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Martijn Meerts

JR-Chiisai: Storage yard modules

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Martijn Meerts

Building has finally started! :)

 

I haven't actually touched any track yet, nor are the modules done, however, I did glue a lot of cork on the baseboards. It took a bit longer than I hoped, but that was mainly because when I bought the cork (2 rolls of 8 meters of cork, 50cm wide) I also bought a bucket of special glue. I normally use regular white glue, but I've had problems with white glue when glueing large pieces of cork.

 

The special glue is normally used to glue cork to floors (used as a sound dampening layer before wooden floor boards are installed for example) or even glue cork to walls (seems a popular thing to do in Belgium, lots of instruction video's come from there :)), so it's pretty strong stuff. The way to use it was a bit strange to me, but in the end it worked out great.

 

Generally, what needs to be done is:

 

- put a thin layer of glue on the baseboards

- put a thin layer of glue on the cork

- leave it until the glue has dried (it makes no sense, I know ;))

- after the glue has dried, place the cork on the baseboard REALLY carefully and VERY accurately

- make sure the cork is flat and there are no air pockets anywhere, there is really very little room for errors here, the 2 glued surfaces stick to each other immediately, and won't let go anymore :)

 

It was a bit weird at first, but it's actually really nice stuff. The problem is that the tools used (in my case the roller) can be thrown away, because there's no way to clean them that I know off. Of course, 1 roller worth 1.5 euro or so isn't too bad for a 4.5 x 0.7 meter area :)

 

Also, the baseboard that has the 180 degree curve is currently cut to 50cm. In the new track plan, it only needs to be 40cm though. I decided to glue cork on the entire baseboard, and I'll cut off 10cm when needed. The 10x70 cm piece I'll have left will be used for testing various things with regards to laying, painting and ballasting the code 55 peco track.

 

 

The images are not very spectacular, but here are some anyway ;)

 

 

Image 012:

The tools of the trade. A roller, a plastic thing to transfer paint to the roller, and a bucket of weird-ish goo that's supposed to be able to glue cork to wood...

 

Image 013:

Looks just like white glue really. Interesting though, is that the spots that seem to have no glue are actually where the glue has dried already. It becomes entirely transparent, and when touch, there's a slight stickyness to it. It's really very much like double sided tape really...

 

Image 014:

Watching glue dry is almost as bad as watching paint dry ;) The board on the right is almost completely dry, the one on the left still has a bit to go.

 

Image 015:

A stack of "corked" baseboards. I'll cut off the excess cork once everything has settled overnight.

jrc-sy01_012-cork_tools.jpg

jrc-sy01_013-prepared_cork.jpg

jrc-sy01_014-drying_wood.jpg

jrc-sy01_015-baseboards.jpg

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cteno4

Martijn,

 

that type glue is usually called "contact cement". usually the stuff used if you are laminating layers of material together like cork, formica, wood veneer, etc. great stuff as like you said you can glue each surface let dry then set in place, push and its a really really strong bond. great for using on things that might warp with a lot of wet (water) glue on a large surface area and also no clamping! use to be only organic solvent based stuff (was quite pungent and would have you high in 3 seconds!) but now they have more water based ones that are not as smelly, but dont bond quite as well...

 

really is the easiest way to glue any large surfaces like this, but as you say make sure you have it right when the surfaces touch! not great if it does not have a large surface area though to grab on.

 

one trick to getting things lined up is to put a sheet of wax paper between the two pieces, get one edge all lined up and press it in place then pull the wax paper out a couple of inches, press that into place, and repeat.

 

cheers

 

jeff

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Martijn Meerts

Jeff, I don't think the stuff I got is water based. At least, you can't clean brushes/rollers with water after using them with the glue. There's a bit of an ammonia smell to it, nothing I'm not used to having had cats for a long time ;)

 

The good thing is of course that it doesn't have to be 100% accurate, so while everything is lined up quite nicely, there are some visible gaps here and there. With track and ballast etc. added it won't be noticeable.

 

 

 

Anyway, all cork is glued on, and I've cut off the excess bits. Next step now is to put together the module frame, so I have something to mount the base boards on. I have all the wood already, just need to cut it to length. I also need to grab me some screws because I seem to have ran out while building the frame for my father's layout :)

 

I also need to start working on adjusting all the turnouts, so they'll work (and continue to work) reliably. There are some articles up on Wiring for DCC. http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches_peco.htm#a4 is 1 way of doing it with the turnouts I'll be using for the yard. I'm not too sure about this version though, I find the gap they cut to be in a non-optimal position. The way they do it with the H0 turnout (http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches_peco.htm#a2) seems like a better option to me to be honest. On one hand, you'd say the guy running Wiring for DCC knows his stuff, but on the other hand, they way they adjust the code 55 turned is just fast, not necessarily good ;)

