Tokaido, Chuo and a hint of Iida

[TFW]

Coming from 0 gauge tinplate and being plagued by poor eyesight I have a steep learing curve before me.

So I hope for lots of advice!

Financial restrictions (son going to private school and daughter starting with university - need I say more?) will make this a rather slow affair and I really should avoid costly mistakes.

My long term interest would be a layout with a bit of double track mainline where some trains can circulate and a station where a branch leaves the mainline.

I will take it easy and not try to model a real station or line. 

For the mainline I have bought/preordered an EF58, EF62, EF65 1000, EF 65 0. I will buy rolling stock suitable for parcel/mail trains and probably some sleeper trains. For sleeper trains I prefer the look of the older 10 or 20 series cars.  I like the look of container trains, too, so some times I will add one.

For branch line servies I like the look of the older Lida electric rail cars, so will slowly try to start a small collection. I have not yet decided wheter to use ED62 as on the real Lida line or taking modellers licence to improve the branch and make it fit for the EF62/65.

 

I plan the branch line stations to take electric railcars up to 4 cars and the main line stations to take a loco with at least 7 coaches.

I will use Kato Unitrack and restrict rolling stock purchases to Kato products so I hope not to run into any compatibility issues and ease the learning curve.

 

And now some questions: is a radius of 315 sufficient for the proposed rolling stock? If I buy a sleeper express set the coaches seem to be fitted with some kind of short couplers - will these demand larger radii? I plan 315 on the branch and 315/348 on the main line.

On the main line I will use the 718mm points so there should be no problem. However what about the 481mm points and wye points - are these reliable? I would like to use them on the branch.

 

I now use a Hornby HM2000 controller and both of my Kato EF65 run very smooth and silent. However I think that there is some feedback built into this type of controller  and I am not sure whether I should use it or buy a Kato one instead?

 

As It will take a long time to buy the rolling stock and track I thougth that I could start with kind of play ground to learn the basics. I have two base boards available, each measuring 45x135 cm. I could build a small diorame for short 2 coach Lida electric railcars (or is it EMU?) and some small freight services.

 

I look forward to your input as I sure need all the help I can get!

 

Thomas

 

 

Edited March 2, 2020 by railsquid
fix typo in title

[railsquid]

3 minutes ago, TFW said:

And now some questions: is a radius of 315 sufficient for the proposed rolling stock? If I buy a sleeper express set the coaches seem to be fitted with some kind of short couplers - will these demand larger radii? I plan 315 on the branch and 315/348 on the main line.

 

315mm radius is plenty, I have 280mm radius on my layout and that is fine with Japanese rolling stock, including those fitted with close couplers,

 

[railsquid]

7 minutes ago, TFW said:

For branch line servies I like the look of the older Lida electric rail cars

 

Minor correction to avoid potential confusion - it's "Iida" line (capital "I").

[Sheffie]

Regarding curves. 315mm is the standard and I don’t think there’s a single model train that won’t handle it. 282mm is going to work with everything except possibly some Shinkansen? 249mm works with my close coupled Kato coaches, but my close coupled Minitown locomotives are on the limit here. I don’t have any 216mm or 183mm curves but there are a surprising number of trains that do handle 150mm. Look in the Rolling Stock forum for more on those. 

 

 

As someone whose eyesight is not too good, I just wanted to recommend something like this. 

 

Brightech LightView Pro Flex 2-in-1 Magnifying Glass LED Lamp - Lighted Magnifier with Stand & Clamp - for Desk, Sewing, Table - Bright Light for Read https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01K10XA1O/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apip_Nsm4IeC1pXI9A

 

The magnification isn’t very high but it makes a significant difference. The bright lighting helps me more, because I have astigmatism—brighter light means my irises narrow down, so I see more precisely. 

 

I use this for everything I do on my workbench, from painting to installing the little handbrake wheels on new Koki wagons, and I would hardly be able to enjoy the hobby otherwise. 

Edited March 1, 2020 by Sheffie

[Sheffie]

I have found the EP481-15 points to be perfectly reliable in general. I don’t think there’s much of a difference compared to the EP718-15 points. One neat advantage of the shorter points is that they include an R481-15 curve and four short straights (S60L and S60R, plus 2xS64), for setting up a nice spacing between sidings. 

