EM13 style loksound decoder

[Kiha66]

Some exciting news from Germany, esu is apparently working on an em13 style decoder that will be part of their loksound 5 family.  The German info was shared on Facebook.  This will go well with desktop station's sound files!  Good thing I already have a programmer on order. 

 

http://www.esu.eu/fileadmin/download/brochures/2021/52971_Fruehjahrsneuheiten_EEE_Digital_2021_DE_1.Auflage_eBook.pdf

[Martijn Meerts]

Huh.. Interesting that they're doing a LokSound one, but not a LokPilot one. Then again, ESU is seemingly convinced that their small sugar cube speaker has good sound quality 😉

 

[chadbag]

They also have two different KATO Lightboard ones for the typical suspects listed

 

LokSound 5 micro DCC Kato USA  -- the later chart shows two form factors 

 

[gavino200]

6 hours ago, chadbag said:

for the typical suspects listed

 

...which are?

[gavino200]

I can only guess they're rushing to get an easy to install sound decoder for the large KatoUSA steam engines like the GS-4 and the FEF-3. Those things sell like hot cakes and US modelers love to add sound to them. I guess the same is also true of the Kato ICE and TGV families in Europe. I do hope they develop a pilot version. At this stage I have a pile of un-converted trains. I have a few brand new EM13s but I think I'll sell them rather than install them. 

 

Anyone know if the Zimo EM13 type decoder made for the Kato ICE4 works for any Kato train that accepts an EM13?

[Kiha66]

I've done loksound installations in the kato GS4, and I think you're onto something there.  it'll defiantly save some space for future installations but still limited the lighting functions.  I wonder if this is part of their OEM factory decoders like their narrow hood kato/intermountain styles, and they've just decided to sell them to the public as well.   I wouldn't be too surprised to see some Japan N kobo custom with sound options in the future, like the offerings in their HO line.

[chadbag]

50 minutes ago, gavino200 said:

I can only guess they're rushing to get an easy to install sound decoder for the large KatoUSA steam engines like the GS-4 and the FEF-3. Those things sell like hot cakes and US modelers love to add sound to them. I guess the same is also true of the Kato ICE and TGV families in Europe. I do hope they develop a pilot version. At this stage I have a pile of un-converted trains. I have a few brand new EM13s but I think I'll sell them rather than install them. 

 

Anyone know if the Zimo EM13 type decoder made for the Kato ICE4 works for any Kato train that accepts an EM13?

 

I had a lengthy email discussion with a Zimo engineer.  He said there was nothing in the Zimo EM13 style decoder to preclude their use in any other EM13 train, but that they were not officially supported for anything other than the ICE4.  That was the gist of the conversation.  He had had reports of them working in various Japanese models -- again, not supported by Zimo.  He also let on that there may be an OEM relationship brewing...   He didn't know me from Adam but I am not sure it is public so I won't say more.  (And it is possible that it has fallen through or is still in negotiation).

 

[chadbag]

1 hour ago, gavino200 said:

 

...which are?

 

Based on the images shown in this doc:  http://www.esu.eu/fileadmin/download/brochures/2021/52971_Fruehjahrsneuheiten_EEE_Digital_2021_DE_1.Auflage_eBook.pdf

 

It appears at least one is similar to Digitrax DN163K4A  or DN163K1C/D  (TCS K1D4)

 

Unfortunately I don't see anything that resembles a Digitrax DN163K0x or any sort

 

Edited February 2, 2021 by chadbag

[Kiha66]

A DN163K4A  version would also be very welcome, I'd love to have sound in my DD51 or some of my American units.   I'm still going to be using EM13s for most of my JP trains which wont get sound, so if anyone decides to dump theirs let me know!

[chadbag]

I am using the DH05C on the EM13 project board.   That gives me RailCom etc without having the expense of sound for most of my units.  I am about to purchase a Zimo nano decoder to see if I can make it work with the project board with some creative soldering and isolation.   Mainly as a backup for the boards as D&H have to be imported from what I can tell.

