Platform edge doors.

[ben_issacs]

Folks, 

We've all stood on a Shinkansen platform with platform edge doors, and watch the train glide in and stop just at the right point so that the train doors and the platform doors align, and then both doors open, and people start to move.

But, is the alignment done by the skill of the driver. or is there some sort of electronic doohickey that takes over the control of the train at the last stage of its approach?

The same thoughts apply on the ordinary stations that have these doors.

I assume on departure that the platform doors are opened by the platform staff after the train clears the platform.

I ask this question because during last weekend there was a trial in  Sydney of their newly opened subby line, which has these doors, plus 'driverless' operation, and there were problems with the early runs with the trains not aligning with the platform doors and having to back up, and some doors not opening.

All comments welcome.

Regards, 

Bill, 

Melbourne.

 

[railsquid]

I'm not aware of seeing anything special; the trains have very precise stop positions anyway as they need to line up with the door markings on the platform, regardless of whether there are doors or not. I recall being on at least one train which had to back up due to a slight overrun not long after the platform doors were introduced.

 

IIRC the doors are controlled from the train, by the guard or with driver-only operation (e.g. in Tokyo Marunouchi  and Oedo lines) the driver.

[Ochanomizu]

Hello,

 

Proper training, proper pay and drivers doing a proper job.  It is all skill.  I have seen, rarely, a train overshoot the alignment by 2 or 3 feet.  They reverse back before the doors open.  

[bikkuri bahn]

On lines with ATS and ATC (including the shinkansen), it is the driver's skill with the brakes which aligns the doors with the appropriate platform position.  On ATO equipped trains (some subways and Automated Guideway Systems), it is the software that does it.  

[EdF]

The doors are only open when the train is present, the don't open after the train departs.

[JR 500系]

Densha de go comes into mind... 

 

 

 

Which reminds me of the tough training all the drivers go through.. and that is something that is so easily taken for granted... 

[Socimi]

3 hours ago, JR 500系 said:

Densha de go comes into mind... 

 

 

 

Densha de GO! Final is actually the closest thing to actual driver's work, as it uses realistic schedules (except for the super-hard levels, such as the Tokaido Line 221 series in the video above) and actual stopping tolerances (depending on the company, but ranges between +/- 5m and 3m).

 

Stopping to a precise point is actually simple if such point is well marked and drivers well instructed (JR drivers are trained to stop the train when their shoulders are aligned to the stopping sign).

 

Of course, platform doors do have tolerances, in fact, most are about a meter wider than the train's doors.

At shinkansen stations, the platform doors are almost five meters wide, even if shinkansen doors are relatively smaller.

 

Some companies running dense commuter networks with lots of stops but no full ATO coverage have started to implement what is called "TASC" (Train Automatic Stopping Controller), wich works like an ATO system, but only when stopping at stations.

Edited May 28, 2019 by Socimi

[ben_issacs]

Thanks, folks,

Much useful information.

Regards, 

Bill, 

Melbourne.

[marknewton]

Bill,

 

Last Sunday wasn’t a trial of the “metro”, it was the opening day for the public. I worked a train through Chatswood late on Saturday afternoon, and watched a metro train roar in to the platform and overshoot by about half a car length. It was full of technicians who spent the next two or three minutes trying to get the thing to line up with the platform screens and open the doors. They hadn’t succeeded by the time I left, so it didn’t inspire much confidence...

 

Cheers,

 

Mark.

[disturbman]

Surprised to hear this, Paris subway started experimenting with autopilot systems in the 1950s and most of the lines got equipped in the 1970s. This autopilot allowed trains to have a stopping tolerance of about 2m. I would have thought that modern infrastructure equipped with platform screen doors would have had a form of automation too to avoid misalignments.

 

Link in French: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilotage_automatique_du_métro_de_Paris

[Socimi]

Analogue systems where signal are transmitted by rails (Paris and Budapest have additional "code" inductive rails, Milan's Metro Line 3 uses the running rails themselves) are  often more reliable than digital radio-transmitted systems as they're less subject to electromagnetic interferences, weather change and other obstructions.

 

Analogue ATO is therefore safer, while providing similar (and sometimes higher) capacity and operating speed, but it's installation is quite expensive and it has a lot of wayside and system maintainance to be done, compared to the digital ATO+CBTC mix used in most metros wich uses only a series of maintainance-less radio transpoders mounted on the sides of the tunnel.

 

the D-ATC used in Japan is an hybrid of both, using converted analogue ATC infrastructure conveying digital signals.

 

 

[ben_issacs]

Mark,

Thanks for your comments, you are in the position of actually seeing this  stuff working, or not!

But, again, who shuts the platform doors before the train departs?

Platform staff or the 'non-existent' driver?

I'm thinking, what happens if someone with a pusher or in a wheel chair is trying to get in, and the doors, either platfrom or car, shut on the pusher, what happens then?

If something hits the sensitive edge, do the doors spring open, and then re-close after a short time interval, sufficient to allow the obstruction to have been withdrawn?

Regards, 

Bill, 

Melbourne.

 

 

[EdF]

They are interlocked with the train, and operate the same.  They'll have anti pinch, like the train, and they'll close when the train doors do.  Either automation or a conductor triggers the doors.