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cteno4

Jeff, I don't think the stuff I got is water based. At least, you can't clean brushes/rollers with water after using them with the glue. There's a bit of an ammonia smell to it, nothing I'm not used to having had cats for a long time ;)

 

Actually if it smelled more like ammonia than very very strong organic solvents then its probably the water based. You know when you use the organic solvent based stuff as the smell will knock you on your $#@ fast. really a horrible mix of nasty organic solvents that are really pungent and very volatile. getting the organic solvent based one here in the US has gotten harder and harder due to EHS rules. being water based doesnt mean it will be re-dissolved in water though as most of these have some sort of a chemical curing that happens as it dries and this sort of stuff just doesnt wash out of brushes and rollers well even when wet. I would expect with the stronger EU rules on EHS stuff that they probably dont sell the organic based stuff. I think the water based stuff is improving, the first time i used it, it was not so great, not near as tacky as the organic solvent based stuff, so i went back to the organic based stuff (had to go over to virginia to buy it and sneak it across state lines!!!), but when that ran out i tried a new can of the water based stuff and it worked ok.

 

anyhow contact cement is a really great way to laminate stuff together like this. I did a lot of it in the shop when i was a kid with veneers and large cibachrome prints. that and fiber-glassing probably destroyed a good fraction of my brain cells with all the organic fumes!

 

cheers

 

jeff

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Martijn Meerts
I did a lot of it in the shop when i was a kid with veneers and large cibachrome prints. that and fiber-glassing probably destroyed a good fraction of my brain cells with all the organic fumes!

 

Well, in the end that turned out good, because the space made available from destroying the brain cells got put to good use by Tomytec ;)

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cteno4

LOL, some room for the bug, love it!

 

cheers,

 

ps beer in grad school did the rest of em in!

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Martijn Meerts

Progress! =)

 

I spent the evening measuring, cutting, measuring more, cutting some more, and then soldering a bit as well. I also spent some time driving to Germany to pick up a reverse loop module as well as 2 occupancy detectors (both in building kit form from Littfinski.)

 

 

Image 016:

A quick mockup of the module. This is actually the smallest of the 4. It's 40 x 70cm, although the picture makes it look quite a bit bigger. I guess that's mainly because I used 15mm wood ;) The triangles aren't supposed to go where they are now, it's just to check everything.

 

Image 017:

These bits will go all around the module and are the base for the baseboard to be glued/screwed on. With the longer modules it'll also add some stability to the entire module, but in this case it's really only to support the baseboard. (I decided to sink the baseboard into the outer walls of the modules rather than put it all on top.)

 

Image 018:

Wired up what has now become my experimentation turnout. It's a Peco code55 electrofrog, so it needed some adjusting for DCC. I have a red and blue wire connected to the stock rails as well as the closure rails. Another red and blue are connected to the point rails, and the purple one is connected to the frog rails. I also cut the closure rails just to the left of the frog.

 

There are easier/quicker ways of doing this, but having some experience with turnouts on my father's layout, I wanted to make sure the ones on the Japanese layout will have power on the entire turnout at anytime. There's nothing quite as annoying as trains stalling on a turnout due to bad power connections.

 

Image 019:

Bottom of the turnout, here it's easy to see that the stock rail and closure rail are connected using 1 wire. The wires that power the point rails are soldered to little tabs that usually only hold the point rails in place. However, since the point rails hardly move around that part of the turnout, the tabs seemed like a perfect candidate for some soldering. The purple wire connects the 2 frog rails, which is really not necessary, but then again, it only took an additional 5 seconds.

 

Eventually, red and blue will just be connected to power directly, whereas the purple one will be connected to a relay, which is controlled by a servo decoder.

jrc-sy01_016-sides_mockup.jpg

jrc-sy01_017-inner_frame.jpg

jrc-sy01_018-wired_turnout.jpg

jrc-sy01_019-wired_turnout_bottom.jpg

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Martijn Meerts

Right, so the whole soldering wires to the little point rail tabs was only theoretically a good idea. In practice, it's difficult to get the holes for the wires to go through lined up with the turnout. Because the point rails have some play length-wise, not having the holes line up exactly right, it can cause the point rails to move, and cause derailing on the turnout.

 

So, I'll need to try the backup solution of soldering the wires directly to the point rails, as close to the hinge point as possible.

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Darklighter

I also spent some time driving to Germany to pick up a reverse loop module as well as 2 occupancy detectors (both in building kit form from Littfinski.)

 

The Dutch imports German occupancy detector kits, while the German imports Dutch ones.  :grin

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Martijn Meerts

I also spent some time driving to Germany to pick up a reverse loop module as well as 2 occupancy detectors (both in building kit form from Littfinski.)

