Russian VL-80 DelPrado conversion

[medusa]

Hi,

 

just wanted to put this into an "on my bench" subforum, but seems we haven't one here... I took some time to finish a conversion started long time ago: a SZD VL-80 electric loco model. It is one of the locos I feel I need for my Kato Orinent Express cars. Of course, to reach Japan, the OE will need to make the looong journey on the Transsiberian Railroad.

Russian N-scale stuff is not easy (and if at all, not cheap) to find. One of the best sources still is the old Piko GDR stuff on Ebay but the only SZD loco available is way to ugly (a ChS-4 "Laminatka"). Only other chance was to get the DelPrado VL-80 stand model and do a conversion.

 

About DelPrado models, my opion in short: model body shell is sort of ok for the price (got it for 8 Euros each, bought two and some other models, too), chassis is unusable scrap, pantograph is very ugly looking cheap stuff. Roof insulators and wiring completely missing (instead of a second panto is there?!?). So I simply ripped everything off I didn't like.

Chassis of course the Tomytec ones are the choice. I got two TM-04s which fit quite ok into the body (after some cutting and filing of stiffening plastic inside the body shell). Note the weight of the DelPrados is from a lead block glued in the shell, this has to be cut out as well.

 

Of course there needs to be compromise about the chassis used. The axis distances are a bit short for a VL-80 model. And of course, the bogie covers are japanese not russian...

 

After painting the roof in a lighter grey, I put on spare pantographs and insulators from Piko. As in most cases with pantos from german manufacturers they extended a bit too high for Kato catenary so I had to trim them somewhat down by a tiny sheet of cardboard. The photo below shows the double-engine loco during the final catenary test.

 

~Diane.

 

 

 

EDIT: typos

Edited December 26, 2016 by medusa

[utrainia]

Good job! I like the Del Prado models; very cheap and very rough, but fun to play around with. The quality of the models varies; done like their Re4/4 are quite good, others like their SD40-2 are extremely crude.

 

I had lots of fun motorising a NS1110 series engine, lots of little things you can do to improve the models.

 

 

http://www.utrainia.com/tag/del%20prado

[medusa]

Nice model, like it.

 

I bought some more DelPrados just because they were cheap. One is a french TGV which looks quite good on its Tomytec chassis and with a Minitrix ICE 3 pantograph. I wanted this because TGV looks cool, have no real use for it.

The other one is a chinese DF-4 diesel. You know, the OE has to cross China somehow... :) But since it requires two 3-axis bogies, I haven't found the right chassis yet. A Mtx "Ludmilla" could be fitting but these beasts are expensive even 2nd hand.

[Railtunes]

Good to see modelers tackling Russian prototype! 

 

I am also doing the VL-80 conversion of the Del Prado model. The chassis I am using are from two Atlas American GP-9 models. Both the bogie and truck wheelbases are a match for the Del Prado models. I don't expect any serious challenges with this and will try to remember to post about this as I proceed. One challenge is the pantographs. I may try to make my own (probably non-functioning) because the VL-80 has a unique arm arrangement I cant find in any commercially available N scale pantographs. Meanwhile, I've been collecting photos from the web to help me get the get the roof detail as correct as possible. I see these locos also ran in Ukraine, Kahzakstan and Uzbekistan (maybe other countries as well), so I may get even more esoteric when I finally decide how I want to paint it.

 

I also found a resin casting for a Russian baggage/postal car on ebay from a source in Ukraine. It matches very well the old PIKO Russian coaches.

 

As for the Chinese DF4D Del Prado model: I initially bought a couple of the Del Prado models on line and, thanks to a Taiwan modeler's YouTube video, discovered that the Kato SD-40 (NOT the SD-40-2, which is too long!) is the perfect chassis fit for powering this model. Truck and Center-to-center dimensions match perfectly. I since have been informed that the Bachmann SD-45 will also work.

 

However, you no longer have to do this as there are superb models of this - and the earlier DF4B Diesels - in several liveries available from CMR Models (China Model Railways). The quality is comparable to Kato. You can get the exact same livery as the Del Prado model and simply transfer the Chairman Mao headplate to the CMR model.

 

CMR also has Chinese coaches that are virtually perfect stand-ins for the iconic horizontal ribbed Russian coaches.

 

As for other Russian N scale: Does anyone know what has happened to Red Star Models? I've tried sending Chris White several email messages in the past couple of years, but never get a reply. Are they still making any Russian N scale freight cars?

