Kiso Forest Railway

[rogerfarnworth]

I have been trying to find out more about the Kiso Forest Railways and I have seen quite a few references to it in the modelling parts of the forum.

 

I am hoping to find a map if the network somewhere and perhaps find out some websites which give a little more than a general history. I can use translation software if the sites are Japanese.

 

Does anyone have some pearls of wisdom?

 

Best wishes

 

Roger

 

[katoftw]

https://www.google.com/search?q=木曽森林鉄道&oq=木曽森林鉄道&aqs=chrome..69i57.163802j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[rogerfarnworth]

Thank you, much appreciated.

 

Searching using English text only really produced the Wikipedia article and variants of it and the tourist website for the short narrow gauge railway still in use.

[rogerfarnworth]

Am I right is assuming that some of the lines in the forest had more than one name? I have no knowledge of Japanese, so it just might be that I am misunderstanding things. Is the Ogawa Line the same as the Owataki Line and is that the same as the Otaki Line? Sorry for my lack of understanding.

 

[Jstepson]

Some nice photos at this site http://www.dagashi.org/tro/kiso01.html

[rogerfarnworth]

I seem to have worked things out a bit now. It looks as though the Otaki Forest Railway ran north from Agematsu and the Ogawa Forest Railway ran south from the point where the Otaki Line crossed the Kiso River.

Edited February 14, 2019 by rogerfarnworth

[rogerfarnworth]

Hello again

 

I have been looking through quite a number of Japanese language blogs using translation software. I have enjoyed following a number of different Kiso Forest Railway routes.

 

Translation software is a real help for text but I struggle to understand some annotated drawings and maps. I wonder whether anyone is able to help me the this small part of a map. This is near Nojiri in the Kiso Valley. The main reiver is the Kiso River and the tributary is the  Aji River. The green lines are Forest Railway routes with the one leaving the left of the image being the Atera Line.

 

I am trying to work out what the black line is as well as wanting to know what is said  in white characters next to arrows and yellow characters.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Roger

Edited February 25, 2019 by rogerfarnworth

[rogerfarnworth]

It seems as though the black line was a ropeway for transporting timber to the sawmill on the East bank of the Kiso River.

[kevsmiththai]

Kiso Forest #7 is preserved in the USA. It used to live at the back of Moss Motors in Goleta California in its own shed. I photographed it in 1998 and after that it was moved to the San Luis Obispo RR Museum

 

film of that at

 

 

If you want some detail pics let me know

 

Kev

[rogerfarnworth]

Thanks Kev. I have been writing a few blogs about the Forest Railways of Japan. Any pictures you have would be great but please don't go out of your way to get them

 

Best wishes

 

Roger

[rogerfarnworth]

I am not sure whether it is reasonable to make this post. Please let me know if I should not do so. Over recent months I have been looking at the erstwhile narrow gauge railways in Kiso Forest. I am not an expert on Japanese railways, but I have thoroughly enjoyed working on a series of posts. I have been supported in doing so by one or two Japanese nationals.

 

To test the water, I am posting a link to the first of these blogs. It is an introduction to the Logging Railways in the Kiso Forest. Only a short tourist railway now remains of what was once a very large system of 762mm lines. The series of posts produced so far looks at a number of individual lines which made up the network.

 

It is possible that members of this forum may be able to point out any errors in the text but I hope that some will enjoy the contribution. ....

 

https://rogerfarnworth.com/2019/02/11/japanese-narrow-gauge-762mm-lines-part-2-the-kiso-railway-part-a/

[Martijn Meerts]

Well, this certainly is timely. I just recently picked up my forest railway project again, so reading about the Kiso Forest Railway (which is 1 of my sources of inspiration) is really nice. Especially the pictures are going to help a lot. I'll definitely be following this series of posts.

 

[miyakoji]

10 hours ago, rogerfarnworth said:

It is possible that members of this forum may be able to point out any errors in the text but I hope that some will enjoy the contribution. ....

 

https://rogerfarnworth.com/2019/02/11/japanese-narrow-gauge-762mm-lines-part-2-the-kiso-railway-part-a/

 

Excellent blog post Roger, many thanks.

[Khaul]

15 hours ago, rogerfarnworth said:

 

It is possible that members of this forum may be able to point out any errors in the text but I hope that some will enjoy the contribution. ....

 

https://rogerfarnworth.com/2019/02/11/japanese-narrow-gauge-762mm-lines-part-2-the-kiso-railway-part-a/

 

Hi Roger,

 

I have noticed your posts in Skyscrapercity, very nice. Something tells me you may enjoy the Katsumi Kazama books, for instance "The last glorious days of Japanese local private railways". 