 

The Dutch imports German occupancy detector kits, while the German imports Dutch ones.  :grin

 

Which ones did you buy? I quite like the Littfinski stuff, because you can get it as building kit (which is not only cheaper, but also gives me more soldering practice ;)) and because they have plastic shells to go around their components, which is rather nice.. I don't like leaving electronics exposed.

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Darklighter

Which ones did you buy? I quite like the Littfinski stuff, because you can get it as building kit (which is not only cheaper, but also gives me more soldering practice ;)) and because they have plastic shells to go around their components, which is rather nice.. I don't like leaving electronics exposed.

 

I'm going to use MGV Loconet units (http://wiki.rocrail.net/doku.php?id=mgv-overview-en). Thus, I bought some printed circuit boards for MGV93 (current detector), MGV50 (LocoNet in/output) and MGV85 (interface between PC and LocoNet).

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Martijn Meerts

Which ones did you buy? I quite like the Littfinski stuff, because you can get it as building kit (which is not only cheaper, but also gives me more soldering practice ;)) and because they have plastic shells to go around their components, which is rather nice.. I don't like leaving electronics exposed.

 

I'm going to use MGV Loconet units (http://wiki.rocrail.net/doku.php?id=mgv-overview-en). Thus, I bought some printed circuit boards for MGV93 (current detector), MGV50 (LocoNet in/output) and MGV85 (interface between PC and LocoNet).

 

Ah right.. I've actually talked to the guy a couple of times, visited the club as well (I live in Venlo, so it's rather nearby ;)) They do some nice stuff, but they have no interest in either N-scale or 0-scale, so I hardly ever go there.

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ShinCanadaSen

So Martijn,

 

Did you ever finish the Storage Yard?

 

Just curious what it looks like :)

 

Kai

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Martijn Meerts

I'm still gathering all the materials for it (mainly turnouts :)) ..

 

Other than that, I bought a house recently, so pretty much everything model train related is put on hold until after I've moved and settled in (moving around October probably). After that I'll have more space for a layout, as well as a garage which will function as a small workshop.

 

I'll definitely finish the yard though once I get the time for it ;)

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Martijn Meerts

So, moving to the new house is complete (minus the unpacking and sorting of lots of stuff :)) , so soon it's time to continue with the storage yard. I've had the wood for the frames for quite a while, but lacked a decent saw to get good, straight cuts, as well as accurate mitre cuts. So I went and ordered http://www.metabo.com/Product-catalogue-halfstationary-and-stationary-tools.24047+M56912c2c10c.0.html which should help a ton.

 

 

The module frames (or, section frames really) will be slightly altered from the design sketch somewhere earlier in the thread, because I've also adjusted the design of the legs. More info on that soon-ish I hope.

 

While waiting for the saw to arrive, I'll have to go through all the boxes though, as I can't seem to find the 20 or-so turnouts I'd already bought for the yard. I did get an idea of the tracks though. I had 22 pieces of flex track, and the yard will be a total of 22 tracks.. Seeing them all next to each other .. Well, once they're full length and filled with trains, it should look pretty impressive... (for as long as it lasts, considering it's a hidden yard  :grin )

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KenS

Nice saw.  I have a simpler one (no sliding, so it's limited to smaller boards). It's definitely very handy to have something like that if you're building a box or frame structure, rather than something like L-girder supports.

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Martijn Meerts

I thought about a non-sliding one, since they're considerably cheaper. In the end I figured I'd rather spent a little extra and get a sliding version so I have some more margin to work with. The sidewalls of the frame are 10cm, and quite a few of the non-sliding saws only went up to around 8cm. Anything wider meant a larger, more expensive saw, with larger (and a lot more expensive) saw blades ..

 

 

As for the turnouts, I finally found all of them. Didn't have as many as I thought I did, but enough to make a start once the module frames are put together. I need another 16 or so turnouts to finish the yard, and quite a few more lengths of flex track :)

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cteno4

the sliding framing mitre boxes are really nice. better than a table saw for doing complex cuts actually and great to do multiple cuts of the exact same sized easily. you can do most stuff you would do cross cutting on a table saw with them, just cant rip with them. also not as great to do dado cuts as a table saw, but you can usually set the vertical stop and do them with multiple cuts.

 

if it doesnt have a laser on it, pick up a cheap laser flange (bout $25). it replaces the outer flange and shoots a light down the blade to show you where the cut will be. great for safety (red on your hand bad) and much faster to get things aligned as you can get it close with the laser and then do a fast eyeball with the blade down instead of trying to guess the first spot of your material.

