Kato D 51 Does Not Work

[upwpfan]

Folks

Recently purchased a new (not previously owned) Kato D51 here in the U.S. The fiirst one that I received did not work when placed on a DC track. The best that I could tell was that it has a short some where in it. I returned it to my vendor (MB Klein) and they shipped me a replacement. I got it on test track to day and it did not work either.....

Here are my questions..BTW I can not read their instructions since I do not read Japanese.

 

1. Any body venture a guess what is wrong and what the fix is?

 

2. Can I return it to Kato in Japan and ask them to fix and return under warrenty? Where do I send it and would a letter in English be understood?

 

3. On their instruction sheet they show a diagram that suggests that you place a small plastic screw driver thingy into the smoke stack and turn it on or off....does this have any thing to do with my problem?

 

Any help would be most appreciated. I really like the detail and the look of this steam engine but a non working one does me no good...

 

Regards

 

Jere Ingram

[cteno4]

Jere,

 

Not sure what is going on, but getting two is suspicious it's not just bad units.

 

Perhaps scan and post the instructions and maybe someone who can read Japanese can see if there is something with that screw switch.

 

Btw I doubt kato japan will do anything for you outside japan. Usually for repairs you need to go thru a Japanese dealer with them and parts thru katousa, which will (not always though or may need some pushing) order parts form kato Japan if they have them in stock for you. Can take 1-3 months though to come over and they usually request that you fax them the model's instruction sheet with the part circled so it's totally clear what you will get (not their fault then if you circled the wrong part). While I've doen this a few times over the years (all successful) it's usually been a lot easier to source spare parts thru the usual Japanese exporters

 

Good luck, hope someone here can help!

 

Jeff

Edited July 14, 2015 by cteno4

[katoftw]

The screw switch I'm pretty sure id for the headlight.

 

The common factor in all this is test track.  Have other trains been tested on the test track and are operational?

[POMU]

Jere

  Does the  D51 have plastic gears?  Even if it is considered NOS (new, old stock) the early versions of the D51 with plastic gears have been known for the gears to crack, break, and cease running as soon as you apply power to them.  Unfortunately there is no replacement for them.  Plaza Japan on ebay is selling replacement drive mechanisms with metal gears for the D51 from Kato which is rare for Kato to produce replacement drives, so they realize a problem.

POMU
 

[Guest Closed Account 1]

When you hold it in your hand upside down and touch a 9v battery across the driver wheels, what does it do?

 

You may have to take off the shell and hand turn the motor to get the lubricant spread out. I guessing that it was on the shelf a while.

 

When it has a short then there is no change in voltage across the axles to each wheel. When you have an open then, you will find 0 volts (no potential).

Edited July 14, 2015 by Webskipper

[upwpfan]

Folks

 

This a a plastic geared engine. Test track is fine, I checked it with my volt ohm meter with engine off track. When engine is placed on track and power applied I get no voltage shown on the meter when meter probes applied to the track. Increasing the power causes my power pack circuit breaker to trip.

I am wondering if the cracked gear issue is the problem. Since this would bind the motor.

I also need to do a check across the wheel sets as well. If I checked with volt ohm meter across the wheel sets what am I looking for on the meter for a short vs bound gears. I appreciate I every one's help and effort here. It's a great looking engine and I find it really discouaging that Kato does not stand behind there products.....even if I bought it outside the country and it is NOS...

 

Regards

 

Jere Ingram

[kvp]

Short is 0 ohms, bound is at least 10 ohms but usually more.

[upwpfan]

kvp..

 

Please pardon my ignorance of things electrical in this digital world...but do I need to apply a voltage across the wheels while measuring the resistance? ( very sheepish look...wondering why his higher education was so poor in this area)

 

Regards

 

Jere Ingram

[cteno4]

Jere,

 

No, your meter will supply a small current to the probes to measure the resistance in the circuit you apply it to. You want to measure the resistance while no external power is used.

 

Cheers

 

Jeff

[marknewton]

Jere, can I just cofirm with you that it's an HO scale D51 you're having problems with?

 

Cheers,

 

Mark.

[Kiha_120]

Folks

Recently purchased a new (not previously owned) Kato D51 here in the U.S. The fiirst one that I received did not work when placed on a DC track. The best that I could tell was that it has a short some where in it. I returned it to my vendor (MB Klein) and they shipped me a replacement. I got it on test track to day and it did not work either.....

Here are my questions..BTW I can not read their instructions since I do not read Japanese.

 

1. Any body venture a guess what is wrong and what the fix is?

 

2. Can I return it to Kato in Japan and ask them to fix and return under warrenty? Where do I send it and would a letter in English be understood?

 

3. On their instruction sheet they show a diagram that suggests that you place a small plastic screw driver thingy into the smoke stack and turn it on or off....does this have any thing to do with my problem?

 

Any help would be most appreciated. I really like the detail and the look of this steam engine but a non working one does me no good...

 

Regards

 

Jere Ingram

 

I owe an apology here ! I mistook your loco for a DD 51 (which is a centre cab diesel ).

Should have realised when you said 'smoke stack', but being English I also mistook the terminology.

Smokestacks are known as chimneys here.

What threw me was failing to see the single 'D' prefix.

 

Whatever , here's hoping you get your problematic loco sorted out to your satisfaction

Edited July 17, 2015 by Kiha_120

[upwpfan]

Folks

 

D51 is HO SCALE, test track was operational and in good shape with current to both rails, locomotive was properly seated on rail...I actually used my Kato rerailer to place the loco on the track. I got the volt ohm out last night and checked resistance across both wheel sets. Resistance was around 4 K ohm. I also inspected the gears as best I could from the bottom and determined that they are plastic.(or they look like plastic could be nylon) I did not see any thing that looked like a crack or break in the bottom gears.

I have contacted vendor about another return and waiting for a reply. Other than that I am stumped. I really like this engine and wish there was a way to get it fixed and operational...however if I can't fix it, it goes back.

 

Regards

 

Jere Ingram

[mrp]

​It’s quite a coincidence for both units to have the same DOA problem.  Out of interest, did you test them both with the same power pack?  What type of power pack are you using?

[kvp]

4 Kohm is a bit too high as it wouldn't allow enough current to light a led, while 4 ohm would be a bit too low meaning a possible short somewhere in the locomotive. (4 ohm would trip the overcurrent of your transformer around 3A when pushed up to 12V)

 

ps: Are you sure you didn't get the same locomotive returned to you? The same electrical error in two locomotives seems a bit strange.

[marknewton]

G'day Jere,

 

I have four of these models, all bought used/2nd hand, and all of them run beautifully. But there are a number of possibilities that might be causing your problems. Be warned, though - dismantling these models is not easy. 

 

 

When I get home tomorrow I will post another photo and some suggestions. In the meantime I can confirm that the switch under the smokestack turns the headlight on or off.

 

Cheers,

 

Mark.

Edited July 16, 2015 by marknewton

[upwpfan]

Folks

 

I appreciate all of the help on this issue. The same power pack used for all tests. It an MRC unit. The second engine was different than the first. It looks like a a bear to dissemble the engine based on Mark' photo. MB Klein has offered a full refund including shipping if I return it. At this point I think I will do that. I will look for another product to replace it...as a matter of fact I have Tenshodo 2-8-2 that I need to work and get running....he sighs, shakes his head and walks off into the sunset....so many trains so little time..

[marknewton]