Do Koki car colors have a meaning?

[gavino200]

I'm talking about the freight car itself, not the freight containers. Is the color just random, or is there some logic to it?

 

Some are blue. I have these.

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10442788

 

Some are gray (grey)

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10470341

 

Yellow ones

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10415982

 

Brown

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10413709

 

 

Red

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10320582

 

Green

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10241009

 

Orange

 

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10241010

 

[Das Steinkopf]

 The colours aren't random but were more about distinguishing different types, these days it does not really matter as JRF when they started to produce their own rolling stock (Koki 100 Series) to replace what they inherited from JNR originally painted their wagons Blue, it wasn't until almost halfway through the construction of the Koki 106 that Grey was adopted for the new standard livery. Since then all of the new rolling stock produced such as Koki 106 and Koki 107 is painted Grey, also of note is that any of the older  Koki 106's that were originally painted Blue go into the workshops for refurbishment are repainted Grey, mind you older 100 series wagons such as Koki 100-101's that go in for refurbishment are still painted Blue but with the JRF logo removed akin to the new build Koki 107's, I have seen some around Nagoya. There are two exceptions to the standard livery in that the Koki 110's are painted Yellow and the Koki 200's Red, the Koki 110's were more of an experimental class with only 5 built that toyed with the idea of using 15' containers instead of the standard 12' units, the yellow paint made them easy to distinguish from the Koki 106's which the design was mainly based on. The Koki 200's on the other hand are a much shorter wagon at about 43' in length as opposed to the 63' of the regular Koki's, they are primarily used for tank container traffic which being Red makes them easier to find when sorting wagons, this is especially handy when there is only 154 Koki 200's in service out of the 8,000 to 9,000 odd container flats that JRF has in their fleet.

 

With the Koki 50000 variants there was a reason for colour variation, the standard Koki 50000's were originally fitted with TR203 bogies that are rated to travel at 95km/h the bodies are painted a Reddish Brown livery and the bogies black. There were two conversions to increase speed and road handling, the Koki 250000 from 1987 were fitted with TR223 bogies so they could travel at 100km/h and were painted Green, the Koki 350000 from 1988 were fitted with TR223C bogies to travel at 110km/h and also had electromagnetic brakes and were painted Shonan Yellow. The Koki 250000's and Koki 350000's no longer exist as some were converted back to Koki 50000's or into a variety of Chiki's for rail transport some of them still sporting the green livery of the Koki 250000's. Another reason for the demise of these sub classes was the fitting of TR223F from 1991 and later TR223G bogies in 2001 to the standard Koki 50000's when they were being refurbished to improve their riding and load capabilities, not to mention the introduction of the newer Koki 100 Series designs.

Edited December 17, 2017 by Das Steinkopf

[gavino200]

On 12/16/2017 at 9:16 AM, Das Steinkopf said:

 The colours aren't random but were more about distinguishing different types, these days it does not really matter as JRF when they started to produce their own rolling stock (Koki 100 Series) to replace what they inherited from JNR originally painted their wagons Blue,

 

The colors used to matter more in the JNR days? But not so much any more. Blue was the first standard color of new JRF Kokis? All Kokis?

 

On 12/16/2017 at 9:16 AM, Das Steinkopf said:

 

it wasn't until almost halfway through the construction of the Koki 106 that Grey was adopted for the new standard livery. Since then all of the new rolling stock produced such as Koki 106 and Koki 107 is painted Grey, also of note is that any of the older  Koki 106's that were originally painted Blue go into the workshops for refurbishment are repainted Grey,

 

Later the standard for all JRF Kokis became grey? So blue versus grey is like a JRF time stamp? Earlier are blue, later are grey?

 

 

On 12/16/2017 at 9:16 AM, Das Steinkopf said:

 

mind you older 100 series wagons such as Koki 100-101's that go in for refurbishment are still painted Blue but with the JRF logo removed akin to the new build Koki 107's, I have seen some around Nagoya.

 

Confused. Some are repainted grey while others remain blue but lose the JRF logo? Why would they remove the JRF logo? JRF is still around, right?

 

 

On 12/16/2017 at 9:16 AM, Das Steinkopf said:

 

There are two exceptions to the standard livery

 

in that the Koki 110's are painted Yellow 

the Koki 110's were more of an experimental class with only 5 built that toyed with the idea of using 15' containers instead of the standard 12' units, the yellow paint made them easy to distinguish from the Koki 106's which the design was mainly based on. 

 

and the Koki 200's Red, 

The Koki 200's on the other hand are a much shorter wagon at about 43' in length as opposed to the 63' of the regular Koki's, they are primarily used for tank container traffic which being Red makes them easier to find when sorting wagons, this is especially handy when there is only 154 Koki 200's in service out of the 8,000 to 9,000 odd container flats that JRF has in their fleet.

 

Got it. 

 

 

On 12/16/2017 at 9:16 AM, Das Steinkopf said:

With the Koki 50000 variants there was a reason for colour variation, the standard Koki 50000's were originally fitted with TR203 bogies that are rated to travel at 95km/h the bodies are painted a Reddish Brown livery and the bogies black.