 

im getting my dad's nice big one next spring when they move east and he shuts down the last of his shop...

 

jeff

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Martijn Meerts

It does have a laser, but I've read that on the cheaper models, the laser often isn't aligned quite right. I don't tend to use a laser though, my jigsaw has one as well, but it wasn't completely straight, and it actually was more annoying than helpful for most cuts. I removed the whole thing so now I have a better view of where I'm cutting ;)

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cteno4

yeah on most saws the laser is a mess, but on the chop saw its nice as it gets you to w.in a mm or two to then line up with the eyeball and the blade teeth. much faster and i like on the chop saw having the red line. jig, band, scroll saws, you probably are not going to cut a finger off unless you are being really reckless and the blade is right at the cut as your cutting so no problem. chap saws you gotta bend over and look at it under the guard so a bit harder to get perfect on the cut if you need to do lots of movement.

 

jeff

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KenS

My miter saw pre-dates the laser-equipped tool era, and getting the cut in the right place is one of the biggest problems I have with it.  Maybe I should consider getting one of those (just what I need, another bulky tool...  :grin ).

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cteno4

all the laser really does is get your mark close to where it should go for your fine placement. for that you still need to bend over and carefully put the blade down onto your stock to see where the teeth meet up with your stock and do the fine scale move. pain in the arse with the guards normally on mitre saws. ive gotten good at backing the guard off with my thumb so i can see better, but light usually sucks (should put a cheap swing arm lamp behind this saw). this does not change much with a sliding miter saw except you can move the blade to where your mark is on your stock easier. you can hang these sliding chop saws on the wall when not in use! the are more spread out than a regular chop saw. you can also get a laser for an older saw, they usually replace the outer blade bushing.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Oshlun-LG-M01-Miter-Portable-Laser/dp/B002PMV4UG/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1320857532&sr=8-2

http://www.amazon.com/Irwin-Industrial-Tools-3061001-Miter/dp/B0009XYN4M/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1320857567&sr=8-1

http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2005467/16149/Laser-Guide-For-Miter-Saws.aspx

 

bummer with these is you need to have the saw on to see the line so you need to give the saw a burst to see the line then wait for it to stop to do your fine adjustment... the newer integrated lasers are such you can turn on w/o the blade turning. but the spinning laser does the safety trick of putting that red line where if a finger is there you will get even more red...

 

so much easier on a table saw, especially if you throw a straight edge across the blade and stock! but for cross cuts of stuff over 1' long on larger stock i usually find its easier to do on the chop saw. longer stuff runs the risk of moving on the sliding fence while cutting on a table saw. a sled on the table saw does help, but mine is a monster and not easy to move around so only dig it out on larger projects...

 

cheers

 

jeff

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Martijn Meerts

I believe the one I've got on order has a light built in as well. (It's a German brand, they're good at adding useful little things to make work easier :))

 

Once I get it, I'll post about how it all works.

 

...

 

.. If I can still type ;)

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Martijn Meerts

Finally some stuff got done :)

 

I don't have any pictures yet, will try to shoot some soon. The saw got delayed several times, but eventually I go it just before christmas. Didn't get around to doing much with it due to absolutely crappy weather though.

 

Anyway, 3 out of 4 module/section boxes are now done. They need some slight adjustment to make some things fit better, it seems that even at the local hardware store they can't saw straight cuts :)

 

Ordered the rest of the necessary turnouts as well as a whole bunch of flex track, not sure when that'll arrive though. The store said they had it all in stock, but might not be able to send it because they're preparing for the large toy fair in Nuernberg (I think) which is this weekend. Gives me some time to finish the 4th module box though, and then sand the cork layer down slightly to make it less rough, as well as paint the bit where the track will be black.

 

Even though the yard will be hidden, I'm going to ballast (and probably detail) the whole thing, partially for practice, and partially because I want it to be scenic'ed so I can take it to shows should I want to. Before I can start ballasting though, I need to adjust and wire all turnouts for looks and optimal running, which means cutting away some bits, adding some bits and soldering a total of 5 feeder wires per turnout, as well as isolating the frog. Not all of that is necessary, but I want them to be as reliable as possible, because replacing them isn't going to be easy :)

 

Also need to figure out exactly how to divide some of the tracks, as I want some tracks to be able to hold multiple shorter trains.

 

This whole thing is definitely still a long way off from being done, which sucks, because I want to fill it with trains =)

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Densha

The store said they had it all in stock, but might not be able to send it because they're preparing for the large toy fair in Nuernberg (I think) which is this weekend.

Perhaps ordered at MTE? :grin

 

This whole thing is definitely still a long way off from being done, which sucks, because I want to fill it with trains =)

I'm looking forward to that too! :cheesy

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