Atlas N-scale Shay on reserve

[velotrain]

Atlas is doing another run of their famous Shay.  Although I saw one indication that some were due in 2Q15 (they apparently didn't make it), and others in 1Q16, a magazine I just received indicates that the product will generally be available in early 2016.  If interested, the only sensible place to buy (Reserve) them is Brooklyn Locomotive Works.  However, they do not deliver outside of the USA, so you will need to investigate other avenues if that is your situation.  BLW indicate that the first shipment is already sold out at Atlas, and I would suggest acting quickly if interested, as I'm certain that the magazine mention (major US MR magazine) will trigger a lot of activity.

 

http://www.blwnscale.com/atlas-shay.htm

 

Sadly, all of the photos on the site show the non-working side.

 

For those not familiar with this magnificent type of engine, used primarily for logging and mining (worldwide), here are a couple of images.  The image of the internals is obviously from the previous run, and I suspect there have been updates to the lighting.  Note the large Mashima motor and flywheels, which allows this engine to really crawl very slowly - just like the prototype.  The cylinders are obviously static, but the exposed driveshaft does operate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here is a video of one fitted with sound.

 

 

Notice the very smooth slow speed running, and I'd guess that's with a straight DC controller.

 

In Japan, the Kiso and Alishan Forest Railways were associated with Shays, and I believe many of them are rotting away on Taiwan.

 

If anyone would want to add DCC, here is a forum discussion.  This also discusses the excellent build quality and running capabilities of this locomotive.

 

http://forum.atlasrr.com/forum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=54040

[Nick_Burman]

In Japan, the Kiso and Alishan Forest Railways were associated with Shays, and I believe many of them are rotting away on Taiwan.

 

If anyone would want to add DCC, here is a forum discussion.  This also discusses the excellent build quality and running capabilities of this locomotive.

 

http://forum.atlasrr.com/forum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=54040

 

<nitpick>

 

Although AFAIK Kiso did try a Shay, they were never used there as the fleet was made entirely of rod engines. The Forestry Bureau did have a Shay (c/n 2001) though, used first on the Tsugaru Forestry Ry. in Aomori, then tranferred  the Yanaze Forestry Railway near Aki in Shikoku.

 

There were two other users in Japan, one being Yawata steelworks (ordered for reservoir construction, then used around the mill) and the other the Yokosuka Arsenal. The Atlas Shay would pass muster as one of the Yokosuka engines. Both Yawata and Yokosuka were 1067mm gauge so one can justify one pulling JNR freight cars...

 

</nitpick>

 

 

 

Cheers NB

Edited July 26, 2015 by Nick_Burman

[velotrain]

Nick - I was only going from what I saw on the Alishan Wiki page:

 

> "The first motive power was a Shay locomotive purchased second hand from the Kiso Forest Railway in Japan. Eventually the railway acquired 20 Shay locomotives."

 

nickpick noted ;-)

[beakaboy]

I have one of the first release Shays and it is incredible! Running it with DC. Its great to know I could run JNR wagons behind it. What wagons would be suitable and possibly any photos or links to photos would be appreciated.

[Nick_Burman]

I have one of the first release Shays and it is incredible! Running it with DC. Its great to know I could run JNR wagons behind it. What wagons would be suitable and possibly any photos or links to photos would be appreciated.

 

Other than builder's pics I don't know if the Yokosuka engines were ever photographed. I doubt it, considering that they ran inside a military faciltity, . Also I wouldn't be surprised if the locos were scrapped before WWII.

 

There are builder's photos of the Yawata locos, again I don't know if there are any of the locomotives in service either during the construction of the reservoir or inside the mill. In any case the locos were tiny 14ton machines, very different from the Atlas locos.

 

In shipyard service the engines must have moved just about everything needed for the facility, from standard-issue underpants to steel plates to naval guns. Having said that nothing stops you from bending reality and saying that one of the Yokosuka engines passed into industrial service. A Shay would look good shifting strings of SeKi hoppers at some remote and obscure Hokkaido mine...

