Collection Inventory and Estate Planning

[JR 500系]

Something struck me. You know, I was discussing this with another close friend, what would happen to our train collections if one day suddenly we are called to the other world? 

 

I mean, those with children, yes, most probably the children or grand children will inherit them, but will they know what to do with them? (i.e. run them? play with them? Service them like we would?) the next thing is will they then turn up on the garage sale? 

 

I know it's frightening and probably not a good idea to think about this, but it strikes me hard thinking my collection would hit a garage sale and the EVA 500 going for like $50. 

 

When we leave, we most probably want to leave the best for our loved ones, so would they know what to do with them, especially more so when it happens so suddenly?

 

What do you guys do or think about this?

Edited July 9, 2018 by JR 500系

[Das Steinkopf]

Sammy, I have absolutely no idea on how you can hide this colection from your wife.

[gavino200]

12 minutes ago, JR 500系 said:

Something struck me. You know, I was discussing this with another close friend, what would happen to our train collections if one day suddenly we are called to the other world? 

 

I mean, those with children, yes, most probably the children or grand children will inherit them, but will they know what to do with them? (i.e. run them? play with them? Service them like we would?) the next thing is will they then turn up on the garage sale? 

 

I know it's frightening and probably not a good idea to think about this, but it strikes me hard thinking my collection would hit a garage sale and the EVA 500 going for like $50. 

 

When we leave, we most probably want to leave the best for our loved ones, so would they know what to do with them, especially more so when it happens so suddenly?

 

What do you guys do or think about this?

 

I think my son would take Dad's little kingdom and turn it into an Empire.

Edited July 9, 2018 by gavino200

[gtsfrost]

16 minutes ago, JR 500系 said:

Something struck me. You know, I was discussing this with another close friend, what would happen to our train collections if one day suddenly we are called to the other world? 

 

I mean, those with children, yes, most probably the children or grand children will inherit them, but will they know what to do with them? (i.e. run them? play with them? Service them like we would?) the next thing is will they then turn up on the garage sale? 

 

I know it's frightening and probably not a good idea to think about this, but it strikes me hard thinking my collection would hit a garage sale and the EVA 500 going for like $50. 

 

When we leave, we most probably want to leave the best for our loved ones, so would they know what to do with them, especially more so when it happens so suddenly?

 

What do you guys do or think about this?

 

Influence your children to love the trains as much as you do, and let them know the actual cost, and not to sell them.

Even if want to, rather give away to a museum for collection. After all, it contains a piece of history behind them.

 

BTW BEAUTIFUL COLLECTION!

 

Lol I would probably have to get approval to install one of these.

 

[cteno4]

6 hours ago, JR 500系 said:

Something struck me. You know, I was discussing this with another close friend, what would happen to our train collections if one day suddenly we are called to the other world? 

 

I mean, those with children, yes, most probably the children or grand children will inherit them, but will they know what to do with them? (i.e. run them? play with them? Service them like we would?) the next thing is will they then turn up on the garage sale? 

 

I know it's frightening and probably not a good idea to think about this, but it strikes me hard thinking my collection would hit a garage sale and the EVA 500 going for like $50. 

 

When we leave, we most probably want to leave the best for our loved ones, so would they know what to do with them, especially more so when it happens so suddenly?

 

What do you guys do or think about this?

 

Actually just wrote something on this to our local NMRA chapter as they are trying to put something together on this and they contacted our club about our experiences. We have had a number of folks dealing with estates contact us in various Japanese trains (and a few other Japanese items) about worth or if we were interested in donations. We have had donated a lot of Japanese train fan and modeling  magazines and some bits of transport paper memorabilia and recently a bunch of transportation photos from the 70s. Others are trying to price brass and odd bits usually.

 

a couple of us advised the sons of a local dealer who passed about how they might liquidate his train business. Luckily they were both very savvy and their father very organized, but still a huge task for them and they have busy lives of their own.

 

we recommend members keep an inventory with just a rough insurance value (also very important for fire etc) so that if it winds up in the estate situation someone will roughly know the value (and hopefully can be left with info that they will not get this trying to sell it off, but at least not get ripped off or try to sell things as rare and 10x what it’s worth.) this is probably the best planning you can do. Another is to ask a friend who knows about this stuff if they would be willing to be named in your estate plan as someone who can help. I’m on a couple of these like this.