 

Also available is a DF-11 Diesel that is actually ready for DCC with sound - a speaker uut out is already in the model.You can order these on line from Lee Kwon or E.Z. Transcom in Hong Kong for quite reasonable prices. Check their websites.

 

Nice work - keep us posted on other projects!

 

- Paul Ingraham, AsiaNRail

 

[cteno4]

Paul,

 

Chris has not been to shows for a while now. I think I heard life hit him hard there. I'll see if I can find out what's up with the company thru a friend.

 

Cheers

 

Jeff

[medusa]

Hi Paul,

 

that's very valuable information, thanks a lot.

About the VL-80 pantograph, I also didn't find anything comparable. Since I'm not a rivet counter, in the end I decided to take something which at least almost fits. That was the red Piko pantograph.

EDIT: it is cool that VL-80s are running in so many places in Eurasia, too. Thought that's the case only for the numerous russian diesel types. A 2M62 operated by Mongolian Railways would be an eye-catcher. ;)

 

About the resin russian baggage car, I still need exactly that for a conversion to a generator car. Saw that the "Czar's Gold" luxury train had exactly that. A conversion from an old Piko car may be possible, too. Not yet decided.

 

Putting a SD-40 chassis into the DF-4 shell is maybe the best plan for me. I could buy a Canadian SD-40. You know, just for the case at least in the model world they manage to build the Bering strait tunnel. So I would end up with one chassis and two "suits" for it. :D

 

Regs, ~Diane.

Edited December 28, 2016 by medusa

[Railtunes]

Hello, Diane,

 

I can save you looking for a Kato SD-40 chassis. As I mentioned, I got some of the new CMR Models Chinese DF4B and DF4D models, so my project of converting the Del Prado model was superseded. However, in preparation, I had already accumulated 4 x Del Prado models and 3 Kato SD-40 chassis. I was able to obtain separate chassis without the body shells, so I'd be very happy to supply you with a chassis. If you contact me directly (pei @ sonic.net) we can discuss possible payment or exchange for European stuff.

 

I can't object to your idea of the Canadian body swap, as I also model Canadian Pacific. Then, of course, there is also the direct connection with the Alaska Railroad, and models are available for that as well! I'll have to try running my CPR SD-40s with the Piko Russian coaches to get an idea how that might look. That would move the Bering Strait connection back to the 1960s, but I could invoke "modeler's license" to explain that easily enough! And imagine the VL-80 pulling the "Canadian"! LOL!

 

As for the M62 Diesels, I'm repainting my Minitrix model for North Korea, as they ran these since the Soviet era and also inherited a bunch more of them from Germany, Czech Republic and elsewhere when they became redundant in Europe in the 1990s. The North Koreans even converted some to electrics, so you could do one with the Piko pantographs on the roof for something really different!

 

As you mentioned Mongolia, they did some "kitbashing" with the cab from the M62 and a newly constructed American-style General Electric narrow hood at the back. This could be done possibly with a shell from Minitrix M62 mated to the rear of the new Arnold Hornby U25C. In fact, if you can get the Minitrix shell separately, you can use both ends and do TWO Mongolian conversions! There are other options for "near enough" versions of the GE part as well. Of course, Mongolia had the "standard" M62 before they had GE repower them.

 

Great exploring these esoteric modeling possibilities with you! Let me know about the chassis swap!

 

- Paul Ingraham, AsiaNRail

 

 

 

 

 

 

[medusa]

Paul,

 

"modeler's license" is what I love so much in the international forums. You cannot imagine what is going here in some of the local forums... rivet counters like drill sergeants. I prefer to withdraw to "Rule No. 1. My railroad, my rules".

Thinking about the "Canadian" underway in Sibiria. Imagine a romantic sunset with it while cruising the shores of Lake Baikal. Plus a rivet counter in the foreground just getting an heart attack. :)

 

About the SD40 chassis, will contact you tomorrow (it's already late here). I have some Minitrix stuff if you're interested in.

 

About the M62s, I saw them on Ebay but also how much the sellers want. Basic idea was to buy two and do minor mods. Maybe later...

I have lots of ideas but not enough time...

 

~D.

Edited December 28, 2016 by medusa

[cteno4]

Paul,

 

Chris has shut down red star rails as a formal store business. He now may produce a run of cars now and then, but won't take orders on them, just announce on his comment page when he has something that he will offer up for sale.

 

He is a very nice chap,mwe have missed him at the train shows.

 

http://www.redstarrailways.com/comment.asp

 

Cheers

 

Jeff

[Railtunes]

Thanks, Jeff, for the update on Red Star Rails. 

