People’s Republic of China N Scale trains

[disturbman]

Analog versions is scheduled for release first half of next year. DCC+smoke will be released later.

Changming will also release their first SL next year, they have been working on it for a while now.

[Kiha66]

Where are people buying Chinese models these days?  I joined an HO club and was considering picking up some in HO as well, but it seems they're kinda hard to come by now.

[disturbman]

It's become impossible to source directly from China has local demand is outpacing production at the moment; at least for N and iconic H0 models. That's why I have been collaborating with @Wolf and J-Scale to bring Chinese and Taiwanese models in. As well as provide CE, WEEE, customer support and spare parts.

Plus the non-Mainland sources proved to be rather unreliable—I have had a few very bad experiences with Khaho and cannot recommend them due to poor customer service—or the announcement to release pace usually requires immediate knowledge and ordering as retailers are allocated very limited quantities and these are often quickly snapped.

In this perspective, I think Wolf and I offer the most hassle free experience at the moment. At least, I can take your tentative reservation now and remove German VAT. Our ex-EU shipping costs has plummeted and are now competitive.

Otherwise, there is Tekkon Models in Japan, though I think they stopped shipping abroad and I have had to rely on the help of a friendly hand to order from there, and CN R Rail Model in Hong Kong if you don't want to go through an EU vendor. Jacky, the owner, is a peach.

Edited October 18, 2024 by disturbman

[tripel7]

A CR400AF is appearing on the horizon:

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/hsyJ74ajwXLPzDOqowmzIg

[tripel7]

And released: 

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/-VBS0IwLVLHlPmIZulhX1w

[disturbman]

Not yet, likely Thursday. The product pictures haven't been released yet.

Changming is running against the clock to have everything released and shipped before CNY.

Edited January 14 by disturbman

[disturbman]

Well, the first few pictures have made it into the public. We will likely see better/more details one tomorrow.

 

 

 

[disturbman]

Adding pictures of some of the details, which are quite bluffing.

 

 

 

 

 

(as always, Changming gave me the rights to share their pictures)

[tripel7]

7 hours ago, disturbman said:

Adding pictures of some of the details, which are quite bluffing.

.... 

 

(as always, Changming gave me the rights to share their pictures)

I love how they didn't just modelled the toilets, but also the squatting toilets

[disturbman]

CM is on a CR400 roll. CR400AF released and CR400BF and CR400AF-Z announced. The renders are done and CM announced releases will be faster than the CR400AF since some of the work was already done for the AF.

Actually, scratch that, China is on a CR400 roll. Kunter has been trying to hitch its wagons on the CM hype by pushing their own CR400AF. I had thought they had abandoned the project with CM already working on it. Release is scheduled for this Summer, but people are complaining they still haven't released the last extension of the 380AL (and might never do it).

CR400BF

 

 

CR400AF-Z

[Section31]

On 10/17/2024 at 11:41 PM, disturbman said:

It's become impossible to source directly from China has local demand is outpacing production at the moment; at least for N and iconic H0 models. That's why I have been collaborating with @Wolf and J-Scale to bring Chinese and Taiwanese models in. As well as provide CE, WEEE, customer support and spare parts.

Plus the non-Mainland sources proved to be rather unreliable—I have had a few very bad experiences with Khaho and cannot recommend them due to poor customer service—or the announcement to release pace usually requires immediate knowledge and ordering as retailers are allocated very limited quantities and these are often quickly snapped.

In this perspective, I think Wolf and I offer the most hassle free experience at the moment. At least, I can take your tentative reservation now and remove German VAT. Our ex-EU shipping costs has plummeted and are now competitive.

Otherwise, there is Tekkon Models in Japan, though I think they stopped shipping abroad and I have had to rely on the help of a friendly hand to order from there, and CN R Rail Model in Hong Kong if you don't want to go through an EU vendor. Jacky, the owner, is a peach.

 

I just restarted the hobby (owning some roco ho trains) but yeah i Khaho is odd but for shipping to canada it seems great (80hkd). I used to go to Lee Kwon Hobbies in Jordan to get my stuff whenever i went back on yearly basis. 

 

Khaho policy is odd even for Hong Kong toy resellers. Its online price is online price and there instore price is the regular one. Got caught off guard by it but now i know, next time i will either spend instore to get the 20% off or order online and pickup from the store.  I am probably shifting from Japan to Hong Kong for my orders now (yen going up and travel costs too high).

 

I am starting to look into taobao storefront and using there caniano service (63rmb for first 0.5kg and 36rmb for next 0.5kg) or take advantage of free shipping to China/Hong Kong. Can pickup and bring the stuff back to canada myself. 

 

I saw the chang ming brand instore and i kind of want to pick one up but probably next time (this year) i go back to HK. it is nice they have many location i can pickup from - i don’t want to go tsuen wan/tai po from hk island to pickup toys

 

 

[disturbman]

28 minutes ago, Section31 said:

Khaho is odd but for shipping to canada it seems great (80hkd)

Technically it should be 80HKD but my experience has varied. I had sometimes to pay 0 HKD for shipping and the next time 200HKD for a shipment with a similar weight. It's just random and unpredictable, likely based and who is handling your order. But the real issues with them is the lack of support if anything goes wrong.

