Yamanote Minuto

[bill937ca]

"The Yamanote Line is one of the busiest train lines in the world. Running in a circle around the heart of Tokyo, it carries 3.5 million passengers a day. "

 

[to2leo]

Yikes, JR should make the trains and platforms 2 storeys high for that route.

[bc6]

Nice video, I think I may pick up a Yamanote model hopeully soon.

[Guest ___]

Yikes, JR should make the trains and platforms 2 storeys high for that route.

 

You know, I've given thought to a true double deck EMU, with multi-level boarding for a MRT type system. None of this double deck equipment where pax space was lost due to  internal stairs of bogie constraints.

[disturbman]

That's why he is (or should be) proposing a true "double decker", with no stairs inside and boarding at each levels.

 

I'm really quite used to see this type of train (meaning the normal double decker design) for heavily used commuter rail. I find it too a bit stupid when there is real over-crowding on small stretch. I think I allready spoke about it here but in Paris this design is being implemented for the line that carries the most pax a day (the figure are a little above a milion passenger a day) because it carries people from the dormitory suburbs to the two biggest parisians CBDs. This double decker can seats and transport more people but are, for me, more dangerous than the normal rolling stock. You can see people standing in the stairways during the rush hours. With such a design it's also a nightmare to get on an off the train. The exchanges are then longer because the flow is slower and then, at the end, you increase the number of people transported by train but diminish the number of train per hour the infrastructure can handle thus loosing theoritic line capacity.

 

As for me the real answer to this kind of problem is to shorten the carriages so you can then widen the train body.

[bikkuri bahn]

Disturbman makes a good point.  Double deck/bilevels are not favored for commuter operations in Japan because station dwell times for these types are too long to permit the 3 minute headways required to keep things moving efficiently.  So single level trains are utilized, some with fold up seats to maximize capacity as well as extra doors or wider doors to speed up boarding.

[CaptOblivious]

There's also the matter of that pesky wire hanging over all the rail lines…the double-decker carriages they do have are barely tall enough to work well, but they can't be made any taller…

[bill937ca]

 So single level trains are utilized, some with fold up seats to maximize capacity as well as extra doors or wider doors to speed up boarding.

 

The six door cars will disappear from the Yamanote line when the planned installation of platform gates on the Yamanote line proceeds in fiscal 2010. The newest Series 233 trains on the KeihnTohoku line only feature four door cars whereas the Series 209 they are replacing have six door cars.

 

http://www.hobidas.com/news/article/85035.html

[bill937ca]

As for me the real answer to this kind of problem is to shorten the carriages so you can then widen the train body.

 

Don't forget you are working with 1067mm (3ft6in) gauge track and stations with curving platforms.  In the future traffic can be expected to decline as the population ages.  Some railways are already encountering this.

[Mudkip Orange]

The six door cars will disappear from the Yamanote line when the planned installation of platform gates on the Yamanote line proceeds in fiscal 2010. The newest Series 233 trains on the KeihnTohoku line only feature four door cars whereas the Series 209 they are replacing have six door cars.

 

http://www.hobidas.com/news/article/85035.html

Why?

 

I always had this vision of one day the Yamanote would operate with no seats at all, just a bunch of boxcars with handrails...

[disturbman]

I think because they want to implement PSD (Platform Screen Door) and can't do it unless all the cars have four doors.

[dmustu]

When PSD has been introduced, will this mean that the yamanote line will become Driver Only Operated (DOO)? I noticed when in Japan last year, that some companies/lines already had PSD in operation, and these trains were fully operated by the driver, there being no guard (or conductor if you prefer to call).

[disturbman]

I have no idea. Maybe. It's a nice way to cut costs and make a line less prone to person accidents.

[bill937ca]

When PSD has been introduced, will this mean that the yamanote line will become Driver Only Operated (DOO)? I noticed when in Japan last year, that some companies/lines already had PSD in operation, and these trains were fully operated by the driver, there being no guard (or conductor if you prefer to call).

 

I believe this is because of anticipated population decline.  Japan's population is now 127 million and by 2050 it is projected to drop to 95 million.  This will decrease the work force drastically.  Some railways are already reporting declining traffic due to the aging population.

 

Platform gates prevent people from being pushed off crowded platforms.

[bikkuri bahn]

When PSD has been introduced, will this mean that the yamanote line will become Driver Only Operated (DOO)? I noticed when in Japan last year, that some companies/lines already had PSD in operation, and these trains were fully operated by the driver, there being no guard (or conductor if you prefer to call).

 

A quick look around the net yielded a general consensus that DOO (called "one man unten") will probably not be instituted on the Yamanote Line.  One convincing reason given was that with DOO, PSD is given extra time to operate for safety reasons, thus affecting (increasing) station dwell times.  When you have a guard manually operating the PSD, it can be more dynamic.  From personal experience, this is true.  On the Tozai Subway Line here in Sapporo, station dwell times are longer (a matter of 3 or 4 seconds) with DOO PSD operation than before installation.