 

Take a look:

https://www.google.com/search?rls=en&q="katsumi+kazama"+railways&tbm=isch&source=univ&client=safari&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj54_7apPLhAhUafSsKHfqUDG8QsAR6BAgJEAE&biw=1920&bih=887

 

Regards,

 

Pablo

[Khaul]

A better link, https://www.google.com/search?q=地方私鉄1960年代の回想&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiS6tHBpvLhAhVWdCsKHYTOBZ0Q_AUIDigB&biw=1920&bih=887

[Nick_Burman]

On 4/27/2019 at 6:17 PM, rogerfarnworth said:

I am not sure whether it is reasonable to make this post. Please let me know if I should not do so. Over recent months I have been looking at the erstwhile narrow gauge railways in Kiso Forest. I am not an expert on Japanese railways, but I have thoroughly enjoyed working on a series of posts. I have been supported in doing so by one or two Japanese nationals.

 

To test the water, I am posting a link to the first of these blogs. It is an introduction to the Logging Railways in the Kiso Forest. Only a short tourist railway now remains of what was once a very large system of 762mm lines. The series of posts produced so far looks at a number of individual lines which made up the network.

 

It is possible that members of this forum may be able to point out any errors in the text but I hope that some will enjoy the contribution. ....

 

https://rogerfarnworth.com/2019/02/11/japanese-narrow-gauge-762mm-lines-part-2-the-kiso-railway-part-a/

 

A small note... the Baldwins weren't the only steamers on the railway. There were other steam locos, built by Dai Nippon Kido (Amenomiya), O&K, Porter and Tateyama Heavy Industries. The Baldwins got the spotlight because they were the only steamers to survive past the early 1950's, all others being scrapped as they were just about clapped out after working flat out through WWII (the sole Tateyama loco, a copy of the Baldwins, was built in 1950 and scrapped in 1958, a victim of bad workmanship). In one of the pages there is a picture which you captioned as a Baldwin (I think it was on the Nojiri line), the loco looks more like a O&K rather (Kiso 10, 14 or 15).

 

If you can, try locating the "The Baldwins of Upper Pine" Trains magazine article (10/1959). Despite some errors it has a very good description of the railway as it was in the late 50's.

 

After dealing with Kiso you should consider trying your hand with some of the 1067mm shortlines which connected to the Chuo Line in the Kiso Valley, such as the Kita-Ena Railway at Nakatsugawa. Although it was an ordinary private electric railway many Japanese railfans consider it a forestry railway given its background (it was built to haul logs after a dam threatened closing a river floating route). And it had hoodoos of character...

 

Cheers Nicholas

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rogerfarnworth]

Dear Nicholas

 

Thank you for the comments. It looks as though you have looked through all the posts. Forgive my lack of knowledge .... 'O&K', I am sure I should know, what do the 'O' and 'K' stand for?

 

Best wishes

 

Roger

[Martijn Meerts]

Pretty sure you've already done this, but if not, do a Google image search on "木曽森林鉄道" (Kiso Forest Railway), lots and lots of great images there.

 

[rogerfarnworth]

Yes, already done so, Martijn, but thank you for the thought.

Edited April 30, 2019 by rogerfarnworth

[marknewton]

2 hours ago, rogerfarnworth said:

Dear Nicholas

 

Thank you for the comments. It looks as though you have looked through all the posts. Forgive my lack of knowledge .... 'O&K', I am sure I should know, what do the 'O' and 'K' stand for?

 

Best wishes

 

Roger

 

Orenstein und Koppel.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orenstein_%26_Koppel

 

Cheers,

 

Mark.

[rogerfarnworth]

On 4/28/2019 at 8:50 AM, Khaul said:

A better link, https://www.google.com/search?q=地方私鉄1960年代の回想&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiS6tHBpvLhAhVWdCsKHYTOBZ0Q_AUIDigB&biw=1920&bih=887

 

Thank you Khaul. Looks good. It seems to be a Japanese version of Pinterest?

[rogerfarnworth]

7 hours ago, marknewton said:

 

Orenstein und Koppel.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orenstein_%26_Koppel

 

Cheers,

 

Mark.

 

Thank you, Mark. Very interesting.

[rogerfarnworth]

I have enjoyed the responses. So, I'll take a chance and post another link. This post covers one of the main logging railway networks in the Kiso Valley. ... The Ohtaki Forest Railway.

 

http://rogerfarnworth.com/2019/02/16/japanese-narrow-gauge-762mm-lines-part-3-the-kiso-railway-part-b-the-otaki-forest-railway

[Martijn Meerts]

I'm not going to lie, all those images are making me want to give up on the N-scale layout, and fill the attic with forest railroads 🙂

 

[Khaul]

3 hours ago, rogerfarnworth said:

 

Thank you Khaul. Looks good. It seems to be a Japanese version of Pinterest?

 

It is just a image Google search in Japanse. I look for the author in English, then I found the book title in Japanese and put it in Google. The hard copies are far better.