Small B-Train Layout

[Martijn Meerts]

Really interesting way of testing the design. 

 

Which 3D tool are you using? And how do you know it’s printed at the correct scale? 

 

[cteno4]

Great prototyping!

 

jeff

[kami_illy]

14 hours ago, Martijn Meerts said:

Really interesting way of testing the design. 

 

Which 3D tool are you using? And how do you know it’s printed at the correct scale? 

 

 

The 3D model is made with sketchup. It's buildt  in scale already (so i can put in measurements of buildings/tracks etc... without having to calculate). The base of the layout has exact measurements, so the jpg or pdf being exported from sketchup, can be scaled pretty precisely in photoshop. Then you just need to print in 100% and the result should be pretty accurate. At least good enough to do some mock-ups...

[Martijn Meerts]

Ah nice.. Never really got into sketchup myself, but I've used 3ds max and maya quite a bit in the past. I've been thinking about doing a 3d version of my plans as well, so might give sketchup a look. Also been looking at blender, which has come a long way for a free program.

[kami_illy]

Yeah. professionally i also work with ArchiCAD, VectorWorks, etc... but sketchup has the big advantage of being super simple and therefor fast. 3ds max, cinema, blender and so on are extremely good but i feel they are too complex for this kind of modelling/rendering. 

 

Also in my free time i don't want to use the same programs i am using at work all day long 😉

[cteno4]

I really like your foam core space filling models, great way to help the final visualizations.

 

jeff

[kami_illy]

Found some more pieces of foam board and continued with the study of the spaces... very satisfying. 

 

 

 

 

 

[cteno4]

Simple space forms are so satisfying to study like this. Hits a totally different spot In the brain than doing cad.

 

jeff

[kami_illy]

Before Christmas I had some time and space to go on with the project, since the family was travelling and i had to stay bc of work... 

 

So i decided to venture further into the world of mock-ups. First i printed the layout (as a patchwork of several A3-sheets) and put the tracks and foam "buildings" and so on together. 

 

 

 

 

Then I got some cardboard and cut the baseboard. 

 

Edited January 23, 2020 by kami_illy

[kami_illy]

Building the frame and some (very improvised / rough) cable routing..

 

 

 

 

 

[kami_illy]

Glueing down the printed layout and putting the track and buildings 

 

 

 

 

 

[kami_illy]

And the final state of the mock-up. I was really happy to see the things coming together. And run some shorties of course!! Saw some design flaws as well... Next step will be the temple area. My plan is to build some kind of inlay that will sit between the two tracks. The Sankei kits did already arrive. Now i'll have to wait for the next free time bc life with toddlers doesn't mix well with miniatures. 

 

 

 

 

Think with this I am riding the line between layout planning and layout building 😁 For now I'll leave it here. We'll see how it continues..!

Edited January 23, 2020 by kami_illy

[Cat]

Ooh, that's coming along nicely!

[Martijn Meerts]

Mock-up? Looks like an actual layout to me 😄

 

[disturbman]

Agreed. I quite like the abstract version. Like a sort of functional architectural model... What's your profession again? You probably could print facades for the buildings and give them a roof and you will have an (almost) finished layout.

Out of curiosity, what kind of cardboard you are using? I have been considering using light materials (cardboard, foam board and cork boards) to build small modules. Only issue could be durability but I like the idea of approaching without using wood.

Edited January 27, 2020 by disturbman

[cteno4]

kami,

that is really great mock up! Really the way to visually plan it out! Old school architectural modeling, great to see it. It really takes hardly any time to whack up some cardboard of foam core to do this and is really worth it! Kudos!
 

Disturbman,

Take a look at styrene faced Foam board. Basically foamcore/foam board that has thin stryene face instead of paper as in usual foam board. It’s super stuff and tough but very light. Perfect ultralight building material. Only downsides are you really need a table or band saw for cut it up as it does not cut cleanly with a matte knife and it has to be sourced from a plastics supplier or sign making shop. They use it a lot for signs and point of purchase displays a lot since light and durable. We use it in exhibits for anything that’s chest high or above as it won’t crush someone if something ever were to fall on someone.

