Automated Scenes on a layout

[Bernard]

I've seen this before and I couldn't believe the creativity and design work this modeler did!

Enjoy the links:

 

http://www.scenicedandundecided.net/animation.htm

[Martijn Meerts]

Animated scenes are real nice, if done well ;)

 

I've read some articles about it, and more often than not people will animate things that don't make sense to animate. I mean, the idea of animating something, is to make it more lifelike, however, would a bulldozer be moving back and forth 24/7? Would a lawnmower mow the lawn day in and day out? What reason is there for a car to be jacked up and down continuosly, etc. etc.

 

Things like spinning roof vents, animated neon lights, lit store signs, spinning signs etc. all make sense however.

[serenityFan]

The one with truck and buses moving along the streets looks cool... I've seen something like that once before at an expo, however I never figured out how they do that. Could anyone fill me in?

 

-Andy

[Martijn Meerts]

The one with truck and buses moving along the streets looks cool... I've seen something like that once before at an expo, however I never figured out how they do that. Could anyone fill me in?

 

-Andy

 

Faller car system.

 

In short, there's a wire running below the road, and the trucks/busses have little magnets at the center of the front axle. The magnet follows the wire. Rear wheels are driven by a tiny battery driven engine.

[cteno4]

Rick Spano is the master of animation. his stuff is fantastic. always hoped in retirement i could make stuff like that!

 

BTW the faller bus system is very cool. i have one and have played with what you can do with it. i was able to get it down to about 5.5" diameter turns. also the shell pops right off and most tomytec bus shells can fit right over them. with a little carving a number of trucks could also be fit over the bus system chassis. you could even place a dummy set of wheels if you wanted two rear axles.

 

they also sell a tractor trailer, but its a triple axle system that looks too european.

 

they also sell a smaller truck version that some of the medium tomytec trucks could be adapted to.

 

they also have a small magnetic reed on/off switch in the chassis so if they go over a magnetized spot (you put a small electromagnet under the road where you want it to stop) you can have the vehicle stop and then start again once you turn the em off.

 

very fun except it does mean that you have to have an open road for it to run on, no other cars! so for a lot of japanese roads this would look pretty odd. that is one of the complaints of doing any animation is that it makes the rest of the scene look too static to just have one thing moving. vicious slope there to deal with knoodling on!

 

cheers,

 

jeff

[scott]

would a bulldozer be moving back and forth 24/7?

 

There's something really creepy about model people and animals endlessly repeating the same motions. Machines don't bother me as much, except that as Martijn says, sometimes they don't make a lot of sense.

[cteno4]

Animation of layouts (other than the trains) always brings up this debate of if it adds or if it creates more problems with only a bit of the scene animating. also, like you said, creeps some folks out!

 

Layouts are odd in that the trains run, but the rest of the scene is frozen in time. this really annoys some folks to no end. if the scene is frozen they they think the trains should be too, turning the whole thing into a diorama.

 

others love the idea of animating as much as possible to make things much more life like. but you can get around the repetition and only limited things you can animate so you always have part of the scene static and part animate.

 

Personally i love animation and i thing in general it just gets viewers more involved with the scene and looking at it closer and thinking about the whole scene. once you have them really taking it all in and starting to think it can fire up their imagination and then the scene comes alive in their heads and you cant beat that animation! A really well done static scene strives to do this with the detail and set up of the scene. they usually have some interesting features which catch your eye and draw the viewer in. then the detail and story the details tell is spun into the viewer's head and hopefully their imagination takes over and they start to see the scene 'come alive'!

 

again i see animated elements of a scene just being the things that draw your eye to parts of the scene, but they have to be supported by the details in the rest of the surrounding scene that then really deliver the whole story to spark the animation of the whole scene in the viewer's imagination. if the animation is not supported by a good 'story' in the surrounding scene then the endlessly repeating nature of the animation comes through and thats the only thing the viewer will remember.

 

I have seen exhibits that use animation or static only scene really successfully and its amazing when they do! both can work well if done right!

 

case in point -- the faller car system is really fun, but the problem i see with it is that its hard to create a nice scene around it as the lane has to be clear for your one (or a few) running vehicles and thus you end up with an empty road way. there are some situations where thats fine (like the ski lodge scene where the road would probably not have a lot of traffic)

 

 

but on a japanese town or city street you would need the scene packed with cars and trucks to be prototypical. i have been thinking about using mine is a hill scene with a mountain road that goes in and out of tunnels. these roads could be realistically less traveled and i think having the bus appear and disappear some would heighten the effect.

