Kato 10-332 Vs 10-333 .. spot the difference?

[krt]

G'day,

 

Can someone please tell me the difference between these kits (apart from the ~$20). 

It's possible to see a minor difference in the front-end coupling-area, but that's all I can tell from the photos.

 

Kato 10-332 at Popondetta

Kato 10-333 at Popondetta

 

Both were available at my time of purchase, but I bought the 10-332 assuming the higher price meant it was somehow better.

 

I would like to buy some more "middle" passenger cars for the set, but they do not seem to be sold seprately. 

I already have the dining car and the green-line passenger car.

 

thanks,

-krt

 

[krt]

Ah, it's the "addon set" - http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003428

 

Maybe it's unpowered.

[ToniBabelony]

Ah, it's the "addon set" - http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10003428

 

Maybe it's unpowered.

 

You have just answered your own question ;)

 

A classic, beautiful and timeless train.

 

P.s. it ran in all kinds of crazy formations, even with front cars back-to-back with dining and green cars in between. You can practically go crazy with these 165 Series.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Toni Babelony

[Ochanomizu]

Hello Mr krt and welcome to the forum.

 

Please allow me to assist you further with 10-332/3.

 

Firstly, 165系, Shonan colour.  The product you refer to is the Low Roof version of 165系.  Specifically, it ran express services on the Chuo Main Line and branches.  You can see the basic formations here: http://www.katomodels.com/cgi-bin/nmi_pictureview.cgi?id=165kei&num=7

 

In the 1980's I would catch the Alps express train home from Kofu, if I missed the preceding 115系 local.

 

165系 Low Roof variant was developed specifically for use on the Chuo Main Line because of low tunnel height.  It is often confused with 165系, 115系, and 113系, all of which have also appeared in the Shonan colour.

 

Personally, I have the complete 12-car Alps consist (the first one on the list) in both Kato and Tomix.  The problem with the Kato version is the add-on cars come with numbers pre-printed.  Because the consist needs 2 x 10-333 you will end up with duplicate car numbers.  The Tomix version, based on 92385, comes with transfers to set the car numbers correct.

[krt]

Thanks for that link Ocanomizu.

 

The photograph of the 165 in that Kato webpage link is excellent.

 

 

Edited August 7, 2015 by krt

[krt]

Ah... has anyone put a DCC Decoder into one of these ?

Are they "DCC Ready"?

 

The motor is in the centre right?

Is it worth getting the Kato EM13 decoder module? ... I guess it would install easily.

 

Would one also need the Kato "light decoders" FL12 at the ends too?

[E6系]

Hello krt,

 

So sorry.  Not DCC Friendly.  EM13 and FL12 unsuitable.

 

http://www.katomodels.com/product/nmi/165kei.shtml

 

Suggest you consider Digitrax DZ125.  Digitrax make the Kato decoders.  The Kato decoders include Transponding.

 

Other brands also suitable if you don't require Transponding feature.

[krt]

I just installed a TCS 1296 Z2 decoder module in this model.

 

I'm happy that it works fine, but the module is a little bit too visible through the windows.

In the future, I would like to glue it down, and paint it all white.  Trim the wires off a bit too.

But it was my first time installing this sort of thing, and while I'm comfortable with soldering, the

more expensive the parts become, the less comfortable I get ;)    So I left too much wire on too,

and didn't do as good a job as I could have.  I was not even sure that the tabs sticking up actually

went down to the motor.  Other things I'd read indicated that (for other engine tupes) this was

the case.  So I guessed, and got lucky.

 

Having a better look, perhaps the module might even fit in where the wires come in from the wheels. 

But I did not consider this before soldering.  The module measures measures a bit less than 13x7x3mm.

 

[kvp]

The trick is to add a socket. That allows tiny wires and you can test with an analog plug first. Glue down the socket, paint the wires and then add a pinned decoder. :-)

[krt]

Ahh with DCC the front+rear lights are now front-only.

I'll have to think about this.

[katoftw]

If you have installed a decoder and now you directional lights only light up one direction, then you have used the incorrect decoder.

[kvp]

Analog lights are bipolar and most decoder outputs are pull to ground only (single pole). Kato's dcc ready trains have a split headlight with 4 connectors that are tied together in analog. Usually you have to split the headlight circuit yourself or try to find a bipolar decoder. Third and common option is to connect the motor outputs and set speed min. to max. but this has the problem of inactive headlights at standstill.

 

Usual solution is to split the headlight circuit from bipolar into 4 contacts and then wire up the lights with a 7 wire decoder (american way) or 6 pin and two diodes (european way, including Kato's european prototypes).

 

Ps: i prefer the 6 pin way as it allows easy conversion between digital and analog

[Welshbloke]

The major differences between the two sets (aside from the motor) are that the dummy set has working couplers on the cab ends. For some reason these are Rapidos but very easy to change to Tightlocks like the rest of the set. You could fit those to the powered set but you'd need to change the cab end bogies in order to add a coupler mount - it's easy enough to do but you need to buy extra parts.

 

The dummy set doesn't have lighting either, as it's intended to be used in the middle of a train.

[krt]

If you have installed a decoder and now you directional lights only light up one direction, then you have used the incorrect decoder.

 

No, the problem is that the set is 3 parts, with the central unit having the motor - and in this case the DCC decoder.

However the front/rear lights are in the surrounding cars.

 

The obvious solution is to simply put a decoder in all cars, but this is (at the moment) cost prohibitive.

I did consider simply changing the polarity in one of the cars to fix it as the "tail", but IMHO this is not a good soluton.

[katoftw]

Just assumed you had completed the install.

Edited October 5, 2015 by katoftw

[kvp]

If you want fixed lighting, then it's possible to add a small 2 position 6 pole slide switch with 2 diodes that allows setting head/off/tail lights by blocking one polarity from the DCC stream. You can also use cables across the cars (like some european models). You'll need blue (common power), yellow and white (direction 1 and 2). This still leaves you with the task of modifying any dual head/tail (white/red) light circuits into 4 or 3 contacts variant, but you can just wire up headlight (white) only variants directly.