 

keff

[kami_illy]

17 hours ago, disturbman said:

Agreed. I quite like the abstract version. Like a sort of functional architectural model... What's your profession again? You probably could print facades for the buildings and give them a roof and you will have an (almost) finished layout.

Out of curiosity, what kind of cardboard you are using? I have been considering using light materials (cardboard, foam board and cork boards) to build small modules. Only issue could be durability but I like the idea of approaching without using wood.

 

That idea was also crossing my mind. To create a white "ghost city" so the focus ist entirely on the train related stuff and maybe some special things like the shrines/bamboo... Also this white blocks could be replaced by actual buildings later. Instead of printed facades i think i'll try to add another white layer with either texture or simple facade elements like openings, recesses and so on. 

 

The buildings are made of 3mm foam board with a matte finish. The baseboard is 2mm finn cardboard. It is cheap, super easy of cut, can be glued with wood glue and easily painted, glued on, ...whatever and looks good. Has this warm, natural feel to it.

[kami_illy]

Btw, you are correct. I am an architect. 

So I am really open to a more abstract representation of the scenery. Fits the concept of modeling quite well I think.

To take a real scene, break it down to its essentials and rebuild in a condensed, scaled down way. More like showing the essence and not the actual correct scaled down scene. 

[disturbman]

On 1/27/2020 at 6:55 PM, cteno4 said:

Take a look at styrene faced Foam board. Basically foamcore/foam board that has thin stryene face instead of paper as in usual foam board. It’s super stuff and tough but very light. Perfect ultralight building material. Only downsides are you really need a table or band saw for cut it up as it does not cut cleanly with a matte knife and it has to be sourced from a plastics supplier or sign making shop. They use it a lot for signs and point of purchase displays a lot since light and durable. We use it in exhibits for anything that’s chest high or above as it won’t crush someone if something ever were to fall on someone.

Jeff, that's actually an issue I have been facing, I don't have space for large and specialized tool. With a small child, and the various hobbies of my partner (bookbinding, knitting, sewing), space has become a rare commodity at home.
 

10 hours ago, kami_illy said:

That idea was also crossing my mind. To create a white "ghost city" so the focus is entirely on the train related stuff and maybe some special things like the shrines/bamboo...

I find the idea quite striking and interesting, out of the ordinary. It triggers my love for minimalism. It reminds an old z scale catalogue, probably from the early 90s (?), in which Märklin used mirroring surfaces to build sceneries. Very dated now but I was always fascinated by that catalogue.

 

10 hours ago, kami_illy said:

The baseboard is 2mm finn cardboard. It is cheap, super easy of cut.

 

I think I have some, Oo a very similar material. Just used some to repair a pair of cupboard doors. Maybe I should give another look at Modulor, see what material they have that may have overlooked. I would love to see how your (sketch) layout feels in real.

[cteno4]

19 hours ago, kami_illy said:

Btw, you are correct. I am an architect. 

So I am really open to a more abstract representation of the scenery. Fits the concept of modeling quite well I think.

To take a real scene, break it down to its essentials and rebuild in a condensed, scaled down way. More like showing the essence and not the actual correct scaled down scene. 

kami,

 

yes perceived scenery works well and is a lot of Japanese model railroading with temp set ups.

 

its a fun way to play with the mind’s eye!

 

cheers

 

jeff

[cteno4]

22 hours ago, disturbman said:

Jeff, that's actually an issue I have been facing, I don't have space for large and specialized tool. With a small child, and the various hobbies of my partner (bookbinding, knitting, sewing), space has become a rare commodity at home.