 

I have had one problem when trying to run a DE-10, a quite small locomotive, over the points very slowly. It will often stall and need a push. 

 

Depending on the batch, some may have misleading labels on the underside, but if you’re not trying to alter the normal power switching behavior this won’t affect you. 

Edited March 1, 2020 by Sheffie

[TFW]

railsquid and Sheffie, thanks for your response, I just joined the forum and already got valuable information. Iida! Good to know the correct term, that will make searching the web for info more successfull. 

Good to know that 280mm radius and the shorter points are fine to use, that will add some flexibility to planning and it could help to visually differentiate the lines:

main line 348 minimum and 718 points and the branch down to 280mm and using shorter points.

 

Sheffie, you made a point about the magnifiying lamp - I think I really need one! Until now I haved not dared to fit the numberplates of my Kato locos, but with more magnification and light this could be feasible. 

Can the numberplates just plugged in or do i have to glue them down? I hope not - my unsteady fingers and glue!

 

Thomas

[Sheffie]

I’ve fitted number plates on three Kato locomotives, and I think none of them needed glue. In theory a pair of fine tweezers is good for this, but in practice fingers and fingernails offer a better grip. 

 

Listen to me, giving advice like a pro. One year ago I was utterly new to this!

Edited March 1, 2020 by Sheffie

[TFW]

6 minutes ago, Sheffie said:

 

Listen to me, giving advice like a pro. One year ago I was utterly new to this!

 

Just one year - that is fine so you have not yet forgotten how to do things! 😀

 

Having seen your thread, I think you are progessing at an amazing speed! 👍

 

No glue needed, that is assuring! But I will wait until the magnifiying lamp has arrived.

 

Thomas

[bill937ca]

A page on attaching number (license) plates. Can be translated with Google Translate.

 

http://www5a.biglobe.ne.jp/~toyoyasu/nbgn_10.htm

Edited March 1, 2020 by bill937ca

[TFW]

I ordered my first fancy express train: 

Kato 10-1335 Series 165 Iida Line Express "INA"

4 cars have to suffice by now. Later (much later...) I could combine two 4 car trains to an 8 car one. 8 cars will be the defining length for my stations. Either 8 car EMUs or engine and 7 cars.

I think 7 cars are long enough to give an expression of a mail or sleeper train. And I will combine the 2 car Iida EMUs to run as 3 or 4 car ones that should give a good difference between local and express trains. But for now the difference will be between 2 and 4 cars as even considerung the good value for money of Japanese N my hobby budget is proofing inadequate for the demanding expenditures of a fresh start into a new scale.

 

Thomas

 

[Das Steinkopf]

I like the concept that you have there, I was originally going to build an Iida sen layout with an alternate history, there were plans back in the JNR days for a line that would connect Chubu Tenryu to Tenryu Futamata on the Futamata sen, from there the line would then connect to the Tokaido Honsen at Kakegawa, sadly these plans were abandoned after about 40 to 50% of the line was built. I was going to have the line to Tenryu Futamata serviced by a mix of KiHa 75's and KiHa 25's for passengers and DD51's and DE10's on freight, I was also going to have freight run on the Iida sen mainly by EF64-1000's and EF210's. These plans have changed drastically though as I have now amassed a sizeable fleet of electric and diesel locomotives as well as a large number of KoKi's and TaKi's for container and fuel traffic. The layout I am working on is now more based on the Tokaido Honsen and will have a freight depot with a small locomotive depot nearby, there will be a flyover that connects the up line to the freight yard, there will also be an industrial area near the freight depot, I will have a station and urban setting on the other side. The mainline will a 1 in 48 gradient running down to the freight yard and back up to the station, the flyover will have a 1 in 24 gradient with the maximum height of 50mm between the lines. 

Edited March 14, 2020 by Das Steinkopf

[TFW]

It is strange to abandon a project that is already 40-50% finished, wonder what the reason was. If I ever need an excuse to buy some diesel rolling stock, I will look no further.....