 

here are some examples of the scenes where the faller car system makes the rest of the street pretty vacant event though the automation is really complex and realistic. here you end up just remembering the cars running around, but i dont think the whole scene is remebered well and requires little of the viewers imagination.

 

 

I think the goal is to have the over all layout have a nice ongoing over all story as well as interlocking mini stories that keep the viewer moving along the layout and not get stuck on any parts that maybe looping animations or totally static. sparking the viewer's imagination well is the real trick as this will give you the best effect or making the scene come alive for the viewer and also set it really firmly and pleasantly in their memory!

 

cheers,

 

jeff

[Mudkip Orange]

I have this weird idea that a train layout is for trains and everything that isn't a train is just a supporting backdrop for the trains.

[cteno4]

I have this weird idea that a train layout is for trains and everything that isn't a train is just a supporting backdrop for the trains.

 

Not weird at all, lots of folks feel that way! i have seen both camps go round and round and round in discussion as to what is the best thing to do. Frankly i think its just a matter of personal taste. Similar to the rivet counter vs non prototypical debates, prototypical layout vs creative, etc. I think the important thing is to do what you find fun!

 

cheers,

 

jeff

[Sushi Train]

I have this weird idea that a train layout is for trains and everything that isn't a train is just a supporting backdrop for the trains.

 

im with you, mine will be in a rural setting where the emphasis is on the trains, something similar to these.....

[Bernard]

I agree with Jeff. It really is a personal opinion and the most important thing is to have fun. Having said that, every year at the Co-op center in NYC right after Thanksgiving till New Years Day, there is a huge train layout set up. They run everything from O sale to HO, but they also have some animated scenes, people raising a wall for a house, a tractor digging a hole, man fishing and casting his line, a drive in Movie Theater, etc.

But these animated scenes are also very popular with the crowds, they watch them as much as they watch the trains.

[scott]

I still think endless repetition is creepy.  ;)

 

But I like the layout on the yellow table that Sashimi Tram posted--the inner figure-8 helps with some ideas I had for our point-to-point line.

[cteno4]

I still think endless repetition is creepy.  ;)

 

Funny you should say this as a lot of the folks in the non animation camp usually have the same reaction of it being creepy or strange feeling. I have seen the same reaction by some folks in exhibits with anything that is mechanical human/animal moving or even audio at times. It must be some loop in some folks heads that trips a 'something not right with this picture' trigger as it seems like one of those very gut reactions. Sorry, being in the exhibits biz im always looking at the visitors monkey reactions to things as they are usually things that you cannot change and just have to deal with. some are pretty universal, while others strike a portion of your audience and make you have to look at what your goals are to do or not do something then when it might affect an important part of your audience adversely. Culture, age, history, setting, etc are all variables that tend to modify this some so its always a challenge to see what you are up against. funny i have not seen any correlations with other things with the creepy animation reaction, its a curious one.

 

in model rr like this i do think its important to do what strikes your fancy the most as you are the most important audience (if you are not happy with it you wont do your layout!).

 

With the animation when you go public, as bernard pointed out, animated elements become really strong as usually they do really grab a lot of eyeballs and tend to be the thing the person remembers vividly. Hopefully the public visitor is there short enough for the repetition to not creep them out too much if they are in that camp. Having some vivid points is really important as those are the things that will let the visitor trip the memory cascade of the experience with you. Once they bring back the really vivid things the more subtle memories usually come back with them. the big trick is to work on connecting all the vivid and subtle things up well with a good story line (in this case visual and spacial) so that once they bring back one vivid memory all the rest come back in a nice succession that ends unfolding the whole story to them again. I always liken it to pearls on a string. pearls are the vivid things and the string is the story and content that links them all up and unfolds the whole, bigger picture story along with details. when it works its amazing. had folks come up to me 5 years after seeing one of my exhibits and tell me their three minute experience and the 6 choices they made and what the consequences were. in the exhibits biz thats an out of the ball park home run for recall and message impact.