[gavino200]

1 hour ago, chadbag said:

I am using the DH05C on the EM13 project board.   That gives me RailCom etc without having the expense of sound for most of my units.  I am about to purchase a Zimo nano decoder to see if I can make it work with the project board with some creative soldering and isolation.   Mainly as a backup for the boards as D&H have to be imported from what I can tell.

 

I think I'll be doing the same. I can't remember if I bought some of those from you or if we talked about it and I changed my mind. I'll have to look in my box of decoders. The ICE Zimo is a sound decoder right? So fairly expensive I'm guessing. 

[gavino200]

1 hour ago, Kiha66 said:

A DN163K4A  version would also be very welcome, I'd love to have sound in my DD51 or some of my American units.   I'm still going to be using EM13s for most of my JP trains which wont get sound, so if anyone decides to dump theirs let me know!

 

I'll be letting go of mine as soon as I work out a replacement. I'd like to have Railcom in all my new installs. 

[chadbag]

1 minute ago, gavino200 said:

 

I think I'll be doing the same. I can't remember if I bought some of those from you or if we talked about it and I changed my mind. I'll have to look in my box of decoders. The ICE Zimo is a sound decoder right? So fairly expensive I'm guessing. 

 

They make both a sound and non-sound Zimo ICE decoder in EM13 format.  Mine is a non-sound in my ICE4 as the non-sound was the first one released.

 

[gavino200]

Just now, chadbag said:

 

They make both a sound and non-sound Zimo ICE decoder in EM13 format.  Mine is a non-sound in my ICE4 as the non-sound was the first one released.

 

 

Does the Zima have railcom? I'm guessing it doesn't. Or is it because of cost that you're continuing to use the custom DH solder-in solution?

 

[chadbag]

Just now, gavino200 said:

 

Does the Zima have railcom? I'm guessing it doesn't. Or is it because of cost that you're continuing to use the custom DH solder-in solution?

 

 

Yes it does have RailCom.

 

The Lemke (Zimo) EM13 compatible decoder for ICE4 is hard to get (often out of stock) and is expensive (lists at 32.14 euro export price, ie non-VAT) at Lippe.   The DH05C-0 at lippe is 23.45 euro and the EM13 board is not a lot since I had a whole ton made.

 

The Zimo made one is a special for Lemke so it is not listed on the Zimo website and is therefore sold through Lemke.

 

Plus I had already decided on the DH line of decoders and the EM13 board before the Zimo one came out.    I am open to switching to something else for future needs if something better comes along.

[gavino200]

9 minutes ago, chadbag said:

 

Yes it does have RailCom.

 

The Lemke (Zimo) EM13 compatible decoder for ICE4 is hard to get (often out of stock) and is expensive (lists at 32.14 euro export price, ie non-VAT) at Lippe.   The DH05C-0 at lippe is 23.45 euro and the EM13 board is not a lot since I had a whole ton made.

 

The Zimo made one is a special for Lemke so it is not listed on the Zimo website and is therefore sold through Lemke.

 

Plus I had already decided on the DH line of decoders and the EM13 board before the Zimo one came out.    I am open to switching to something else for future needs if something better comes along.

 

Cool. I'd be interested in buying some of those boards from you if you can spare a few. I love those tiny DH decoders anyway. They're my go-to for any install that's in anyway difficult. Obviously I'd need the unwired version, right?

[Kiran]

On 2/2/2021 at 4:18 PM, chadbag said:

I am using the DH05C on the EM13 project board.   That gives me RailCom etc without having the expense of sound for most of my units.  I am about to purchase a Zimo nano decoder to see if I can make it work with the project board with some creative soldering and isolation.   Mainly as a backup for the boards as D&H have to be imported from what I can tell.

I have 3 Zimo Em13 type decoders if you want to have them. I haven't had any luck getting them to work with trains other than the ICE4.

[chadbag]

3 hours ago, Kiran said:

I have 3 Zimo Em13 type decoders if you want to have them. I haven't had any luck getting them to work with trains other than the ICE4.