The problem with TB is that most models sell out instantly at release, so it's neither a reliable nor a relaxed way to secure them.

Edited January 19 by disturbman

[Section31]

48 minutes ago, disturbman said:

Technically it should be 80HKD but my experience has varied. I had sometimes to pay 0 HKD for shipping and the next time 200HKD for a shipment with a similar weight. It's just random and unpredictable, likely based and who is handling your order. But the real issues with them is the lack of support if anything goes wrong.

The problem with TB is that most models sell out instantly at release, so it's neither a reliable nor a relaxed way to secure them.

 

I also have bought 1/64 model cars from other hk shops online shipped internationally and locally (rcmart, hobbydigi, tinyhk) and there intl shipping prices really vary. Hobbydigi sells tomix but international shipping is like 500hkd so khaho is good. RCmart is either cheap or it quickly hits 30-40usd. 

 

All not great customer service (norm for hong kong in general it seems no matter the sector).

 

Unfortunately not much retailers with good options in canada and us/europe shipping and stronger currency makes its not worth buying from there.

Edited January 19 by Section31

[serotta1972]

Hello folks, I was on a short hiatus from trains - glad to see that there are more China Railways model trains available. I have  these Kunter passenger cars and a couple of locomotives. What would be some appropriate motive power that are currently available from Changming. I admit I know very little about these trains, I’m just an avid passenger trains fan especially from Asia. Thank you for any suggestions and insights.

Edited January 28 by serotta1972

[disturbman]

If you want to be accurate, we would have to know the exact routes and bureau affiliations of the sets/cars.

 

Otherwise, run what you like. Nobody will judge you or know better. Plus, as for any large railways, you can bet that all locos must have pulled any kind of loads. There is a picture going around with a SS8 in front of a heavy freight train.

In recent passenger-only locomotives released are the SS7D, SS9, SS8 and DF4D-3000 (the ones wearing the JNR-inspired livery). All would likely fit in front of those 25Ks, but I'm not sure you can find any of these available anywhere except at j-scale.

The HXD1D and/or HXD3D would be the better candidates for the green and gold sets, but CM still hasn't re-released those. They did reconfirm the second production run should be sold this year. Another possibility would be the DF11 that is supposed to release later this year, and perhaps a DF4B for the orange coaches.

You can use https://www.trainnets.com/ to check for possible consists. They have a tag system. I like to spend some my off time browsing there.

Edited January 27 by disturbman

[serotta1972]

@disturbman Thank you. The Red cars: Shanghai-Haikou-Cross Sea Express Train; The Green cars: Beijing-Shanghai Express Train; The Blue cars: Guangzhou-Shanghai-Shenzhen Express Train.  Information are from the boxes.  I plan on getting a couple engines from J-Scale and definitely thinking about the CRF400AF-Z.  

[disturbman]

@serotta1972 The Cross Sea Express and Guangzhou-Shenzhen trains can be pulled by a SS8. These are quite common around that part of China for express trains. You can also use a DF11 in front of the Guangzhou-Shenzhen as these were common before the SS8 were used.

Nowadays, I think the HXD3D would be found in front of the Beijing-Shanghai.

[rogerg]

On 1/27/2025 at 11:00 AM, serotta1972 said:

Hello folks, I was on a short hiatus from trains - glad to see that there are more China Railways model trains available. I have  these Kunter passenger cars and a couple of locomotives. What would be some appropriate motive power that are currently available from Changming. I admit I know very little about these trains, I’m just an avid passenger trains fan especially from Asia. Thank you for any suggestions and insights.

Here is SS9 164 on a Shanghai to BJ train arriving at BJ main station on 6 March 2011.  Sorry about the crappy photo.

 

[Steve]

What is the point of every Locomotive Class has their own Livery?

[SwallowAngel]

1 hour ago, Steve said:

What is the point of every Locomotive Class has their own Livery?

I am not the most well versed in this, but from what I could make out CR seemingly never bothered to *quite* standardize a livery for their locos. 

Even among one class liveries can vary a lot. I think the DF4D-3000's "Tiger" livery shows that off the best. Here a small selection of pictures on TrainNets.com.

 

It most likely is just due to the sheer size of CR operations. I doubt they see any need to standardise something as trivial as livery. Additionally CR operations are also at times split into smaller, more independant operations with their own livery.

[serotta1972]

@rogerg thanks for sharing a photo an SS9, it looks fine.  

 

[disturbman]

On 2/8/2025 at 5:15 PM, SwallowAngel said:

I am not the most well versed in this, but from what I could make out CR seemingly never bothered to *quite* standardize a livery for their locos.