 

 

Cheers NB

[beakaboy]

thanks for the info Nick. I only have one hopper at present. The thought of a logging Shay has always appealed as well. Any photos available of the type of log wagons used in Japan. Similar to US?

[velotrain]

 Any photos available of the type of log wagons used in Japan. Similar to US?

 

Try searching for photos of Japanese logging railways - the often-modeled Kiso Forest Railway is a good place to start.

[kvp]

Besides the american/prussian style log carrier wagons used on narrow gauges, the classic cape gauge 2 axle tora open wagon was also in use, mostly on JGR/JNR lines and on private lines that interchanged with them. It's also available off the shelf with log loads.

[beakaboy]

thanks Charles. found some photos to get me started!

[beakaboy]

Thanks Kvp .any idea who stocks them and also manufacturer?

[kvp]

Tomix and i've seen them everywhere on the net, even on ebay.de, but i'm sure there are cheaper sources.

http://www.tomytec.co.jp/tomix/products/n/2725-6.htm

http://www.ebay.de/itm/TOMIX-2726-JNR-Freight-Car-Open-Wagon-Type-TORA-145000-with-Timber-/400262815731

[velotrain]

You might also want to check out what are known as logging disconnects, which give the benefit of adjusting for any size log.  I doubt these are made in N-scale, but they are available in HOn30, which shares the same track gauge.  I found this modeler comment, "One of the things I really like about the Kiso Forest Railway is that they continued using disconnects into the 70s. They had air brakes added, which I think is unusual for industrial equipment."

 

 

 

 

You could always try to bash up something similar on N-gauge bogies.  OTOH, logging companies/railways did a lot of equipment bashing in their own shops.  The Kiso version shown above use a European style frame, shared with V-tippers and other types of feldbahn equipment.

 

 

My thanks to kvp for his research, but I find those tora wagons with their plastic pipe - er, log - loads really ugly.  Loggers are not about to measure the tree to make sure they cut each log exactly the same length to just fill the wagon with no space left over.

 

If you want a realistic looking log load, cut your own branches/twigs.

 

 

While searching I found an interesting example of natural reforestation

 

 

[kvp]

The tora-s are also available without a load, so you can cut your own.

 

The logging cars are made in N with DRG/landerbahn lettering, but you have the remove the cut lumber if you want logs instead. (also made in Z that is good for Nn layouts)

[Nick_Burman]

The only hiccup is that prototipically speaking there were no 3'6" logging railways in Japan like the ones one saw in North America and parts of Europe, with logging spurs being pushed righ up to (or near to) the cutting areas. So the sight of a Shay shoving ToRas up a spur would not have been part of the local "scenery". Having said that, there were 3'6" several private railways which once handled a substatial amount of log traffic (Kita-Ena and Oigawa spring to mind), just the way they did it was somewhat different from Europe and North America. In both cases logging spurs were 762mm gauge, these brought the timber down to transshipment points where it was reloaded onto ToRas and their kin to be forwarded to the sawmill. The "mainline" was usually a common-carrier, often electrified with passenger service while the woods spurs belonged to the Forestry Bureau. The Oigawa was a good example, once upon a time there was a HUGE 762mm logging railway feeding the 3'6" at Senzu (that is one of the reasons why Senzu yard is so big in relation to today's level of activity). From there the logs were taken in solid trains behind electrics to Shin Kanaya, where the loads were either turned over to JNR or sent to the sawmill there (it still exists and so does the spur down to it - Oigawa uses it to store dead equipment).

 

However if one really wants to bend history and incorporate a 3'6" logging railway, I would personally use log cars rather than disconnects, simply on the strength that Ali-Shan used them (the first were built in the US by the Magor Car Co.).

 

Cheers NB

Edited July 29, 2015 by Nick_Burman

[beakaboy]

thanks everyone. some great info. much appreciated. I am thinking of modifying my mini modules (5) to create a logging operation. The modules are approx 400mm long by 300mm wide and sit on a table for operation.