 

One way if you want to make the animation less creepy is to do it in such a way that the human parts (those tend to be the creepy things doing the repetitive stuff) only fire at longer intervals. not only does it help take the repetitive nature out of it, but it also makes it a little less obvious and the visitor will get more of a tickle when they find it and then they will really look carefully at the rest of the details of the layout for more! if they are all firing at once it ends up being a competition for attention and thus distracting and dulls the visitor from looking at anything thats not moving! Also animating things that are normally repetitive in real life it also will help decrease the creepiness as it would be things we would expect to be repetitive (and also may be able to animate easier!)

 

Personally i do like some animation, but its something that has to be done carefully or it will cause your problems like creeping out folks, taking attention away from other static details, or taking away from the trains. goal is to use them in ways that focus attention on parts you want folks to look at more closely and set the scene for the trains to run through, not become the whole scene themselves. in N scale i find it hard to animate the humans due to size and its more animating the things that folks minds might start to imagine animating in a natural scene the layout is representing so that it matches it better and stimulates their imagination a little along a desired direction.

 

Its interesting there is a very parallel discussion to be had with perceived vs detailed scenery!

 

cheers,

 

jeff

[Mudkip Orange]

But these animated scenes are also very popular with the crowds, they watch them as much as they watch the trains.

That Australian guy who did the "enoshima" display layout had a mini-LCD screen mounted into the side of one of the buildings, Blade Runner style. I've thought about doing that, only it would play nothing but Rick Astley videos...

[cteno4]

But these animated scenes are also very popular with the crowds, they watch them as much as they watch the trains.

That Australian guy who did the "enoshima" display layout had a mini-LCD screen mounted into the side of one of the buildings, Blade Runner style. I've thought about doing that, only it would play nothing but Rick Astley videos...

 

The video screen is a great and simple animation that is one of those non-human examples that probably wont trip something wrong with this scene. We have had one on the JRM layout now for 4 years and its a hit. you see them everywhere in japan now, even in small towns, above station entrances, all over! the great thing is that there are a lot of little bits of electronics you can buy these days to do this sort of thing. you can start cheap for $5-10 and get one of those keychain picture players that will do a little slide show and have a series of electronic bill boards that can go in a small space on a building side or up to the full video player for the huge bill boards and you can now find these for less than $50 (sometimes cheaper).

[scott]

visitors monkey reactions

 

;D  Yeah, I've got a pretty direct connection to my brainstem....

 

nothing but Rick Astley videos...

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaa

[cteno4]

 

;D   Yeah, I've got a pretty direct connection to my brainstem....

 

 

Sorry i use monkey brain to refer to all the reflex/instinctive reactions that humans portray that usually dont seem to go into a higher brain function loop! not a great term to use probably, but it describes some of my personal reactions to things. usually gets a strange look from most folks when i use it in person...

 

jeff

 

ps wonder if rickrolling was popular in japan? i did look for lots of tacky little clips to put on the video from rock videos (got one of the train group station attendant videos) to ads to movie previews. the weirder the better! jr

[scott]

Sorry i use monkey brain to refer to all the reflex/instinctive reactions that humans portray that usually dont seem to go into a higher brain function loop! not a great term to use probably, but it describes some of my personal reactions to things. usually gets a strange look from most folks when i use it in person...

 

No, I thought it was great!

[Mudkip Orange]

wonder if rickrolling was popular in japan?

Don't know, but I did have the misfortune of clicking on this video awhile back:

[Sushi Train]

Sashimi tram

 

[scott]

Sashimi tram

 

 

:)  Just joking around.....too much caffeine that day.    :-\

[SubwayHypes]

what if you had the PsP screen only play model railroad videos!

 

 

I am trying a mix of scenic/strictly trains kind of thing.  While i want to develope a nice city, funds are gonna make my detailed section somewhat small, leaving half the layout for strictly rural or track areas.

 

I also have an underground level where i can store more trains and where scenery is non existant.

[cteno4]

thats what doug coster did after the pvr died! i dont know if he uses the psp outside the layout!

 

the cool thing is that all these video equipment is getting cheaper and cheaper these days. you can get little playback boxes with small screens for as low as $20 these days!

 

other fun ones are the little key chain picture slide show units. can make a set of different signs that will show up on a smaller sized sign on a smaller building even!

 

cheers

 

jeff

[Guest ___]

Sashimi tram

 

 

:)  Just joking around.....too much caffeine that day.    :-\

 

Mmmmm caffeine.....