 

I considered a track and bridge strenghtening programm  on the Iida line to use the redundant pusher engines from the Usui pass. As the gradiant on Iida is just 4%, only one of the EF63  per train could proof adequate. But I think in the long term a layout with different motive power on different lines is more interesting as to use the same rolling stock on all circuits.

 

You mentioned EF210 - the modern JR freight engines hauling long strings of container and tanker wagons are really tempting, I hope I can withstand the temptation for some years or I will never get enough rolling stock for my initial ideas. It is difficult enough for me not to buy a steamer by accident! Fortunately the Japanese rolling stock is great value for money. Long time ago I collected continental rolling stock, especially intermodal and container trains as used in alpine transit traffic. To build  long trains of Fleischmann rolling stock, one almost needs a 2nd mortgage or a lottery win.

 

Thomas

 

[Das Steinkopf]

My timeline is from around 2012 to current day, regarding the bridges I am unsure about the axle loading on some sections of the line, I know that the ED61's were modified into ED62's with the addition of a single axle mounted centrally to bring their axle weight down, that said I have seen photos of an EF58 pulling a short rake of ChiKi's over the Misakubo #6 bridge. If there was any bridge on the line that would be of concern it would be that one given the sheer length of it as well as curved nature of it, mind you there are god knows how many bridges along the line I lost count when I travelled along it in 2017.

 

Here is one of the photos of the EF58 with ChiKi's

http://innocentblue777.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-70.html

Edited March 15, 2020 by Das Steinkopf

[Das Steinkopf]

I found some information on a special freight service that was run along the line back in 1994, it was moving turbine parts for the Sakuma Hydroelectric Dam.

 

http://www.kei-zu.com/railroad/iida_line/1994/1994.html

[Das Steinkopf]

I found some more shots as well as video of EF58-157 working a rake of ChiKi's along the Iida sen.

 

https://takworld.michikusa.jp/train_world/tokusyu/kourin/ch4.htm

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 15, 2020 by Das Steinkopf

[TFW]

Great! I have an EF58 on order for my mail train, seems I can use it occasionally on Iida line,too! 

 

[TFW]

Sheffie, I have just put into service the EF6587, the magnifying lamp did the trick. would not have been possible for me to fit numberplates without. The biggest problem was what factory sign to use. Had to google for some pictures to know what sign fitted to the number!

 

Thomas

 

 

[TFW]

Just overspent my model railway budget for this year by ordering one more loco, a Kato ED62 to go with my Kato 10 1426 Iida line freight train. 

Thomas

[serotta1972]

15 hours ago, TFW said:

Just overspent my model railway budget for this year by ordering one more loco, a Kato ED62 to go with my Kato 10 1426 Iida line freight train. 

Thomas

 

Oh man, and it's only March - you're in trouble.  That's been the case for me since discovering all the online shops and of course the great selection of Japanese trains. 

[Das Steinkopf]

21 hours ago, TFW said:

Just overspent my model railway budget for this year by ordering one more loco, a Kato ED62 to go with my Kato 10 1426 Iida line freight train. 

Thomas

 

Well if you don't overspend your model railway budget for the year by March then you're truly not a railway modeller 😉 .

[TFW]

Did some testing of rolling stock, no problems on both the 481 mm and the 718 mm radius points, no derailments and no flickerung of lights even at  very slow speed.👍

 

 

 

 

 

Thomas W

Edited March 29, 2020 by TFW
Changed wrong picture, corrected spelling

[Morcs]

On 3/26/2020 at 2:59 AM, TFW said:

Just overspent my model railway budget for this year by ordering one more loco, a Kato ED62 to go with my Kato 10 1426 Iida line freight train. 

Thomas

 

It's a new financial year on 1st April so your budget can reset!

[TFW]

I need another Iida line railcar as I like the sight of a 4 car train. For exact speed  match the same typ of motor car as I already have would be best and just swap trailer cars for variety.

 

 

 

And I like the colours of my Kato Series 165 Iida Line Express "INA" 4 Cars Set, so next year I will try and buy a Kato Series 80-300 Iida Line (4-Car Set).

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thomas W