 

other thing to put down is perhaps the best places to where they should be sold off and the frank talk that they won’t get the full value for them, especially if a large collection is flooding the market. Also it will be a lot of time and work to sell off a collection piece by piece. There are estate sales folks out there that can help by taking a cut (usually around 25%) but they usually don’t know much about model trains, especially Japanese n scale, so this is where the inventory and insurance values and friend can help set prices to sell well and get some good value and the estate sales folks do the work. There are also train folks that will buy up whole collections to slowly sell them off. Of course you get a lot less for the dollar (maybe 30-50 cents in the dollar of sale value) but the whole thing is gone at once and you get a check, done. They then slowly sell it off thru their best channels for each thing.

 

last thing is to either leave behind in your estate plan or talk to inheritors what your wishes are. Them knowing helps as they may do something hard assuming you expected them to get every cent when you may want them to do what ever is easiest on them as these times can be stressful and a huge amount of crap to deal with besides the loss. For me I don’t want anyone put out by my crap. If they want to try to get money out of it great, but if they don’t want to deal with it I’m fine with it either getting dumped cheap and some folks getting a little flood of happy deals or just give it away to folks who could use it and have a great home. Of late I’ve been upgrading some shop equipment and tools and while is could make some money selling the old stuff off it’s not worth the time to me to do so and actually when I (usually easily) find a new home for an old friend tool and just give it away it feels a whole lot better. But maybe that’s just me getting older...

 

i know we all hace very personal connections with our trains, but once we are gone we must realize that those left behind may not have much of any connection to it and they can be painful reminders for some. It’s hard but you must think about stuff with you now out of the equation —  that’s the way it will be.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[Yavianice]

My wife said that if I’m gone she will play with it.

[katoftw]

My wife would sell them it a heartbeat. She would have a least half on ebay before the day of the funeral.

[Pauljag900]

Mine too katoftw 😂👍

[cteno4]

how about an auction at the funeral? bet there will be a high density of train collectors there! nice way to remember you. leave some out for attendees to take home as a memory...

 

actually i have a number of common things that partners of friends that have passes have given away like books, music cds etc and its nice as i always think of them seeing he book or hearing the cd.

 

jeff

[bill937ca]

10 hours ago, JR 500系 said:

Something struck me. You know, I was discussing this with another close friend, what would happen to our train collections if one day suddenly we are called to the other world? 

 

I mean, those with children, yes, most probably the children or grand children will inherit them, but will they know what to do with them? (i.e. run them? play with them? Service them like we would?) the next thing is will they then turn up on the garage sale? 

 

I know it's frightening and probably not a good idea to think about this, but it strikes me hard thinking my collection would hit a garage sale and the EVA 500 going for like $50. 

 

When we leave, we most probably want to leave the best for our loved ones, so would they know what to do with them, especially more so when it happens so suddenly?

 

What do you guys do or think about this?

 

You enjoy them while you are here. What happens once you gone you can't control.  These days there is no market for many things that once could be sold by second dealers. Its a combination of ebay, amazon, Walmart  that is killing traditional retail.  The second hand trade survived on local monopolies that disappeared with world wide online sales. Relax and enjoy!

[cteno4]

Online things like ebay and even this forum can provide a pretty good market for niche stuff like ours which never do well at the LHS outside japan. Good business now of folks to help do all the ebay work if you don’t want to.

 

i agree I don’t want my heirs stressing over my crap, but it is something that is a big drag for those left behind, had to deal with that and my folks house and lots of my cohorts have been going thru this as well. I realized a little planning makes it a whole lot easier later for folks.

 

cheers

 

jeff

[nscalestation]

15 hours ago, JR 500系 said:

Something struck me. You know, I was discussing this with another close friend, what would happen to our train collections if one day suddenly we are called to the other world? 

 

I mean, those with children, yes, most probably the children or grand children will inherit them, but will they know what to do with them? (i.e. run them? play with them? Service them like we would?) the next thing is will they then turn up on the garage sale? 

 

I know it's frightening and probably not a good idea to think about this, but it strikes me hard thinking my collection would hit a garage sale and the EVA 500 going for like $50. 

