Ahem. Yes, me again. Odd train behaviour

[Cen]

I mentioned previously I've got this random diesel (Canadian ? No idea). I bought it with the DCC chip installed to try out DCC. It seemed to work ok, but then it started acting oddly. It stops, anywhere on the track, no apparent reason. If you push down, fairly firmly, on the top of the train, it seems to 'wake up' and you can hear the motor buzzing and then off it goes. The video below was taken to show what the layout looked like in motion, but just my luck the diesel played up as I was filming it. Note, this can happen anywhere on the track. It died this time just short of the power entry track so it's not like it's miles from the feed.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfhvKKnJdR4

 

Any suggestions ?

 

Cheers,

  Cen.

[Bernard]

Cen - I couldn't watch the video it say "embedded by request."

[Cen]

The intarwebs defeated me there for a minute. Should work now!

[Bernard]

I would run the motor car of the 700 on the inner track to test it and I would also run the CP on the outer track that the 700 is using. You are basically testing the track, if the 700 also has problems then there might be a loose connection in the track, because you know it runs find on the outer track. If the CP again has problems on the outer track that the 700 runs find on, it's the CP.

 

Easy things first...clean the wheels of the CP with light alcohol and let it dry. Then try running it again. If it still has problems, you are going to have to check the connections from the truck to the chassis to the motor. Make sure there is a contact going from every point. If everything is fine then you are going to have to check the decoder install. Is it a plug in or was it soldered? If it was soldered, I would re-solder the decoder it might be a bad solder join. If it's a plug in, I you pull it out and put it back in, maybe it wasn't put in all the way.

But the 700 is running great! Good luck.

[CaptOblivious]

Some of us had a similar problem with Kato locos that had drop-in boards installed. The boards would sometimes come off the contacts, and pressing on the top of the loco would re-seat the board onto the contacts, letting it take off again.

 

My suggestion would be to take the shell off, and make sure that the DCC board is seated correctly. You might then try using small folded up wads of aluminum foil between the contacts on the board and the contacts on the loco to ensure constant connection. Although your loco is undoubtedly different, here is an example of what I mean:

http://cargoplus.dynalias.net:82/content/view/29/2/

[alpineaustralia]

I agree with Capt.

This is a classic case of either:

1. decoder coming off the contact rails; or

2. decoder comming away from contact points for the motor.

 

The easiest way to check is to turn the lights on.

In the case of 1. the lights will also turn off.

In the case of 2. the lights will stay on but the motor will cease to turn over.

 

In the case of 2. an alternative to Capt's suggestion is to solder the contacts onto the decoder directly or through decoder wire.

[CaptOblivious]

I agree with Capt.

This is a classic case of either:

1. decoder coming off the contact rails; or

2. decoder comming away from contact points for the motor.

 

The easiest way to check is to turn the lights on.

In the case of 1. the lights will also turn off.

In the case of 2. the lights will stay on but the motor will cease to turn over.

 

In the case of 2. an alternative to Capt's suggestion is to solder the contacts onto the decoder directly or through decoder wire.

 

 

 

Let me add that I too take soldering to be the solution to just about every problem, but that I mention the aluminum foil trick because not everyone is as fearless with their expensive trains as Alpine and me :D But if you know your way around a soldering iron, Alpine is right: The time's come to break it out.

[Cen]

Thanks guys.

 

It's definitely the loco. I might (might) be brave and open her up. Or, I take her back to modeljunction.

 

Oh and...the N700 blew up an hour ago. Power car dead. My son caused a short with the diesel (forgot to set points), caused the controller to freak out and cause a full power stop and now the n700 which was running as well is stone dead. So I now have :

 

defunct n700

fails-when-it-wants-to diesel

you-must-be-kidding-I'm-not-staying-on-that-track scotsman.

 

My locos love me.

 

Sigh.

 

Cen.

[Bernard]

Cen - Don't be afraid to open up the CP, just follow CaptO's step by step guide.

I don't use Kato switches so I'm not familiar how switching points can fry a decoder. But again, it's not a big deal. Open up the N700 also and see how the decoder was installed and what brand of decoder was put in. Order the same one, and just follow how the blow one was installed.

[alpineaustralia]

is it a kato n700?

If so, then  you would havr installed a kato decoder made by digitrax.

The decoder should be protected from short circuits.

I would pull the n700 decoder out and smell whether it has that distinctive BBq'd decoder smell before assuming it was fried (or BBq'ed or whatever).

[Bernard]

is it a kato n700?

If so, then  you would havr installed a kato decoder made by digitrax.

The decoder should be protected from short circuits.

I would pull the n700 decoder out and smell whether it has that distinctive BBq'd decoder smell before assuming it was fried (or BBq'ed or whatever).