Good quality foamcore works well if you are careful with it. I’ve seen Ttrak modules made of foamcore carefully handled make it to a lot of Ttrak shows. If for home it’s the best solution for stiff and light and cuts so well with a sharpe mattknife and good straight edge. Good quality corrugated cardboard can also do really nice stuff if treated gently. We used a lot of each in exhibit models and it held up well with gentle handling. All good with a sharp matte knife and good straight edge! I don’t want to think how many pieces of chipboard, foamcore and corrugated cardboard I sliced up doing mainly exhibit models and some architectural modules! Literally thousands. I would order it by the bundle...

 

hot glue works really well for fast and tough assembly of foam core and corrugated cardboard, fast setting but only issue is you can only do about 12-18” of glue joint well as it starts to cool fast and you can’t do super flush joints. For longer and more flush joints thick PVA works great, just takes Take time to set up and needs to be held in place while setting up.

 

if you need a hard surface 020 styrene laminated onto corrugated cardboard, chipboard (or matte board just more expensive), or foamcore works well. Lamination also helps stiffen things up. 
 

jeff

[Cat]

On 1/28/2020 at 5:14 AM, kami_illy said:

Btw, you are correct. I am an architect. 

So I am really open to a more abstract representation of the scenery. Fits the concept of modeling quite well I think.

To take a real scene, break it down to its essentials and rebuild in a condensed, scaled down way. More like showing the essence and not the actual correct scaled down scene. 

The modelling techniques and artistic approach are also very similar to those used by theatre set designers.  We learned to make foam-core models like that for developing the preliminary concepts in Stage & Lighting Design Class.  Designing and building foam core models was pretty much the entirety of our earliest class projects..  Depending on creative interactions between the Director and the Designer, the actual set itself could well be a minimalist expression of the essence.

[disturbman]

On 1/29/2020 at 7:23 AM, cteno4 said:

Good quality foamcore works well if you are careful with it. I’ve seen Ttrak modules made of foamcore carefully handled make it to a lot of Ttrak shows. If for home it’s the best solution for stiff and light and cuts so well with a sharpe mattknife and good straight edge.

Indeed, I made some tests using foamcore and hot glue and the result lasted until I threw them out years later. Very sturdy for its lightness. I was mostly unimpressed by the joints, or my lack of skills at making them.

I think I'll try laminating thin cardboard this time and see how things turns out. I appreciate working with it as it is very easy to cut and to work with. I think I have 1mm thin rather than 2mm at home. Might just go to Berlin's best architecture, hobby, and stationary supply shop, I usually try to avoid it as it is very hard not to want to buy everything there. 😁

[cteno4]

6 hours ago, disturbman said:

usually try to avoid it as it is very hard not to want to buy everything there

I go to the local art supply (sadly only the expensive chain is left here in this area) with a 1/144 miniaturist friend so we can keep each other from maxing the credit cards out! 
 

yeah laminating even thin, hard chipboard (like a 1mm photo board) to even just the frame sides would really stiffen things up, reinforce the foamcore joints, and make much smaller and cleaner joints. Foamcore joints do tend to stick out and hard to get perfectly perpendicular cuts in 3mm foamcore. I’ve trained my hand with a matte knife to keep it really perpendicular. Some matte cutter systems can go 3mm and keep blade perpendicular, but they get expensive and I’ve never like them as much I think as I’ve cut so much by hand in my lifetime. That being said I still will do a couple of quick practice cuts before I start chopping up a bunch. Also having a very wide straight edge helps as you can orient your fingers better holdingnthe straight edged to Jeep your blade arm swing clear and clean.

 

jeff

[kami_illy]

So, bc of recent global events it seems I get to actually build the layout!!! Or at least parts of it. Also I have a clean conscience for buying buildings and materials to make up for the cancelled trip to Japan this May. 

 

Anyways I will continue to post about the physical progress here. 

 

Enjoy this little teaser 😉

 

Edited March 25, 2020 by kami_illy