 

When we leave, we most probably want to leave the best for our loved ones, so would they know what to do with them, especially more so when it happens so suddenly?

 

What do you guys do or think about this?

 

If possible make an arrangement with a trusted friend or friends to handle that part of your estate.  Best if this is someone your family also knows.

 

A few years ago one of my friends passed away suddenly leaving his family with his layout and large collection of American prototype N scale.   After finding out that various hobby dealers would not give them very much they asked me to sell his stuff for a percentage of the proceeds and mostly they wanted to clear the stuff out which was a full load in my full sized pickup.  I explained to them that it would not go quickly and to think of it like an annuity.   First step was to take a box of stuff to the members of the Ntrak club that we both belonged to and give those guys first shot.  As I had known them all for years and knew what they liked it got things off to a decent start.  After that it's been listing things on Trainboard.com, ebay, and on the Trovestar /N Scale Enthusiasts classifieds.  They get a check about every 6 months along with a spreadsheet accounting for everything sold in the period.   This does take a bit of time but at least most things have fetched a reasonable price.   This is why dealers will pay so little for an estate, it takes a lot of work and time to sell it.

 

 

[serotta1972]

Well said Brad, I was going to say something similar.  I was going to add, a trusted friend that is also knowledgeable about trains would be a plus.  I think that's where being a part of a  Model Railroad club or group would be beneficial, a real club not just online.  Not to say, you can't build strong relationships online.  Brad and Paul have been so kind assisting families in these particular situations.

[JR 500系]

Thanks for the input guys. It was great listening to your ideas and suggestions... 

 

It might be too early for this, but being prepared doesn't hurt, right? Best for prepared for the worst then not knowing what to do when it happens... (no worries i'm not going onto a mine field tomorrow or something haha ~)

 

I already have my spreadsheet in hand with brands, model numbers, specifications, low, medium and high prices. I think making it easy to understand like even a layman without train knowledge can easily know what it is, so I reckon model numbers are important. I even wanted to put a picture but then again, the trains are all in bookcases and one wouldn't know what it looks like till they opened it... 

 

Specifications would be important for the hardcore train fans taking over the trains, like whether the train runs well, condition of motor, whether there are TN couplers, interior lights fitted or not, cab cars coupler types etc. Low, medium and high prices would be a good gauge for selling them off for whoever might be assisting them in... (My Mrs have close to nothing knowledge about trains, which is a good thing when i'm alive and not so when i'm gone haha )

 

Sorry if this discussion might not be appropriate for this thread!  🙂

 

 

[nah00]

On 7/10/2018 at 1:25 AM, serotta1972 said:

Well said Brad, I was going to say something similar.  I was going to add, a trusted friend that is also knowledgeable about trains would be a plus.  I think that's where being a part of a  Model Railroad club or group would be beneficial, a real club not just online.  Not to say, you can't build strong relationships online.  Brad and Paul have been so kind assisting families in these particular situations.

 

I second this, being in a club does help as they will have some idea what you have and especially if you've put any work into it that might make it worth more than first glance (decoders, detail parts). Also helps to have a relationship with a hobby shop but they have to make margin on collections they buy so you're probably getting 50-60% less than a private sale (if not more). 

[cteno4]

Yep clubs can be a big help in these situations and if it’s a member who has passed are usually willing to help out.. It is a huge amount of work and time to get much of the value out and that’s the thing folks don’t always understand. If you rush it and flood the market it can depress the value as well as finding the best places to sell each item. The shipping and logistics alone can really be a PITA.

 

I’ve been approached a few times to do this (not friends just referred to me) but I just did not want the time and the estate wanted it done in weeks. All I could do is recommend talking to the local clubs or some of the ebay listers I’ve bought from that seem to know some about trains and took a reasonable commission and were set up to process a lot of items thru quickly (but these need to be local to the estate).