 

Alpine just reminded me, if it is a Digitrax decoder that fried, you can send it back to Digitrax for a replacement if you have the sales receipt. Here is the link to the warranty page:

http://www.digitrax.com/warranty2.php

[Cen]

I tried installing the n700 decoder before (http://www.jnsforum.com/index.php/topic,951.0.html) - even with CaptOblivious' patient help it was clear that I am not a decoder installer. I can see it through the floor hatch, doesn't look blown but something certainly is dead.

 

Loathe as I am to send it away again, anyone know of a good repair service that will look it over ?

 

The Diesel - I just managed to accidentally pull off one of the trucks trying to open it. It has the expected tiny, fiddly pieces - the two sets of wheels, plastic shell and two small metal pieces that appear to link the wheels to the contacts (motor power?) It looks like pressing on the top of the loco gets the contact (long strip of metal) to touch the top of the fiddly piece (coathanger kind of shape) which then links to the wheels. This seems an odd way of routing the power - if the strip moves off the 'coathanger', the loco would stop. There are four long strips, so I assume four potential power pickup points (?) but it took me literally yet another hour or two to reassemble the truck so further investigation is not high on my 'to do' list.

 

Cen

[Bernard]

I tried installing the n700 decoder before (http://www.jnsforum.com/index.php/topic,951.0.html) - even with CaptOblivious' patient help it was clear that I am not a decoder installer. I can see it through the floor hatch, doesn't look blown but something certainly is dead.

 

Loathe as I am to send it away again, anyone know of a good repair service that will look it over ?

 

The Diesel - I just managed to accidentally pull off one of the trucks trying to open it. It has the expected tiny, fiddly pieces - the two sets of wheels, plastic shell and two small metal pieces that appear to link the wheels to the contacts (motor power?) It looks like pressing on the top of the loco gets the contact (long strip of metal) to touch the top of the fiddly piece (coathanger kind of shape) which then links to the wheels. This seems an odd way of routing the power - if the strip moves off the 'coathanger', the loco would stop. There are four long strips, so I assume four potential power pickup points (?) but it took me literally yet another hour or two to reassemble the truck so further investigation is not high on my 'to do' list.

 

Cen

 

 

 

 

Cen - Where are you located? So I can recommend a place to send it to, that is if you are in the USA.

[alpineaustralia]

Sure between us we can walk him  thru it. Come one guys. Does anyone have an n700?

[Cen]

Bernard - UK based, southeast.

 

Alpine - I'm scared of taking it apart because simple items like 'reassemble the drive shaft' take me literally hours of effort. I nearly bent one of the plastic drive rods (Ok, I did but I bent it back) and breaking one of those is going to be 'the end'. These things may be 'toys', but they aren't cheap!

 

Cheers,

  Cen.

[Martijn Meerts]

We need to set up some service stations or something, have people in various parts of the world offer trains being sent to them for repairs ;)

[Bernard]

Bernard - UK based, southeast.

 

Alpine - I'm scared of taking it apart because simple items like 'reassemble the drive shaft' take me literally hours of effort. I nearly bent one of the plastic drive rods (Ok, I did but I bent it back) and breaking one of those is going to be 'the end'. These things may be 'toys', but they aren't cheap!

 

Cheers,

  Cen.

 

 

I'm in New York and I know a place in the USA to send it to but there are people in the UK that can do it. So UK members any recommendations for Cen?

[CaptOblivious]

I haven't completed reading this thread, but let me note something very important.

 

Although the Kato decoders are designed by Digitrax, Digitrax will not repair them. I did have good luck with Kato USA; your best bet is to get in touch with them (even though you are overseas) and see if they can help you.

 

That said: Cen, why don't we split the N700 discussion off into another thread, so we don't get confused? Some responders appear already to be.

 

So, in response to the diesel. That's how Kato does most of their locos, and believe it or not, that system is pretty reliable. I would (and I know you hate hearing this) disassemble the loco further to make sure the problem isn't something that would be obvious with the shell off, rather than stop at the brass rails.

[Mudkip Orange]

So I now have :

 

defunct n700

fails-when-it-wants-to diesel

you-must-be-kidding-I'm-not-staying-on-that-track scotsman.

 

I'm gonna go ahead and just not switch to DCC anytime soon.

[Cen]

Wierdness continues :

 

Diesel : Since I accidentally disassembled and reassembled one truck, it seems to be running ok. Confused, but not going to look a gift horse...

 

Shinkansen : I opened the hatch in the floor and poked/prodded the decoder. Hallelujah, it resurrected the motor car! Thanks for the idea guys.

 

So, at the moment - it's all good!

 

Cheers,

  Cen.

[CaptOblivious]

Hooray! Glad to hear it. Let us know if the magic wears off!

[alpineaustralia]

Everything you have said indicates decoder or contacts being lose. My Kato E3 has this problem all the time.