[beakaboy]

a couple of shots of  three of the five modules I am working on. They were old cassette holders that you mounted on the wall. I discarded the plastic cassette inserts, so they are hollow underneath. The scenic top with track,etc lifts off and if you turn the box over, this scenic top sits inside for some protection of scenery, etc, while transporting to a show.

Edited July 30, 2015 by beakaboy

[kvp]

I think this is a great idea! And the completed scene also looks nice.

[velotrain]

It looks like you might already have some logs ;-)

 

I agree with kvp about the completed module, and it looks like you have some complex piping by the berm.

You might want to start the N logging line with the mountainous modules in the rear, and not pull up all your TT track - at least not until you're certain that's what you want to do.  You've done a fair amount of work on those front three modules.  I don't know if other local modelers have similar modules that you can set-up with.

 

You could also do the logging scenes on an even shallower module base, sort of what's known as a shelf layout - a small interchange with a main line might be an interesting scene, along with some simple logging operations.

[beakaboy]

thanks Charles and Kvp. Actually the track is N scale, so I can incorporate these modules. The idea of merging with the main sounds great. I can build a separate slimmer module for logging and have it come on to the 4th or 5th module at an angle. Its something I had not thought of. Once summer arrives, I can get out in my shed to make some progress! I also have an Aru nine centre cab diesel to finish which I intend incorporating in the scene. Just need to find a way to slow its speed down.

[velotrain]

I think of TT track as 12 mm, so I guess it is a narrow gauge - likely 3'6".

 

That being the case, I have another thought.

 

Have you checked to see if anyone, perhaps at Shapeways, produces a replacement boiler shell to convert the Atlas Shay to 1:120 scale?

I know that someone did a HOn30 boiler back when the first one was produced.

This re-release may trigger other adaptations, if one doesn't already exist. 

 

Perhaps more work than you want, but you could always bash your own.

Look at any NZ logging Shays.

Strip the boiler of details, wrap some brass sheet around it, and then add new details.

 

I suspect that the Europeans produce a fair amount of logging equipment for TT scale - perhaps including narrow gauge.

I think that modeling logging in general suggests a fair amount of detail, and using the larger scale will make it that much easier for you.

 

You can always model a Japanese railway in N scale later on.

 

I'm sure there's lots of info / photos available of NZ logging operations.

 

One of my favorite engines is this amazingly funky NZ steamer, likely built from a Porter.

 

 

[beakaboy]

Charles. thanks for all your input. I am keen at some stage  to model some NZ120 logging on my existing NZ120 layout. I have been inspired by the Mamaku bush tramway , which is about 45 minutes from our home. Had only visited it once about 5 years ago and it had been closed since 1974 , so not much left. They did however have  a display unit in a special cage which caught my eye (future project) My thinking is to have a go first at the Japanese N scale logging scene on my mini modules and then progress to the Mamaku attempted creation. some photos sourced from the internet link  below are  attached. I have yet to find my photo of display. It was one of the trucks shown.

More info and photos here:   http://www.internationalsteam.co.uk/tales/lythgoe85.htm

Edited July 31, 2015 by beakaboy

[velotrain]

beakaboy - I was mostly concerned with the possibility of you pulling any prior work out in your conversion to N scale.  However, I knew a local modeler who converted his HO layout to On30 by replacing the structures and scenic details - I can't recall if he made any track changes.

 

It sounds like you could possibly have a shared transfer-yard module, and perhaps swap out any buildings for the two scales.

 

Logging lines were known for improvising their own equipment, but it seems that the Australian and New Zealand bush tramways outdid anything the Americans ever bashed together - at least in terms of funkiness!

[velotrain]

I just saw a Shay on eBay with a seller comment, "used condition left side part is missing between front and rear wheels"  ;-)

[dabsan]

Hi, in 2013 I saw a shay at the front of 集集 (JiJi) station in Taiwan. Very nice locomotive!!

Originally used on the Alishan forest railway.

Edited August 1, 2015 by dabsan

[beakaboy]

thanks for the great photos Dabsan.

My thoughts exactly Charles. (swap out the buildings.) It takes me too long to do scenery as it is.