On the contrary, I would say that except for notable exceptions, the liveries were standardized per locomotive class or subclass. But that can be muddied by the various CR/bureaus/sub companies doing their own things and time passing. If you look at the DF4Ds for example, all DF4D-0, DF4D-3, DF4D-4 and DF4D-7 more or less follow a general blue print with light variations of colors within that blueprint: red and cream for the DF4D-0, JNR-inspired for the DF4D-3, blue and cream for the DF4D-4, green and cream for the DF4D-7. You can perhaps see that more easily on the smaller classes, like the 6K, 8K, SS6, SS7D, SS9, SS9G or the DF11.

It's only really with the Harmonies that CR went back to a more strictly standardized color scheme. Blue and white/gray for the non-quasi high-speed classes of electric locomotives and red for the quasi high-speed classes (HXD1D and HXD3D). There were also specific liveries for some classes of passenger stock, like the 25T-BSP and the 25G that since then went back to the old dark green and gold livery.

I say went back as my impression was that, originally, loco were dark green with a colored cheat line (DF4 and NY) for example.

 

edit: noticed later what you were answering to.

Edited February 9 by disturbman

[Nozomi329]

On 2/9/2025 at 1:10 AM, Steve said:

What is the point of every Locomotive Class has their own Livery?

A least it makes railfanning more enjoyable. Don't you ever get bored watching all those verkehrsrot?😄

 

26 minutes ago, disturbman said:

muddied by the various CR/bureaus/sub companies doing their own things and time passing

One of Aurora miniature's articles about their HO scale DF4B has explained how chaotic things could get for liveries: https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/m1PBR5eGvG3-MeeaLPBR7g

39 minutes ago, disturbman said:

since then went back to the old dark green and gold livery.

Around 2015 a new standard was established where all loco-hauled passenger cars were painted back to that old style. Before that, 25G, 25K, and 25T all had their own liveries, and some regional railways also had their special ones (e.g. 合九, 金温, 集通, 广梅汕)

[disturbman]

 

My issue of "20 notable night trains" (my own shortened, approximation of the title) does confirm as I remembered that the Beijing-Shanghai train is now hauled by the HXD1D. Depending on the time you want to model, you can haul that train with a DF11, a SS9G or a HXD1D. Knowing that other classes likely hauled that for a reason or another.

 

 

 

And the magazine/book cover.

 

 

On 2/8/2025 at 3:10 PM, Steve said:

What is the point of every Locomotive Class has their own Livery?

 

To be able to easily identify each class? I don't mind, I love the variety of liveries of the CR machines. Some liveries are also rather unusual in their choices of colors.

Edited February 9 by disturbman

[disturbman]

12 minutes ago, Nozomi329 said:

One of Aurora miniature's articles about their HO scale DF4B has explained how chaotic things could get for liveries: https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/m1PBR5eGvG3-MeeaLPBR7g

Thanks for that again, it's a really interesting read.

I'll copy-paste a Baidu-translated excerpt:

 

"But after receiving the drawings of the Dongfeng 4B locomotive, we found that the color codes and names marked in the "Paint and Decoration" drawings, such as "Car Green", "Fanghu", "Bean Grey", etc., did not appear in the current "National Standard Color Card". At first, we thought that the name of the color code had changed during the version update of GB3181 national standard, so we put in a lot of effort to gather all the GB3181 color cards for all versions since their promulgation in 1983. However, the color codes in the Dongfeng 4B drawings have not appeared in any version of the national standard.

Later on, we realized that when the Dongfeng 4B locomotive was put into operation, the first version of the "National Standard Color Card" had not yet been issued, which means that the colors in the factory drawings were not the national standard color codes, but rather the color codes of Dalian Haiou Paint Factory. Moreover, there is no annotation in the drawings regarding the conversion between non-standard color codes and national standard color codes (the Dongfeng 8 model initially did not use national standard color codes, but provided conversion instructions).

Due to a lack of further information, it is unclear whether each railway bureau has issued a unified standard painting technology document. However, based on the several locomotive depots visited or the team leaders consulted over the phone, no such document has been mentioned, and the color cards, color codes, and paint suppliers used by different application units are different. Although most units use paint with national standard color codes, the selection of color codes is not uniform among units. For example, there are six different color codes for the "watermelon" color locomotive decoration strip.

 

For example, many units in the Northeast region use the "Seagull" color code from Dalian Paint Factory, and the pink orange color of passenger locomotives, which is deeply loved by car enthusiasts, is not any national standard color (it seems that Guangzhou Locomotive Depot later stopped using this color). In addition, due to changes in paint suppliers, loss of paint scheme information, and proactive simplification and modification of paint schemes by workshops, there have been changes in the paint coating of locomotives by the same operating unit at different times. The color codes of "Seagull" in the following picture, such as "light silver gray" and "car leather green", are not the names of the national standard color codes.

 

The locomotive paint suppliers we can count include Haiou, Shuangta, Xiangjiang, Kaiwei, Shipboard... I don't know how many brands in total. Some units may even mix paint from three different brands at the same time due to the replacement of technical documents. I had originally thought of asking the sales department of these factories for a color palette, but later found out that the color codes supplied in each batch are not exactly the same. As long as their customers do not object, it is not a big problem. It can only be said that there is evidence to follow in general."

😁