 

This is JNR, pre-JRF. Now they'd be blue or grey?

 

On 12/16/2017 at 9:16 AM, Das Steinkopf said:

 

There were two conversions to increase speed and road handling, the Koki 250000 from 1987 were fitted with TR223 bogies so they could travel at 100km/h and were painted Green, 

 

Again, This is JNR, pre-JRF. Now they'd be blue or grey?

 

On 12/16/2017 at 9:16 AM, Das Steinkopf said:

 

 

the Koki 350000 from 1988 were fitted with TR223C bogies to travel at 110km/h and also had electromagnetic brakes and were painted Shonan Yellow.

 

 

Again, This is JNR, pre-JRF. Now they'd be blue or grey?

 

In summary, for a contemporary KoKi collection, all I really need is blue and grey?

 

[katoftw]

Blue and grey for a contemporary layout makes sense. Although in Kyushu and Hokkaido, you'll still find a few 50000s 100s-104s on short haulers.

[Das Steinkopf]

7 hours ago, gavino200 said:

 

The colors used to matter more in the JNR days? But not so much any more. Blue was the first standard color of new JRF Kokis? All Kokis?

 

 

Later the standard for all JRF Kokis became grey? So blue versus grey is like a JRF time stamp? Earlier are blue, later are grey?

 

 

 

Confused. Some are repainted grey while others remain blue but lose the JRF logo? Why would they remove the JRF logo? JRF is still around, right?

 

 

 

Got it. 

 

 

 

This is JNR, pre-JRF. Now they'd be blue or grey?

 

 

Again, This is JNR, pre-JRF. Now they'd be blue or grey?

 

 

Again, This is JNR, pre-JRF. Now they'd be blue or grey?

 

In summary, for a contemporary KoKi collection, all I really need is blue and grey?

 

 

 Okay quick breakdown of everything, current stock wise KoKi 100 to 105's Blue Livery, Koki 106 and KoKi 107 Grey Livery, JRF Logo is slowly being removed from the fleet, this is being done as each wagon is being refurbished during deep level maintenance where they get fully scrubbed back and a new coat of paint is applied, this has been happening since around 2017 as one of a number of cost cutting measures, of note the first 404 KoKi 106's were painted Blue, they changed to Grey after that and that colour has been adopted by earlier wagons when being refurbished. The only variation to those liveries is the KoKi 110's which were an experimental design that could fit 15' container instead of 12', they are painted Yellow as they are derived from the KoKi 106's and it made them easier to find in a yard compared to if they were painted Grey, there was only 5 wagons of this variant produced making them rather unique, there is also the KoKi 200's in Red but they are a much shorter vehicle at close to 45' in length designed to carry either 2 20' tank containers or 2 20' marine containers.

Edited May 1, 2021 by Das Steinkopf

[gavino200]

Thanks @Das Steinkopf. I'm wondering if you have any light to shed on a related question. We've been discussing in a different thread, the different shades of blue that various Kato and Tomix Koki models come in. We've been discussing how these models compare to the prototype. We've been assuming that there's one standard shade used on the prototype and that the blue fades over time. Do you happen to know if Kokis have been painted different shades of blue at various stages? Or in different regions?

[Tony Galiani]

Just happened to check out the RG-Rokko site and they have several different Kokis now available - green and yellow versions - with some additional information on them if you click on the image.

Ciao,

Tony Galiani

[Das Steinkopf]

11 hours ago, gavino200 said:

Thanks @Das Steinkopf. I'm wondering if you have any light to shed on a related question. We've been discussing in a different thread, the different shades of blue that various Kato and Tomix Koki models come in. We've been discussing how these models compare to the prototype. We've been assuming that there's one standard shade used on the prototype and that the blue fades over time. Do you happen to know if Kokis have been painted different shades of blue at various stages? Or in different regions?

I have seen KoKi 100 variants from as far north as Sendai and as far south as Kagoshima Chuo, I’ve been out to Kanazawa and Toyama as well. The blue used is the same stock standard colour and there is no regional variations as these wagons can end up anywhere in the system that JRF covers. The only variation I could say that is attributed to regions is the weather and local environments, Kyushu can be very wet and have baking hot sun, Kanazawa on the other hand can be rather wet and cold, that said I haven’t seen it have a marked effect on freight stock. Locomotives on the other hand show the effects of the local environment, especially when you look at EF510’s and EF81’s, this is mainly due to being allocated to a depot in a particular region for long periods of their life, KoKi’s on the other hand are transient and go anywhere regardless of voltage types or no overhead wiring at all.
 

 As I mentioned before the Blue used by Tomix is reasonable but is a slightly darker shade and can be toned down, the Blue used on the current Kato KoKi 104’s is probably the best representation, the Sky Blue used on the  original Kato KoKi 104’s is totally wrong and the only KoKi to wear that colour is the KoKi 70’s built in 1991 by Kawasaki Heavy Industries, they were a very small prototype run as noted by the 901 and 902 prefix, they were designed to fit specialist high cube containers.

 

Edited May 2, 2021 by Das Steinkopf