 

I'll text you my address.   I'd like to test them.  Once we see if there is a problem with them or you were having some other problems, you can decide what to do with them.

 

The Zimo engineer said there was no official support but they had had feedback of them working in Japanese trains.

[cbet]

This is an interesting topic.  I'm new to DCC and have a few Kato JP trains that I will be converting, most with EM13 and FL12 from Kato.  I haven't bought any decoders yet, but researching where best to get them.  What are the differences or advantages of using alternate EM13 over Kato EM13, beside the obvious of sound in ESU LockSound?  I have mostly Shinkansens and not sure if sound is worth the the cost.  Are there other advantages?

[inobu]

13 minutes ago, cbet said:

This is an interesting topic.  I'm new to DCC and have a few Kato JP trains that I will be converting, most with EM13 and FL12 from Kato.  I haven't bought any decoders yet, but researching where best to get them.  What are the differences or advantages of using alternate EM13 over Kato EM13, beside the obvious of sound in ESU LockSound?  I have mostly Shinkansens and not sure if sound is worth the the cost.  Are there other advantages?

If you look at Kato USA and their dcc offering you will see Lok sound is at the top in price. This is because of the sound features. If ESU is making these decoders its because

Kato is going to deploy them in the Japanese market. There are only a few U.S trains that use these decoders so it substantiate the notion. 

 

When it comes to sound the Shinkansens sound is limited in both the proto and modeling world. There is not much to hear as the electric motors can be heard on start up

and the wheels take over sound wise after it builds momentum.  The Japanese is about station announcements and door opening because that is what they hear. We in the U.S.

cater to what we hear. The Prime mover and gate crossing.

 

The next thing is Railcom that is a whole discussion in itself.

 

Inobu

 

 

 

 

[Martijn Meerts]

On 2/6/2021 at 7:14 PM, cbet said:

This is an interesting topic.  I'm new to DCC and have a few Kato JP trains that I will be converting, most with EM13 and FL12 from Kato.  I haven't bought any decoders yet, but researching where best to get them.  What are the differences or advantages of using alternate EM13 over Kato EM13, beside the obvious of sound in ESU LockSound?  I have mostly Shinkansens and not sure if sound is worth the the cost.  Are there other advantages?

 

Kato's EM13 has a very limited feature set. If you install it, and the train ends up not running well for some reason, there's no way to finetune anything. With an ESU for example, you have several CVs that you can play around with to improve running characteristics for low, medium and high speed separately.

 

Their FL12 doesn't always work. I have 2 of them which I bought for a 151 series, but they don't work on that train. In the E5 and E6 shinkansen they do work, but programming them doesn't always work. I bought these mostly to test them, but I'll be replacing them with ESU function decoders at some point.

 

[chadbag]

So Modellbahnshop Lippe has the new Loksound decoders priced -- All the KATO / Atlas (EM13, KATO USA, etc) decoders are listed at 98,99 euro at Lippe. 

 

83,18 euro for outside the EU no VAT

 

[yaasan]

Hello, 

 

I have just updated OPEN SOUND DATA's English page and PDF instructions.

Currently we are developing new sounds for kiha283, 205.

 

OPEN SOUND DATA:

https://desktopstation.net/sounds/index_eng.html

 

Our all sound data files are available in ESU's LokSound5 micro DCC Kato Japan which is compatible with DCC Friendly system(EM13 type).

 

[Kiha66]

1 hour ago, yaasan said:

Hello, 

 

I have just updated OPEN SOUND DATA's English page and PDF instructions.

Currently we are developing new sounds for kiha283, 205.

 

Thank you so much for all your hard work, these files have been a great boon to Japanese railway modelers!  I hope we also get a DD51 type in the future.

[yaasan]

DE10 sound data is available but engine is not same.

 

https://desktopstation.net/sounds/osd54.html

 

DD51 sound is difficult because we don't have a chance to record these sounds.