'll see how it goes.

 

Have gotten our JR passes.

 

Have to do the Visit Japan Website this weekend.

 

Lots to do.

[kuro68000]

Coincidentally I'm flying on the 9th to Haneda as well. I'm starting to worry now as I still can't get the Visit Japan Web page for submitting quarantine documents to load. It just spins forever.

 

I also had an email from ANA this morning. It offered me the chance to bid on a seat upgrade to Premium Economy, the suggested bid being 40k yen plus 17k yen taxes. I'd be tempted if I thought it might be safer, but it's not like the cabin air is better filtered or anything like that. ANA seats have plenty of leg room anyway. Maybe I'll put in a low bid.