 

Having read Chris' Comments in the link you provided, I do hold some hope that he will make some further N scale models. I'll try to contact him and see what he may have in mind and offer him encouragement.

 

- Paul Ingraham, AsiaNRail

[cteno4]

Paul,

 

yes im sure he would appreciate that as he loves his russian trains! I think the biz just got too much with life things hitting him there so had to drop it back to more of a hobby than a business, hence not taking orders and having to deliver, but still producing now and then and offering it up on his schedule once its about there. Understandable, ive done production and its usually a lot of pressure to meet dates and deal with preorders and new orders when you are exhausted from doing the production run! So now the more artisan/craft business than the regular train business for him. He loves his trains so im sure something will continue to happen! As I said he is an excellent chap and knows his stuff, miss seeing him at shows and the world rail group that was here in the larger tri state area that he was central to. I only ever got to a couple of those but they were a fun all around the world group you would have loved!

 

cheers

 

jeff

[medusa]

Good to know. Maybe I can still ask him about a russian baggage car.

[medusa]

A postscriptum concerning the SD40 chassis from Paul...

 

 

Couplers still missing but runs fine so far. For couplers, I will put NEM pockets in cut-outs in the front skirts.

[HantuBlauLOL]

A postscriptum concerning the SD40 chassis from Paul...

 

df-4d.png

 

Couplers still missing but runs fine so far. For couplers, I will put NEM pockets in cut-outs in the front skirts.

 

man, that fits perfectly..

[Railtunes]

That's looking good! Can you post a photo of the chassis with the body removed so we can see how you built the mounting? Who makes the NEM coupler mountings you will use?

[medusa]

Yes I can. ;)

 

 

On the chassis there were 2 major things to do: remove the LED PCB and cut 1mm or so from the top of the chassis. Second, on the upper edge of the black fuel tank model, there is some structure molded into the plastic. Filed that away. The DelPrado shell clamps on that filed small area.

 

On the shell, I removed the drivers cabin and skirts from the DelPrado metal chassis and glued it into the shell. As a guidance, I made spacers from 3mm black polystyrene which center the shell on the Kato chassis. (Kato SD40 chassis frame has 11mm width in the center parts and 10mm over the bogies. The shell is 16mm inner width)

For fine correction of the shell height, I glued small brown paper squares inside the shell. This is just I wanted to leave the characteristic skirts intact which are quite long and touch the rails if you're not careful about.

 

 

Edit: the NEM pockets I buy from a small German online dealer. Can post the link if you're interested but I don't know if they sell overseas.

Edited January 22, 2017 by medusa

[Railtunes]

Thanks for the additional rebuild information. That looks simple enough! Knowing when you received the chassis from me, it looks like a less-than-a-day project using just simple hand tools. Very nice!

 

Please post the link or website for the German NEM pocket dealer. If he doesn't ship outside the EU, I'm sure we can work out something.

I have various "extra" NEM knuckle-type couplings than came with the Chinese models, as well as some from Dapol, which I could try to mount at a higher height, using these NEM pockets, to match the Micro-Trains couplers.

 

- Paul

Edited January 22, 2017 by Railtunes

[medusa]

Here are the links:

http://www.modellbahn-hobbyshop.de/Kupplungen-Normschaechte/Normschacht-kurz-Spur-N?source=2&refertype=1&referid=49

http://www.modellbahn-hobbyshop.de/Kupplungen-Normschaechte/Kurzkupplungskulisse-mit-Normschacht-Spur-N?source=2&refertype=1&referid=49

 

One is the N gauge single NEM pocket, the other one a komplete mechanic including the NEM pocket (but without the coupler iself). Looks like the single pockets currently are solds out.

 

I have both for possible projects / mods. The complete mechanic has a pin on which the pocket is pressed so you can adjust the height you need.

[medusa]

Just to complete this, some report about the couplers on the DF4:

 

 

I drilled and filed 2x4mm holes into the front skirts on the shell. Some polystyrene parts glued behind the shell front formed a base for the coupler pivot.

The NEM pockets have a 1mm hole at their end so I drilled a hole of same size into the polystyrene base and epoxied a 1mm copper wire pin into it.

 

The NEM pocket is loosely put on the pin and then the Arnold coupler plugged through the hole in the skirt into the pocket. This way it can't fall off.

Last frame shows my "Messwagen" (also kitbashed long ago from a Minitrix restaurant car) which serves as a coupler test bench here. Seems it fits. Track tests in curves still have to come.

Edited January 28, 2017 by medusa