 

jeff

[cteno4]

I just pulled this out as it’s own thread as it’s an important discussion on its own

 

jeff

[Pauljag900]

After reading this I realised I had the same problem,no one else here,other than the grandkids are intrested in the layout or the Trains.

so I made a catalogue of all the rolling stock in picture form and saved it to iCloud on the iPad 

i photographed the case and train together then edited it with the cost New and what they could expect to get for it as a used item.

i ve also since spoken to them and advised they check ebay for prices first.

i ve done the same with the track pieces and explained how to remove it without causing too much damage.

of course,this may all change with time and the grandkids may well take it over,here s hoping.👍😀

Edited August 27, 2018 by Pauljag900

[Khaul]

This is not a estate. THIS is a ESTATE! 

 

[toc36]

Other than real estate or stock, the harsh reality is that very little of what we own will appreciate after passing to our heirs.  Much of what we have, we keep due to sentimental value.  I have several pieces of art and some antiques that someone may want to acquire, but I doubt that I could sell them for only about a little more than what I paid.

 

What I am seeing within our hobby is that there are very few, new, rare, once-in-a-lifetime collector items.  It seems that there is a continuous 3-5 year cycle of reproducing previous models.  I am of the opinion that unless you are collecting older brass or 50 year commemorative sets, that you will not see a positive return on investment.  I sometimes wonder why I am collecting the train sets that I am buying as they are depreciating assets.  One time, I had acquired 3-4 HOn3 brass locomotives.  Should have kept them.  Broke even when I sold them.

 

My sister has an estate sales business.  People hire her to manage the estate sale.  Estate sales are expensive to the heirs.  Time is money and there is a lot of pilferage.  Unless you have rare, museum/high quality items, you will not make much money.  The strategy that has worked best for her is to keep it a closed sale.  She notifies buyers of specifics types of items (furniture, clothes, jewelry, etc.).  They buy in quantity, they know the market.  Anything that is left gets donated to a church, Salvation Army, or goes into the dumpster.

 

We can argue, but I think I can say that most of our collections will be worth less to our heirs than what we paid once we factor in time and aggravation.  We enjoy them while we are alive.  Maybe a topic for another thread, if there was a zombie apocalypse and you can take only one train, what would it be????

 

Personally, I plan on taking mine with me to the grave!!

[Hayashi]

Great advice from everyone. My company works with business owners on succession planning (long-term and short-term traumatic). It is best to create a solid inventory of the goods and possible good places to sell them where you will get more money than a garage or estate sale, such as clubs and forums. Including them in a Will is a good idea to ensure they are going to the proper person. However, be careful about putting any values in the Will. If for some reason the Will goes to probate, the value of your inventory can become a tax consequence for the inheritor. If you chose to include potential values, it is best to keep the monetary values someplace else. Including instructions on track removal and anything else that could be removed is also solid advice.

[cteno4]

That’s true, probate in some states that still have inheritance tax may “value” a collection that would be next to impossible to get w.o a huge amount of work if ever. 

 

Jeff

[JR 500系]

Interesting discussion, and thanks to Jeff for having this topic on its own ~

 

While it might be true, most of what we own and what we think they are worth probably worth next to nothing to someone who doesn't exactly know the value of these commodities.... It's like, asking me to judge how much a rare 6" figure is worth! 

 

Nevertheless, keeping an inventory is a great way to:

 

1) Know what trains we have (yes some of us do have so much trains we lost track of them and ended up having doubles!) 

2) Know the total number of trains and sets we have 

3) Further expanding on that to include what we have done to each set, i.e. putting in interior lights, fixing TN couplers, bookmarking problems with each set so we can know what to do with each set when time permits to either repair or maintain them 

4) an Estimate as to what we intend to sell them for with our passing, and what we paid for them in the first place 

 

While we certainly more often than not, not make huge loads of money selling them off, we certainly would make a tad more than just having them over at a garage sale with each set going for like $50... 

 

 

[nah00]

On 8/27/2018 at 6:46 PM, toc36 said:

Personally, I plan on taking mine with me to the grave!!

 

My Hokutosei, Genbi shinkansen, first DD51, orange TGV, and my Union Railroad MP15DCs are coming with me to mine. 

 

Forgot: My Wheeling & Lake Erie SD40-2s and Penn Central GG1 are too. 

Edited August 29, 2018 by nah00

[Ochanomizu]

Hello,

 

I'm LIVING for my trains ... not dying for them ...

 

What happens to them when I'm gone doesn't bother me at all.